[Tim-in-CA]

Refund is issued by the dealer.

Yep ... I went ROUND and ROUND with the dealer and Cadillac. I managed to get two Debut Edition preorders during the ordering disaster on day one. I only needed one and when I tried to call the dealer to get my $100 back, they kept telling me to go back to Cadillac. After a few days of going round and round, I simply did a charge back with BofA. Took a little more time, but I got my $100 back and let BofA fight it out with the dealer.

 

[seattlite]

Deposit has nothing to do with ultimate pricing, however also here in the PNW, all 3 dealers I talked to are doing markups or added goods and services packages which is the reason I did not order a LYRIQ yet.

I'm in PNW, Western WA and I didn't even want to deal with PNW, WA/OR dealers and went straight to Lockhart Caddy. Yeah... I'll be spending monies on either a road trip pickup or delivery... But prob less than the dealer markups, and road trip seems like a fun adventure. I prob have another year to decide on what I'm gonna do for pick up or delivery.

 

[LYRIQlurker]

I'm in PNW, Western WA and I didn't even want to deal with PNW, WA/OR dealers and went straight to Lockhart Caddy. Yeah... I'll be spending monies on either a road trip pickup or delivery... But prob less than the dealer markups, and road trip seems like a fun adventure. I prob have another year to decide on what I'm gonna do for pick up or delivery.

Smart Guy, but we should not have to go out of our area to get a fair deal on a car. But a year to wait? If you order today you will likely have your car in a year.

 

[TyeTye]

I'm in PNW, Western WA and I didn't even want to deal with PNW, WA/OR dealers and went straight to Lockhart Caddy. Yeah... I'll be spending monies on either a road trip pickup or delivery... But prob less than the dealer markups, and road trip seems like a fun adventure. I prob have another year to decide on what I'm gonna do for pick up or delivery.

I’m in the same boat. Will fly out to the car dealership and take a nice 6 hour drive to get back home

 

[Blastphemy]

I feel somewhat misled and uninformed by GM. These debut editions were supposed to be delivered late spring and early summer. To my knowledge the number of deliveries to date: zero. Further I have checked with the factory and they are still at 7 per day. They have made no more 350 saleable Lyriqs in total. Someone on here tried to calculate 700+ a few weeks ago but that is wishful thinking... I was tired of receiving no information from Cadillac a month or more ago. So I ordered a Tesla Model X plaid and took delivery last week. While it’s more than twice the price of the Lyriq, it’s amazing... I’m a big GM fan but this transition to electric has been brutal for them. Hummer is even worse. After 7 months they are only making 12 a day. Meanwhile Tesla is making 4,000 cars a day.

2,600 cars a day and Tesla still can't get the fit and finish correct... Only 1500 or so cars they have to produce for the Debut Editions. Don't see any issues hitting those numbers.

When Cadillac is producing/delivering 1,500 Lyriqs per day in the U.S., let me know. Until then, complaining that some Teslas are delivered with minor issues (which the service centers can usually resolve quickly) when Cadillac isn't delivering any EVs seems a bit disingenuous. If Cadillac can't get these cars into customer's hands soon, then others will follow @HigherFlier's lead. In fact, my wife just put down a reservation for a Rivian RS1 rather than take a chance on the Lyriq. I still have my 2024 reservation, but it's contingent on Cadillac delivering the car it promised instead of the regressed Debut Edition and 2023 models it had to settle for.

The problem isn't that Cadillac hasn't delivered the Lyriq yet; the problem is that Cadillac promised the Lyriq 9 months earlier than originally planned, and it's not accomplishing that magical wishful thinking, so everyone who was willing to wait until the end of the year now expects delivery immediately. This is Cadillac shooting itself in the foot. Some suit overrode an engineer's recommendation, and this silent chaos is the result. I've owned Cadillacs all my life, and I'm willing to forgive the ELR and CT6 if Cadillac knocks the Lyriq out of the park; but as every day goes by, I see the same depressing pattern unfolding, so I'm not optimistic.

