Cadillac Owners Forum banner
  • Hey everyone! Enter your ride HERE to be a part of September's Ride of the Month Challenge!
1 - 20 of 36 Posts

·
Registered
XT5
Joined
·
485 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
It is a front wheel drive car! AWD may be selected in some models with some reduction in MPG. However, the unpleasant reality is that your "luxury" car has a sideways engine driving the front wheels which are also used for steering. The two simultaneous forces overload suspension and/or tires at times. In the rain or on snow, the front tires spin and burn expensive rubber. I engage AWD when the roads get wet and avoid this issue. TORQUE STEER: When you use the full horsepower of the car, the steering acts funny and you better be prepared to steer strongly and precisely. Even simple bends are countered by forces in the steering wheel which result from the front drive. Luxury cars have rear wheel drive but the XT5 is basically a GM econo-SUV with Cadillac badges. I mean I like it and am willing to put up with it although I am well aware that torque steer always gets worse as a vehicle ages, tolerances open up,shocks get softer, etc. The only other domestic RWD vehicles in this category have been the Grand Cherokee which is a Jeep like Eisenhower drove or the new Explorer like the cops drive. What are you going to do?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
193 Posts
I know that I am new to the forum, and I want to make it clear that I am not a trouble maker or ever post with anything other than good intentions (unless I am ranting...then it is just to inform). If you experience the characteristics of torque steer for an extended period of time after acceleration (or under vigorous acceleration at one or more shift points), and your CV axles are close to or equal in length, you need a repair. Even when shafts are disparate in length it is usually addressed through different density on each axle, a damper, or a no/low friction clutch. Torque steer should really be no more than "momentary" in most modern front-drive vehicles. Yes AWD will transfer some of that torque as well. My opinion, based on my own experiences, and I might be entirely incorrect...I am not an engineer and just a hobby mechanic.
 

·
Registered
2020 XT5, AWD Platinum, Garnet Metallic, 20" Ultra-Bright
Joined
·
2,042 Posts
It is a front wheel drive car! AWD may be selected in some models with some reduction in MPG. However, the unpleasant reality is that your "luxury" car has a sideways engine driving the front wheels which are also used for steering. The two simultaneous forces overload suspension and/or tires at times. In the rain or on snow, the front tires spin and burn expensive rubber. I engage AWD when the roads get wet and avoid this issue. TORQUE STEER: When you use the full horsepower of the car, the steering acts funny and you better be prepared to steer strongly and precisely. Even simple bends are countered by forces in the steering wheel which result from the front drive. Luxury cars have rear wheel drive but the XT5 is basically a GM econo-SUV with Cadillac badges. I mean I like it and am willing to put up with it although I am well aware that torque steer always gets worse as a vehicle ages, tolerances open up,shocks get softer, etc. The only other domestic RWD vehicles in this category have been the Grand Cherokee which is a Jeep like Eisenhower drove or the new Explorer like the cops drive. What are you going to do?
Buy a Cadillac!
 

·
Registered
97 Eldo ETC,98 STS,04 SRX N*,06 STS N*,14 CTS VSport Premium, 17 CTS Vsport Prem Lux
Joined
·
1,269 Posts
The Jeep Grand Cherokee is far from the Jeep that Eisenhower drove. It has a chassis that was developed jointly with Mercedes and it also underpins the ML SUV class. We’ve had ours 5 years and it’s a great vehicle, far more rugged than an XT5. Although they’re similar in size, they are completely different vehicles.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
193 Posts
Never drove a JGC, but the data supports exactly what you said, it is a very good vehicle and above average in many ways. I was surprised by that. Didn't make it to my list just because I don't care for its looks...no offense.
 

·
Registered
97 Eldo ETC,98 STS,04 SRX N*,06 STS N*,14 CTS VSport Premium, 17 CTS Vsport Prem Lux
Joined
·
1,269 Posts
None taken. I don’t like the looks of the XT5, but do like the latest refresh.

The current Jeep Grand Cherokee is over 10 years old with only one major update in 2014. That’s an eternity in the auto industry yet is still the best selling midsize SUV.



The next gen will be built on the Alpha Romeo Giulia/Stelvio chassis. It’s supposed to come out later this year 2021 but could be delayed due to the pandemic. AR vehicles can definitely be problematic so I’ll wait at least a model year for them to work out some of the bugs before considering a new one.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
2017 XT5
Joined
·
1,015 Posts
My wife had two JGC's (2011 and 2014). We also had a 2010 ML350, which is what the JGC was based on. They were all great vehicles and we'd take any of them back over the XT5. The XT5 has not been horrible, but it's just another FWD/transverse engine mid-sized crossover SUV. It is no more "luxurious" than a Chevy, GMC, Nissan or Ford. It's unexciting and nothing special. I think the biggest thing it offers is its looks. I really do like the modern Cadillac designs, but underneath the sheet metal is nothing but a Chevy. Don't get me wrong - Chevrolet makes some nice vehicles, but they shouldn't cost 30% more just because the metal has more attractive bends and adorned with a Cadillac emblem.
 

