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Looks like China lol I wonder how many people other then me realize the mask everyone keeps wearing do jackshi to protect ANYONE? mine as well just pull your shit up over your nose
 

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Throw away one use only menus and table covers, sealed packets of table ware and condiments, gloved and masked servers, all may be in the offing for restaurants to open. Patrons would of course lower their face coverings when eating and drinking. Wouldn’t these temporary adjustments be safe enough?
 

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Funny vid! Only last week did my state get outside dining approved. (Thank God the weather has been good). No masks for the customers unless you have to go use the restroom inside. Masks for the staff... No masks outside. Just glad to get back to my friendly neighborhood bar!!!
 

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The one with the Italian cafe is better.

... I wonder how many people other then me realize the mask everyone keeps wearing do jackshi to protect ANYONE? ....
There's actually been rather extensive measurements with even the most rudimentary masks proving they greatly reduce both the volume and distance that virus-laden aerosol travels FROM the wearer to ALL others. So some agreement that while those wearing a mask are in fact not quite as perfectly jackshi protected from exposure by OTHERS, that in fact wearing a mask is just the most basic simple and effective means of engaging society in an adult mature responsible manner by showing the willingness to undertake a tiny amount of first-world inconvenience to stem as rapid a pace of infection throughout the community we're a part of. And that means consideration and better protection of EVERYONE, (and perhaps even more crucially for anyone who can see past their nose and their own selfish narrow-minded perspective) including all the brats, relatives and friends of those we come in contact with in public.

Now, and here's where 3rd grade math and above comes into play, so follow along closely. When 100% of folks are all socially responsible (it's ok to pretend if you don't really understand for now) and willing to do their own minuscule part as part of society (I know there's all those other people again), then all these people wearing masks are all emitting their wet breath a shorter distance and with less amount of potential virus (either pre-symptomatic or asymptomatic) onto EVERYONE else, so that the CUMULATIVE impact is less overall aerosol (and viruses) spreading around EVERYWHERE!
That is of course as long as all those wearing said mask has not cut a hole in it, pulled it under their chin, wearing it on their forehead, or doing anything else to exhibit a childish spoiled immature embarrassing display of their god-given right to act stupid in public. And it's rather apparent even a single immature jackshi flaunting their perceived constitutional right (even obligation) to serve as lowest common denominator in society by not wearing a mask will degrade and erode that efficiency and benefit for everyone else. Now the business case can certainly be made that those are all just other people and WhoGAS about them? My convenience and expression of manly independence is more important than anyone else's health, right?

So, for the poster I may not be ragging on your contribution specifically, but unfortunately you just happen to be the first such silliness I've come across this morning. Before I've had any coffee.
 
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I don't mind others wearing masks and don't mind wearing them in places where who ever is in charge asks for that.

But since this is a free country and no way to know for sure the value for following a specific "scientific" recommendation (scientists are not above bias, hidden agendas, etc and come close to being notorious for it, at least according to my published PhD son), I am okay with anyone else not wearing a mask if they chose to and it is not required by whoever is legally in charge (property owner, law enforcement). If I'm worried about someone without a mask, I am free to move away, come back later, go somewhere else, etc..

I have no use for people who judge others or want to dictate other's behavior without legal authority to do so. I've seen people come to blows in public places because one took exception to the other not wearing a mask where it was not legally required. Not acceptable. If for no other reason than there are more and more people every day who Covid 19 has run its course with and are safer without a mask than someone with a mask who still has it, asymptomatic or not.
 

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If you actually READ the science that we have on this (and that doesn't mean the news articles written on the science, it means the science itself), you'll find that there really is no support for mandating that everyone wear masks in public.

Obviously, masks are going to have an effect - they trap what you exhale, and limit what you can inhale. There's no way that can't make a difference. The problem is that masks bring their own set of risks - many people have allergies to them (my wife is dangerously allergic for instance), they trap germs and become spreaders themselves, they trap CO2 and can cause progressive asphyxiation, and biggest of all - most of them aren't actually capable of filtering out COVID19 anyway.

That said, the real kicker is this - the (official, peer reviewed) science we have on masks tells us that you have a 13% chance of contracting COVID19 from a distance of 3ft with no protection at all, indoors, with proper air conditioning in place (low humidity). Beyond 5ft the risk drops to 0%. With a mask, the risk drops to 8% at 3ft. So basically, people are getting all up in arms over a 5-point reduction in risk. Also, that's all indoors - outdoors you'd basically have to make out with someone who is infected.