 

[LYRIQlurker]

When Cadillac is producing/delivering 1,500 Lyriqs per day in the U.S., let me know. Until then, complaining that some Teslas are delivered with minor issues (which the service centers can usually resolve quickly) when Cadillac isn't delivering any EVs seems a bit disingenuous. If Cadillac can't get these cars into customer's hands soon, then others will follow @HigherFlier's lead. In fact, my wife just put down a reservation for a Rivian RS1 rather than take a chance on the Lyriq. I still have my 2024 reservation, but it's contingent on Cadillac delivering the car it promised instead of the regressed Debut Edition and 2023 models it had to settle for.

The problem isn't that Cadillac hasn't delivered the Lyriq yet; the problem is that Cadillac promised the Lyriq 9 months earlier than originally planned, and it's not accomplishing that magical wishful thinking, so everyone who was willing to wait until the end of the year now expects delivery immediately. This is Cadillac shooting itself in the foot. Some suit overrode an engineer's recommendation, and this silent chaos is the result. I've owned Cadillacs all my life, and I'm willing to forgive the ELR and CT6 if Cadillac knocks the Lyriq out of the park; but as every day goes by, I see the same depressing pattern unfolding, so I'm not optimistic.

Total troll comment, In the USA so far this year Tesla has sold about 108K model Y, or 571 per day (Troy Teslike USA delivery estimate) GM has sold about 6200 cars per day in the USA so far this year. GM's pickup truck plant in Ft Wayne Indiana makes 1300+ trucks a day for comparison. Tesla should be able to have better quality control, Tesla cars are simple, and they keep line options to a minimum, just batch building.

When GM took reservations for Launch Edition LYRIQ's they officially said "initial availability 1st half of 2022", so ya, they are 2 weeks late delivering the first cars... Where is Cybertruck Tesla showed in 2019, and promised by 2021, how about Roadster Tesla showed in 2017, and promised deliveries in 2020, and how about the Tesla Semi, showed in 2017, and said they would start using internally in 2019, and customer deliveries in 2020? How about Full Self Driving Tesla said would make a driverless cross country trip in 2017, and 1 million robotaxi by 2020, "with no driver in the car" Elon said.

When GM originally showed the LYRIQ concept in 2019 they said "production" would start "LATE 2022" Production actually started the 3rd week of March 2022, the 9 month pull ahead was not far off?

 

[Realist]

Well said!!! I can only comment…you are not obligated to purchase… so… to stay in the guidelines of the forum….pack up and move on!!!!

 

[Guppydriver]

I'm in PNW, Western WA and I didn't even want to deal with PNW, WA/OR dealers and went straight to Lockhart Caddy. Yeah... I'll be spending monies on either a road trip pickup or delivery... But prob less than the dealer markups, and road trip seems like a fun adventure. I prob have another year to decide on what I'm gonna do for pick up or delivery.

Knowing Lockhart is in Indiana, the first thing I honestly thought was ; "Holy sh!t, with gas prices what they are you are going to spend a fortune driving that back to the PNW".

23 years married to a natural blonde and the transformation is complete.

 

[LYRIQlurker]

Knowing Lockhart is in Indiana, the first thing I honestly thought was ; "Holy sh!t, with gas prices what they are you are going to spend a fortune driving that back to the PNW".

23 years married to a natural blonde and the transformation is complete.

That trip in the winter time might be quite an adventure, but there are lots of chargers on the way.

 

[Guppydriver]

I have no issue with time line TBH. I am still waiting for a F-150 Lariat I ordered in December last year. An ICE Lariat not Lightning, the most popular vehicle in America that Ford has been building since the civil war.

I am as frustrated with the industry as anyone, but these supply issues are real and nobody wants them remedied quicker than the automakers themselves. Do I think it's time they start looking at the pattern and being more conservative with estimates? Sure, but until everyone starts doing it , no one will start doing it.