·
Registered
97 Eldo ETC,98 STS,04 SRX N*,06 STS N*,14 CTS VSport Premium, 17 CTS Vsport Prem Lux
Joined
·
1,269 Posts
Funny, I like thinking I got our JGC Summit at a $15k discount over the MB ML350. I wonder if that’s what the Chevy owners are thinking too?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
193 Posts
Funny, I like thinking I got our JGC Summit at a $15k discount over the MB ML350. I wonder if that’s what the Chevy owners are thinking too?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Could be. How is the depreciation on the JGC? The Cadillacs seem to be really terrible...but that was to my benefit since I bought used (work from home now...can not justify buying new...plus, I am Polish therefore coded in my DNA to be frugal).

I drove the GLE. The transmission was atrocious. The controls were just terrible in their design...many steps to do one thing. Body roll was just terrible, seriously one of the worst. But, it is a really good looking vehicle inside and out. Does the Jeep share anything other than the frame with MB?
 

·
Registered
Cadillac CT6 (2019)
Joined
·
2,342 Posts
Well the XT5 isn't a Chevy, at least not at inception; Chevrolet later got the Blazer which was based on XT5 architecture (and XT5 was not based on either the Equinox or Traverse), and even going back to the original 3.6 V-6 (it started as a Cadillac engine that was later shared with other GM variants). Cadillac has quite a lot of upgraded materials used to make it stand out (perhaps not to the level you require) but still a Cadillac is substantially nicer than a Chevy (and I like Chevy too), just that if you want a little more, you'll want the Caddy. I'll agree that sometimes price may not be translatable in a linear way but no one twisting anyone's arm; you pay your money and you take your chances.
 

·
Registered
XT5
Joined
·
485 Posts
Discussion Starter · #12 · (Edited)
Re "Eisenhower," I was ready to buy a Grand Cherokee but Susan said, "You don't want people to think you drive around in the mud do you?" They have an image problem based on their origin as a WW2 utility vehicle. I would have had a Grand Cherokee if they would have had a subbrand available not including the Jeep logo. Honda, Toyota, Nissan and Hyundai created their alter egos and Cad became just another face of GM. I know the officials of Canada drive Jeeps but it looks as dumb as the officials themselves.
"Torque steer" has always been the elephant in the room for front wheel drive cars. FWD is preferred by liberal/progressive/forward thinkers everywhere for economy of materials and fuel but you don't see it on the race track because the inherent problem is that there is a shared limit to the capability of the front tires and suspension to steer and accelerate simultaneously.
Future XT5s should have the rear wheels do the pushing while the fronts do the steering.
 

·
Registered
17 XT5 AWD Luxury
Joined
·
99 Posts
It is a front wheel drive car! AWD may be selected in some models with some reduction in MPG. However, the unpleasant reality is that your "luxury" car has a sideways engine driving the front wheels which are also used for steering. The two simultaneous forces overload suspension and/or tires at times. In the rain or on snow, the front tires spin and burn expensive rubber. I engage AWD when the roads get wet and avoid this issue. TORQUE STEER: When you use the full horsepower of the car, the steering acts funny and you better be prepared to steer strongly and precisely. Even simple bends are countered by forces in the steering wheel which result from the front drive. Luxury cars have rear wheel drive but the XT5 is basically a GM econo-SUV with Cadillac badges. I mean I like it and am willing to put up with it although I am well aware that torque steer always gets worse as a vehicle ages, tolerances open up,shocks get softer, etc. The only other domestic RWD vehicles in this category have been the Grand Cherokee which is a Jeep like Eisenhower drove or the new Explorer like the cops drive. What are you going to do?
IMO this class of vehicle is a lifted station wagon -so you get better view and more ground clearance. We moved up from an SRX to the XT5 because we like the look. We were totally happy to find that the increased HP of the V6 and the suspension changes made the XT5 way more fun to drive. We live in the NE, so AWD was desired, but as soon as the weather gets nice, we leave it in Sport FWD mode and when I get on it, I have never noted or been overwhelmed by torque steer.
If the roads are wet, you can start to get spin ...until the nannies come on. Funny thing is my RWD truck and Corvette do the same thing. So for us, we feel like we got what we paid for -a real nice looking and optioned vehicle, that had some "luxury" and that was exactly what we wanted.
 

·
Registered
2018 Cadillac XT5, 2013 Toyota Avalon Hybrid Limited
Joined
·
71 Posts
I don't feel any "torque steer" on my XT5. It handles very well for a CUV. Torque steer was a problem on small FWD cars in the 1980s, but not so much today. If you are experiencing torque steer on an XT5, there may be something amiss mechanically that needs adjustment or repair. My XT5 came from the factory with the steering wheel a half inch off-center and pulling to the right, and out of round tires that vibrated the whole car. It was a real pain to drive until I replaced the tires and had the wheels aligned at an independent repair shop. Now it drives great. It is fair to blame Cadillac for poor production quality and lack of dealer support in my case, but not the car itself.
 

