Cadillac Owners Forum banner

1 - 20 of 22 Posts

·
Registered
'03 STS (RIP), '89 Eldorado, '13 Malibu, '89 Grand Wagoneer
Joined
·
2,191 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Those list-loving guys over at Time have compiled yet another one. This one covers what they think are the 50 worst cars of all time:

1899 Horsey Horseless
1909 Ford Model T
1911 Overland OctoAuto
1913 Scripps-Booth Bi-Autogo
1920 Briggs and Stratton Flyer
1933 Fuller Dymaxion
1934 Chrysler/Desoto Airflow
1949 Crosley Hotshot
1956 Renault Dauphine
1957 King Midget Model III
1957 Waterman Aerobile
1958 Ford Edsel
1958 Lotus Elite
1958 MGA Twin Cam
1958 Zunndapp Janus
1961 Amphicar
1961 Corvair
1966 Peel Trident
1970 AMC Gremlin
1970 Triumph Stag
1971 Chrysler Imperial LeBaron Two-Door Hardtop
1971 Ford Pinto
1974 Jaguar XK-E V12 Series III
1975 Bricklin SV1
1975 Morgan Plus 8 Propane
1975 Triumph TR7
1975 Trabant
1976 Aston Martin Lagonda
1976 Chevy Chevette
1978 AMC Pacer
1980 Corvette 305 "California"
1980 Ferrari Mondial 8
1981 Cadillac Fleetwood V-8-6-4
1981 De Lorean DMC-12
1982 Cadillac Cimarron
1982 Camaro Iron Duke
1984 Maserati Biturbo
1985 Mosler Consulier GTP
1985 Yugo GV
1986 Lamborghini LM002
1995 Ford Explorer
1997 GM EV1
1997 Plymouth Prowler
1998 Fiat Multipla
2000 Ford Excursion
2001 Jaguar X-Type
2001 Pontiac Aztek
2002 BMW 7-series
2003 Hummer H2
2004 Chevy SSR

For the full, interactive article, see here.
 

·
Registered
2010 CTS (Elvis) 1964 Impala (Betty) 1991 Miata (Dolly)
Joined
·
14,333 Posts

·
Registered
1993 SedanDeville (RIP), 2006 CTS (current)
Joined
·
3,338 Posts
I hate this.

1995 Ford Explorer

2003 Hummer H2

Both articles are fine examples of the liberal, collectivist tripe which calls America's prosperity a mad desire for oil, and portrays innovative vehicles such as the Explorer as "over-acheiving". I find it ironic that he called the H2 "too militaristic". No kidding, buddy.
 

·
Registered
95 Fleetwood Brougham / 01 DTS / 11 CTS Lux / 11 DTS Platinum
Joined
·
7,085 Posts
Hmmm just out of curiosity, what are you guys seeing on that list that you think is a great car.
 
D

·
Guest
Joined
·
0 Posts
Lots of cars on that list that I do like but all them probably junk like the Lagonda, Bricklin, Delorean, Triumphs, Lotus's, XKE, etc...
 

·
Registered
1992 Town Car Cartier & 2014 Accord LX MTX
Joined
·
34,087 Posts
1933 Fuller Dymaxion
1971 Chrysler Imperial LeBaron Two-Door Hardtop
1976 Aston Martin Lagonda
1981 Cadillac Fleetwood V-8-6-4
1981 De Lorean DMC-12
1986 Lamborghini LM002
2002 BMW 7-series
I need reasons for why these "writers" thought the cars were so bad, specifically these ones.
 

·
Registered
N/A
Joined
·
1,103 Posts
Codewize,

Cars I think shouldn't be on that list?

1909 Ford Model T
1920 Briggs and Stratton Flyer
1934 Chrysler/Desoto Airflow
1949 Crosley Hotshot
1958 Ford Edsel
1958 Lotus Elite
1976 Aston Martin Lagonda
1978 AMC Pacer
1980 Corvette 305 "California"
1980 Ferrari Mondial 8
1981 Cadillac Fleetwood V-8-6-4
1981 De Lorean DMC-12
1984 Maserati Biturbo
1986 Lamborghini LM002
1997 Plymouth Prowler
2000 Ford Excursion
2001 Jaguar X-Type
2001 Pontiac Aztek
2002 BMW 7-series
2003 Hummer H2
2004 Chevy SSR

A lot of these cars were huge for there respective brands. I could careless of the reliability of some (like the Ford Model T) which came with a tool repair kit, and had a motor with no piston rings, but steel sleeves around the pistons, it was called a sleeve-it motor. But aside from that that car was HUGE for the automobile industry. Its even be named the car of the century.