My concern and apprehension with my early Lyriq order is 99% about de-contenting. Although not ideal, I can accept waiting longer for the car I ordered, but the key is, I want it to be the car I ordered. I was presented with a feature to value proposition when the car's pricing was announced. I found it favorable and went all in and that is the car I expect.

Cadillac was very intentional when they said expect delivery in summer/fall of XXXX, they left some wiggle room by not being definitive. Although there is always fine print, they never said expect these standard features for this published price. Like I said, I don't mind waiting, but I want the car presented to me. If it's not, I'd like to have he option to defer my order so as to be able to get the first vehicle available with the options I ordered. I don't think I should have to stand in a different line.

*I'm willing to accept OTA solutions as long as they are full featured and delivered within a reasonable timeline.

 

[Guppydriver]

That trip in the winter time might be quite an adventure, but there are lots of chargers on the way.

I didn't bother to look at charging, but I know that route would hit North Dakota, Montana, and Northern Idaho. I assume those aren't exactly charging station bastions. It could be more of an adventure than one thinks, but it would be a beautiful drive, and well worth not having to feed the ADM beast of a big city Seattle stealership.

 

[lccjblu]

I have no issue with time line TBH. I am still waiting for a F-150 Lariat I ordered in December last year. An ICE Lariat not Lightning, the most popular vehicle in America that Ford has been building since the civil war.

I am as frustrated with the industry as anyone, but these supply issues are real and nobody wants them remedied quicker than the automakers themselves. Do I think it's time they start looking at the pattern and being more conservative with estimates? Sure, but until everyone starts doing it , no one will start doing it.

My concern and apprehension with my early Lyriq order is 99% about de-contenting. Although not ideal, I can accept waiting longer for the car I ordered, but the key is, I want it to be the car I ordered. I was presented with a feature to value proposition when the car's pricing was announced. I found it favorable and went all in and that is the car I expect.

Cadillac was very intentional when they said expect delivery in summer/fall of XXXX, they left some wiggle room by not being definitive. Although there is always fine print, they never said expect these standard features for this published price. Like I said, I don't mind waiting, but I want the car presented to me. If it's not, I'd like to have he option to defer my order so as to be able to get the first vehicle available with the options I ordered. I don't think I should have to stand in a different line.

*I'm willing to accept OTA solutions as long as they are full featured and delivered within a reasonable timeline.

I’m on the same boat as you. I worry a lot about decontenting that will come with model year 2024. The fact that the rwd has dropped back down from 62,900 to “around 60k” makes me think the base model luxury trim will have less in it.

We waited more than 6 months for a tesla model y. During that time, price was locked, and there were significant advances in hardware.

 

[LYRIQlurker]

I didn't bother to look at charging, but I know that route would hit North Dakota, Montana, and Northern Idaho. I assume those aren't exactly charging station bastions. It could be more of an adventure than one thinks, but it would be a beautiful drive, and well worth not having to feed the ADM beast of a big city Seattle stealership.

No no, charging is sparse up in the northern states, better to go west to Salt Lake City, and then NW to MT ID WA, much better charging coverage, and easier driving.

 

[LYRIQlurker]

I’m on the same boat as you. I worry a lot about decontenting that will come with model year 2024. The fact that the rwd has dropped back down from 62,900 to “around 60k” makes me think the base model luxury trim will have less in it.

We waited more than 6 months for a tesla model y. During that time, price was locked, and there were significant advances in hardware.

Tesla has been decontenting like crazy on Model Y since I bought mine, No lumbar passenger seat, no portable charger, no free charging. When I bought in Dec 2020, Y LR AWD was priced at 49K, and came with portable charge box, 1 year of free supercharging, and 3 months of free FSD. Not to mention, as a Model Y owner, it's not in the same league as LYRIQ, at $49K it was a good value, at todays price, it is a rip off, cheap plastic interior, cheap seats, noisy interior, harsh riding. Even my Hummer has way nicer interior bits, and build quality, and the Tesla paint... Don't get me started, it's thin thin thin. Look at the difference in shine between the Model Y, and the E-Tron or HummerEV, it's not even close, and they all have the same paint treatment, and the E-Tron is a year older.