·
Registered
XT5
Joined
·
485 Posts
Discussion Starter · #15 ·
I don't notice the tendency to torque steer till I suddenly do a quick maneuver requiring a lot of throttle. The easy steering is gone and a firm hand is required. Small uncommanded directional changes are felt and must be resisted. When I bought it, I figured I'd just leave it in AWD which is what I should do. (I too got a second alignment by a third party but wasn't content till I got new tires)
 

·
Registered
2017 XT5
Joined
·
1,015 Posts
FWD was always touted as having "better traction", but that is not really true. The only traction advantage is putting 65%+ of the vehicle's weight over the front axle. The problem is that making the front wheels both drive and steer is a trade-off for both functions. There will be "torque steer", even with equal length shafts. The skewed weight distribution can also make handing a challenge in certain situations, like emergency avoidance maneuvers. Of course traction/skid control has helped that.

I know that the Cadillac is not based on the Equinox. It's actually a shortened version of the Traverse. But that's not the issue. The issue is that most everything came from the shared GM parts bin: window switches, seat control, signal levers are all pretty much the same as what you get in a Chevy Cruze. Honestly, I see nothing in t he XT5 that would make it cost $10K more than a comparably equipped Chevy. If you want to build a luxury vehicle, give it some luxury features. Simple things like memory on the passenger seat settings, something better than a two-way lumbar support, power headrests, auto up/down on all windows and the sunroof, and less hard waxy plastic surfaces all over the cabin.
 

·
Registered
XT5
Joined
·
485 Posts
Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Lincoln Aviator is new Ford Explorer, RWD based luxury SUV with 6700# tow rating and 400 hp. Big but smaller than an Escalade/Tahoe. Same base price as Tahoe.
 

·
Registered
2012 CTS (base)
Joined
·
48 Posts
Re "Eisenhower," I was ready to buy a Grand Cherokee but Susan said, "You don't want people to think you drive around in the mud do you?" They have an image problem based on their origin as a WW2 utility vehicle. I would have had a Grand Cherokee if they would have had a subbrand available not including the Jeep logo. Honda, Toyota, Nissan and Hyundai created their alter egos and Cad became just another face of GM. I know the officials of Canada drive Jeeps but it looks as dumb as the officials themselves.
"Torque steer" has always been the elephant in the room for front wheel drive cars. FWD is preferred by liberal/progressive/forward thinkers everywhere for economy of materials and fuel but you don't see it on the race track because the inherent problem is that there is a shared limit to the capability of the front tires and suspension to steer and accelerate simultaneously.
Future XT5s should have the rear wheels do the pushing while the fronts do the steering.
If you won’t buy a perfectly good vehicle because the wife worries what people will think of you, or some political bs that has jack to do with anything, I doubt there’s much assistance anyone can lend. Buy what she wants and stop pretending to care about torque steer in a car that you apparently didn’t know much about when you bought it. Problem solved.
 

·
Registered
'08 STS V
Joined
·
25 Posts
I know that I am new to the forum, and I want to make it clear that I am not a trouble maker or ever post with anything other than good intentions (unless I am ranting...then it is just to inform). If you experience the characteristics of torque steer for an extended period of time after acceleration (or under vigorous acceleration at one or more shift points), and your CV axles are close to or equal in length, you need a repair. Even when shafts are disparate in length it is usually addressed through different density on each axle, a damper, or a no/low friction clutch. Torque steer should really be no more than "momentary" in most modern front-drive vehicles. Yes AWD will transfer some of that torque as well. My opinion, based on my own experiences, and I might be entirely incorrect...I am not an engineer and just a hobby mechanic.
WHOA!!! Pump the brakes there fella.... There are TWO Jeep Cherokee models.
1st up is the Jeep Cherokee - About the same size as the XT5 and are available in either front wheel drive or Front Biased all wheel drive.
2nd up is the Jeep GRAND Cherokee - Much larger than the XT5 (approx. Chevy Tahoe) and is a rear wheel drive vehicle. These also come equipped with standard 4 wheel drive and Quadra Drive II 4 wheel drive systems. In a side by side comparison, they are completely different vehicles.
It's pretty confusing, I have no idea who at FCA (maybe Sergio?) thought naming two completely different vehicles almost identical names was a good idea.
But...… they did.
Hell, half the time google can't even keep them straight....LOL
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
193 Posts
WHOA!!! Pump the brakes there fella.... There are TWO Jeep Cherokee models.
1st up is the Jeep Cherokee - About the same size as the XT5 and are available in either front wheel drive or Front Biased all wheel drive.
2nd up is the Jeep GRAND Cherokee - Much larger than the XT5 (approx. Chevy Tahoe) and is a rear wheel drive vehicle. These also come equipped with standard 4 wheel drive and Quadra Drive II 4 wheel drive systems. In a side by side comparison, they are completely different vehicles.
It's pretty confusing, I have no idea who at FCA (maybe Sergio?) thought naming two completely different vehicles almost identical names was a good idea.
But...… they did.
Hell, half the time google can't even keep them straight....LOL
I think you might have quoted the wrong post. Not that it really matters.
 
1 - 20 of 36 Posts
Top