Several of the others like the Chrysler Airflow, the Ford Edsel were radically styled at the time. Even though styling questions at the time turned out to be hugely collectible and really weren't all that horrible.

I think like has already been said this particular list in the first post was made up out of fun and personal preference nothing more.
 

·
Registered
'03 STS (RIP), '89 Eldorado, '13 Malibu, '89 Grand Wagoneer
Joined
·
2,191 Posts
Discussion Starter #14
Just out of curiosity... did anyone actually bother to click through to the article? While I personally some of them may be a slight stretch, unlike that Forbes article the boys at time at least give their reasons for why they chose them.

I'll be the first one to admit that I wasn't familiar with every single one on the list... the whole thing is nicely written and informative.

Here are a few snippets:

1974 Jaguar XK-E V12 Series III



"The 1961 Jaguar E-Type was heavenly, a dead-sexy, 150-mph supercar, a stiletto heel to the heart of any car-loving man. By 1974, it had morphed into this, this thing. In order to compensate for power-sapping emissions controls required in the U.S., the car's primary export market, Jaguar discontinued the reliable 4.2-liter six for an anchor-heavy 5.3-liter V12, which was a total bitch to try to keep in tune and made the car nose-heavy besides. Jaguar also discontinued the elegant fixed-head coupe and offered the car only as a long wheelbase 2+2 or convertible. Imagine taking one of the world's most beautiful cars and sticking it in a taffy puller. Not finished ruining the lines, Jag plumped up the fenders, spoiling the smooth, aero-sleek contours of the original. The piece de resistance, Jag affixed hideous rubber bumpers — Dagmars, really — in a lame attempt to meet 5-mph bumper standards. To which car enthusiasts can only say, 'You bastards!'"

1976 Aston Martin Lagonda



"In the disco days of the 1970s, even supercars were cocaine-thin. Meet the Aston Martin Lagonda, a four-door exotic that lived on dinner mints and hot water. Designed by AM penman William Towns — undoubtedly wearing a very large cravat at the time — the Lagonda was as beautiful a car as ever resembled a pencil box. Mechanically, it was a catastrophe, Aston Martin's Dunkirk. The company decided to build the Lagonda with a brace of cutting-edge, computer-driven electronics and cathode-ray displays, which would have been very impressive if any of them ever worked. NASA couldn't have built this car, much less the heirs to Joseph Lucas, the British electronics' famous "Prince of Darkness." Still, I'd kill to have one of these cars, and the O-scope and multi-meter to fix it."

1981 Cadillac Fleetwood V-8-6-4



"These days, cylinder deactivation, or variable displacement, is relatively common — the 2008 Honda Accord V6 has it, for instance. And it's a beautiful idea. When the engine is running at light loads, it's logical to shut down unneeded cylinders to save fuel, like turning off lights in unused rooms. But in 1981, when semiconductors and on-board computers were still in their infancy, variable displacement was a huge technical challenge. GM deserves credit for trying, but the V-8-6-4 was the Titanic of engine programs. The cars jerked, bucked, stalled, made rude noises and generally misbehaved until wild-eyed owners took the cars to have the system disconnected. For some it was the last time they ever saw the inside of a Cadillac dealership."

The theory that these are just cars they don't like doesn't really hold up, because they seem to like quite a few they've listed. Again, at least given their explanations why they included every car.

Believe me, there have been many instances where I've held issue with Time Magazine, but this is still a neat, well written, informative article. Before commenting any further you may want to take ten minutes and go here, to read the whole thing, explanations and all.
 