Model Y is a great EV (range, charging), but a very so so car.

 

[LYRIQlurker]

I’m on the same boat as you. I worry a lot about decontenting that will come with model year 2024. The fact that the rwd has dropped back down from 62,900 to “around 60k” makes me think the base model luxury trim will have less in it.

We waited more than 6 months for a tesla model y. During that time, price was locked, and there were significant advances in hardware.

When comparing, and talking content, or de-content, Tesla just slipped that they are now charging $200 for the portable connector, they did not grandfather it to previous reservation holders, by comparison, look what GM offers... GM's even has the 240V adapter in included, that costs extra above the $200 on the Tesla.

IMO GM is doing this right, and not skimping on what they give you, and if you are worried about decontenting, Tesla is talking out stuff every owner needs.

 

[hightech-guy]

When comparing, and talking content, or de-content, Tesla just slipped that they are now charging $200 for the portable connector, they did not grandfather it to previous reservation holders, by comparison, look what GM offers... GM's even has the 240V adapter in included, that costs extra above the $200 on the Tesla.

IMO GM is doing this right, and not skimping on what they give you, and if you are worried about decontenting, Tesla is talking out stuff every owner needs.

Agree. In the early days of the Model 3, Tesla used to include the NEMA 14-50 plug also with the EVSE - like GM. Then that stopped. Then they stopping including Homelink (can be installed by service for a several hundred $ charge). Then they stopped shipping cars with radar. And the price of the car has generally gone up the whole time. And recently the delete of the passenger lumbar, and no longer including the EVSE. I will say they've made improvements such as the heat pump and heated steering wheel, but that doesn't quite equal out for the deletions and price increases.

 

[LYRIQlurker]

Agree. In the early days of the Model 3, Tesla used to include the NEMA 14-50 plug also with the EVSE - like GM. Then that stopped. Then they stopping including Homelink (can be installed by service for a several hundred $ charge). Then they stopped shipping cars with radar. And the price of the car has generally gone up the whole time. And recently the delete of the passenger lumbar, and no longer including the EVSE. I will say they've made improvements such as the heat pump and heated steering wheel, but that doesn't quite equal out for the deletions and price increases.

Model Y always had a heat pump, so it's just been deletions on the Model Y, although the newer console is nicer than what I have, but same cheap seats with plastic leather (no ventilation), that is OK on short drives, but uncomfortable on long drives.

 

[lccjblu]

When comparing, and talking content, or de-content, Tesla just slipped that they are now charging $200 for the portable connector, they did not grandfather it to previous reservation holders, by comparison, look what GM offers... GM's even has the 240V adapter in included, that costs extra above the $200 on the Tesla.

IMO GM is doing this right, and not skimping on what they give you, and if you are worried about decontenting, Tesla is talking out stuff every owner needs.
View attachment 619640
View attachment 619641

Your point is well taken about some of the changes in build. But the issue of grandfathering in the charging cable is not correct. I ordered June 2021, on hold to Jan 2022, unheld and took delivery in May (after they announced the lack of portable charger). I received my portable charger with the car (gratis) and also had 1 year of premium connectivity (rather than 30 days). Also paid 10k less than what they are now. There were some hardware deletions, but I think there were more additions and it was an overall net positive for me.

I don’t know what cadillac plans to do. This is of course purely speculation, but I see the current features on the De and MY 2023 as being pretty loaded/luxurious already. I worry that with the expanded trim levels of MY 2024, I as a May pre-order May get relegated to the lowest trim which in turn may lose some of the features advertised for DE/My 2023 as they are then only available in the premium luxury or sport trims of My2024.