·
Registered
01 frontier , 89 Shelby CSX vnt
Joined
·
14,607 Posts
great cars on the list:

1933 Fuller Dymaxion
1934 Chrysler/Desoto Airflow

1956 Renault Dauphine
1958 Lotus Elite
1958 MGA Twin Cam

1961 Amphicar
1961 Corvair

1970 Triumph Stag


1985 Mosler Consulier GTP

1986 Lamborghini LM002

1997 GM EV1
2003 Hummer H2
2004 Chevy SSR

these are great cars becuse of historical ,sales , or engineering reasons

Interesting notes here , the crosley hotshot was a car that my grandfather worked on the assembly line for , he poured the lead into the windshield area on the line ....after 3 months was hopitalized with lead poisioning , only at the time doctors didnt know anything about lead poisioning ...

the consulier was very interesting for its time , alot of them arriveing with chrysler 2.2 turbo power ....this car would later evolove into the mosler raptor with lsx power

the amphicar now sells for well over 100k for a example that still floats

the renault daph sold very well here in the us for a screwball french car , they came with boath a electric starter and a provision in the rear for a hand crank in case of battery failure
 

·
Registered
Previous STS' 1995/97/99/01/03
Joined
·
1,194 Posts
It may not be a popular opinion around here, but I understand the 1981 Cadillac on that list.
My father traded in his 1978 SDV with a reliable 425 for the V8-6-4. All he wanted was dependable, luxurious transportation.
His daily commute across busy Hwy 401 in Toronto often included a check engine light, then a complete loss of power, followed by
a tow.
These were the pre-cell phone days. Driving a Caddy shouldn't include standing beside a 16 lane superhighway in a business suit, kicking
your car. It happened over and over, until he traded the car for an Olds 98, which ran like a top.
At that time, no one at the dealership ever suggested deactivating any electronics ... they basically couldn't get the car to repeat the
symptoms which randomly would strand you, always without warning.
 

·
Registered
95 Fleetwood Brougham / 01 DTS / 11 CTS Lux / 11 DTS Platinum
Joined
·
7,085 Posts
Guys, I don't think the list was written based on weather or not we like the cars or their historic value to the auto industry or at the time or whatever. When they say worst I think they are talking solely about reliability.

There are a couple on there that have very significant meanings and some that I personally live BUT they're were probably very unreliable.
 

·
Registered
1992 STS / 2005 MB G500 / 2003 STS / 2006 XLR-V
Joined
·
11,694 Posts
Out of that entire list, the only ones I can see some logical reasons to dislike (save for the ones I don't immediately recognize), even when you account for electrical problems etc. would be the following:

1958 Ford Edsel

1961 Corvair

1971 Ford Pinto

1982 Cadillac Cimarron, no question there.

1985 Yugo GV

2001 Pontiac Aztek

The 1981 Cadillac Fleetwood barely stays off the list because in the end, you DID have the ability to disconnect the system and the car was otherwise part of an gorgeous and reliable model line aside from that.

The rest of the cars I just dont see making "worst" status and I can find others I'd put in their places.

Some examples?

Toyota Tercel, a monumental shitpile of an econobox

Land Rover Discovery

1996 Mercedes Benz E Class W210 (The car that single-handedly started the worst period of MB reliability ever, remaining W140 years aside.)

I can think of several more.
 

·
Registered
1992 Town Car Cartier & 2014 Accord LX MTX
Joined
·
34,087 Posts
1996 Mercedes Benz E Class W210 (The car that single-handedly started the worst period of MB reliability ever, remaining W140 years aside.)
Ugh. The start of the "oval headlight" Mercedes era. I didn't like them when they came out, and I'm still leery about them 11 years later. But on the other hand, they did have a nice interior setup and the lines of the car (aside from the headlights) weren't too bad.
 

·
Registered
Unicycle
Joined
·
11,009 Posts
I DID read thru nearly each and every one, because alot of the cars I didn't know about.

It is a matter of opinion, and thats it. Most of them are on there because someone didn't like the styling of the car, the amount of options (or lack of) it had, or what the public turned it into.... a few examples:



Uh-oh. Here comes trouble. Let's stipulate that the Model T did everything that the history books say: It put America on wheels, supercharged the nation's economy and transformed the landscape in ways unimagined when the first Tin Lizzy rolled out of the factory. Well, that's just the problem, isn't it? The Model T — whose mass production technique was the work of engineer William C. Klann, who had visited a slaughterhouse's "disassembly line" — conferred to Americans the notion of automobility as something akin to natural law, a right endowed by our Creator. A century later, the consequences of putting every living soul on gas-powered wheels are piling up, from the air over our cities to the sand under our soldiers' boots. And by the way, with its blacksmithed body panels and crude instruments, the Model T was a piece of junk, the Yugo of its day.
a freakin' 1909 Model T and his gripes are blacksmithed body panels and crude instruments? What did you expect? a fiberglass aerodynamic body and LCD gauges with in car navigation?!?



Rear-engine cars are fun to drive and even more fun to crash. While rear-engine packaging offers enormous advantages, putting the vehicle's heaviest component behind the rear axle gives cars a distinct tendency to spin out, sort of like an arrow weighted at the end. During World War II, Nazi officers in occupied Czechoslovakia were banned from driving the speedy rear-engined Tatras because so many had been killed behind the wheel. Chevrolet execs knew the Corvair — a lithe and lovely car with an air-cooled, flat-six in the back, a la the VW Beetle — was a handful, but they declined to spend the few dollars per car to make the swing-axle rear suspension more manageable. Ohhh, they came to regret that. Ralph Nader put the smackdown on GM in his book Unsafe at Any Speed, also noting that the Corvair's single-piece steering column could impale the driver in a front collision. Ouch! Meanwhile, the Corvair had other problems. It leaked oil like a derelict tanker. Its heating system tended to pump noxious fumes into the cabin. It was offered for a while with a gasoline-burner heater located in the front "trunk," a common but dangerously dumb accessory at the time. Even so, my family had a Corvair, white with red interior, and we loved it.
Its on the list of worst cars, yet their family had one and loved it?



Article ToolsPrintEmailSphereAddThisRSS I include the Chevy Chevette only to note that even the most unloved and unlovely cars have their partisans. There are Pacer fan clubs and Yugo fan clubs, and if there is a Chevette fan club, let it begin with me. My girlfriend in college had a diaper-brown Chevette three-door hatchback, as bare bones as an exhibit at the natural history museum. It had a 51-hp engine and a four-speed manual transmission and not much else. It was loud and it was tinny, but we drove that car across the country three times and it never failed us. Once I got a 85-mph speeding ticket in it. That was on the down slope of the Appalachians, but still. The last time I saw that Chevette it was still plugging along. Vaya con Dios, old paint.
So his g/f had one, they drove it across the country 3 times, never failed them, sold it and last time he saw it, it was still driving around? Sounds like a horrible car to me :helpless:



This V12-powered super dune buggy gets on the list — well, my list anyway — purely because of its appalling clientele. The "Rambo Lambo" was the civilian version of a military vehicle that Lamborghini sold to those beacons of democracy, Saudi Arabia and Libya, among others. The luxurious LM002 appealed to spoiled young Saudi sheiks wanting to cross the sand to survey their oil field holdings. Uday Hussein, son of Saddam, had one, which the U.S. military cheerfully blew up in 2004 during a "test" to simulate the effects of a car bomb. The LM002 is the forerunner of another large and unnecessary SUV that signals pure contempt for one's fellow man, the Hummer H2. Read on.
Atleast he admits why its on the list.... HIS list.... simply cause of the view that people would have? This was a military concept type vehicle more then anything....

But by far the best reason as to why this list is just some liberal editors opinion...... no explaination necessary. See also Hummer H2.



How could the best-selling passenger vehicle in America 14 years running, the mother of all mom-mobiles, the beloved suburban schlepper of millions, wind up on this list? Forget about the whole Firestone tire controversy. In its very success, the Ford Explorer is responsible for setting this country on the spiral of vehicular obesity that we are still contending with today. People, particularly women drivers, discovered that they liked sitting up high. Even though more fuel-efficient minivans do the kid- and cargo-hauling duties better, people came to prefer the outdoorsy, go-anywhere image of SUVs. In other words, people became addicted to the pose. And, as vehicles got bigger and heavier, buyers sought out even bigger vehicles to make themselves feel safe. Helloooo Hummer. All of that we can lay at the overachieving feet of the Explorer.
 
1 - 20 of 22 Posts
Top