 

[LYRIQlurker]

Your point is well taken about some of the changes in build. But the issue of grandfathering in the charging cable is not correct. I ordered June 2021, on hold to Jan 2022, unheld and took delivery in May (after they announced the lack of portable charger). I received my portable charger with the car (gratis) and also had 1 year of premium connectivity (rather than 30 days). Also paid 10k less than what they are now. There were some hardware deletions, but I think there were more additions and it was an overall net positive for me.

I don’t know what cadillac plans to do. This is of course purely speculation, but I see the current features on the De and MY 2023 as being pretty loaded/luxurious already. I worry that with the expanded trim levels of MY 2024, I as a May pre-order May get relegated to the lowest trim which in turn may lose some of the features advertised for DE/My 2023 as they are then only available in the premium luxury or sport trims of My2024.

Some folks got the charge cable on Model Y, some didn't. Currently it is not included in any Tesla's the last several weeks.. Model Y always came with 1 year premium connectivity in the LR AWD trim, the shorter time was only for SR+ vehicles. I do not know about LYRIQ, but HummerEV comes with 3 years connectivity, before you have to start paying for SuperCruise, On Star, etc.

As for LYRIQ, for me, I would prefer a 2024, even if the cost is slightly higher, because it will have GM's new OS, and access to Ultifi services, which earlier models will not have. The 2024 will have a wide range more options, likely including power off boarding capability. 2024 model Lyriq are scheduled to enter production in the Spring 2023, so deliveries likely a year away. GM's 2024 EV's are a big step forward in the evolution of the Ultium Platform from the 2022, and 2023 models. Also doing away with the start button, yeah! We will get some clarity on the upcoming 2024 Blazer SS unveil in 9 days, as that will be running the new OS, as will the CELESTIQ, SilveradoE, GMC Sierra Denali EV, and Equinox EV all being unveiled this summer/fall. On prices, I think GM is going to keep the pencil sharp, they want to gain EV marketshare, and with ICE Pickups, SUV's and Corvette paying the bills, they can be aggressive pricing the EV's which is quite obvious when you match LYRIQ feature by feature to model Y. Model Y is economy car level in many ways in comparison (I have had a Y for 1.5 years, and very familiar with it). Heck, even Hummer is priced very aggressively for what it offers, which is why you see them in the aftermarket selling for 2-3X MSRP, it's a hot vehicle right now. Cruising around in mine, I have never owned a car that had more people turning and looking, and pulling out their phone to catch a snapshot.

 

[Guppydriver]

Tesla has been decontenting like crazy on Model Y since I bought mine, No lumbar passenger seat, no portable charger, no free charging. When I bought in Dec 2020, Y LR AWD was priced at 49K, and came with portable charge box, 1 year of free supercharging, and 3 months of free FSD. Not to mention, as a Model Y owner, it's not in the same league as LYRIQ, at $49K it was a good value, at todays price, it is a rip off, cheap plastic interior, cheap seats, noisy interior, harsh riding. Even my Hummer has way nicer interior bits, and build quality, and the Tesla paint... Don't get me started, it's thin thin thin. Look at the difference in shine between the Model Y, and the E-Tron or HummerEV, it's not even close, and they all have the same paint treatment, and the E-Tron is a year older.

Model Y is a great EV (range, charging), but a very so so car.
View attachment 619639

What a gorgeous fleet @LYRIQlurker !

I'm 100% with you that Tesla is nowhere near the value prop thy once were. People complain about specific dealer ADM in todays market, Tesla just make sure everyone pays ADM with constant and significant price increases.

I also appreciate you pointing out that the Tesla comes less featured currently than previously, but for me, de-contenting means losing features that you had anticipated and were advertised upon ordering. I don't believe that happens at Tesla, you get the car you order. Less features, but no surprises.

Remind me...

Do you have a MY23 on order? Some of your posts (like the one above) really have me wanting to defer my MY23AWD to a MY24. I too would be willing to pay a nominal price increase. It would be really hard to turn down a actual car though considering what my luck has been with the Mme and even my ICE F-150.