I respect anyone who is concerned about their own health and chooses to wear a mask - they should NEVER be hassled about that choice. However, there is absolutely no support for the idea that everyone should be required to wear masks nor is their any legal precedent anywhere in the US that would allow that rule to stand. It is 100% the choice of the individual and we all need to respect that.

Me, I wear one when indoors and in close proximity to others. But not outdoors in the open air.
 

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I'm very intrigued by your statements. Any referenced source material will be extremely beneficial to counterpoint appreciably different data and VERY different conclusions reached by literally all other info I've come across and even sought out respective of transmission mechanics, particulate filtering, mask properties, allergens.....

And genuinely sorry to hear of any family member suffering by wearing a mask. However, outright allergy is rare, and more often documented as chafing from wrong size or improper fit. For anyone experiencing discomfort from even intermittent use there are quite a few makers offering hypoallergenic products (cellulose) and/or dealing with all the identifiable allergens (ex: dyes, sizing, formaldehyde, fabric type).

I'd look especially hard-eyed at any manner of data purporting any CO2 hypercapnia (even progressive) or O2 deprivation. Any regular non-medical face masks we'll be wearing have absolutely no aspirations in life for "filtering out COVID19", and absolutely 0% capability of impeding anything the size of an O2 or CO2 molecule. And since the micron-sized beasts can't fly by themselves (and despite all attempts to contrive purposes to the contrary) their only purpose is to vastly reduce velocity of exhaled vapor that 'might be' carrying the virus to others.

And the 'legal precedent' ruse is too much for any grown-up to take without laughing and crying at the same time. As with any other societal health issue, we might as well go back and debate the "100% the choice of the individual" not to wear a seat belt, to refute impacts of second-hand smoke, and for anyone who is afraid of drunk drivers to just stay off the road.

But as offered, I'll deep dive into any new source material that helps temper the completely anti-political and strictly health-centric perspective I've been using to this point.
 
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The one with the Italian cafe is better.



There's actually been rather extensive measurements with even the most rudimentary masks proving they greatly reduce both the volume and distance that virus-laden aerosol travels FROM the wearer to ALL others. So some agreement that while those wearing a mask are in fact not quite as perfectly jackshi protected from exposure by OTHERS, that in fact wearing a mask is just the most basic simple and effective means of engaging society in an adult mature responsible manner by showing the willingness to undertake a tiny amount of first-world inconvenience to stem as rapid a pace of infection throughout the community we're a part of. And that means consideration and better protection of EVERYONE, (and perhaps even more crucially for anyone who can see past their nose and their own selfish narrow-minded perspective) including all the brats, relatives and friends of those we come in contact with in public.

Now, and here's where 3rd grade math and above comes into play, so follow along closely. When 100% of folks are all socially responsible (it's ok to pretend if you don't really understand for now) and willing to do their own minuscule part as part of society (I know there's all those other people again), then all these people wearing masks are all emitting their wet breath a shorter distance and with less amount of potential virus (either pre-symptomatic or asymptomatic) onto EVERYONE else, so that the CUMULATIVE impact is less overall aerosol (and viruses) spreading around EVERYWHERE!
That is of course as long as all those wearing said mask has not cut a hole in it, pulled it under their chin, wearing it on their forehead, or doing anything else to exhibit a childish spoiled immature embarrassing display of their god-given right to act stupid in public. And it's rather apparent even a single immature jackshi flaunting their perceived constitutional right (even obligation) to serve as lowest common denominator in society by not wearing a mask will degrade and erode that efficiency and benefit for everyone else. Now the business case can certainly be made that those are all just other people and WhoGAS about them? My convenience and expression of manly independence is more important than anyone else's health, right?

So, for the poster I may not be ragging on your contribution specifically, but unfortunately you just happen to be the first such silliness I've come across this morning. Before I've had any coffee.
there you go AGAIN, using logic and confusing us with facts, not to mention polysyllabic words. :giggle:
 

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I'm very intrigued by your statements. Any referenced source material will be extremely beneficial to counterpoint appreciably different data and VERY different conclusions reached by literally all other info I've come across and even sought out respective of transmission mechanics, particulate filtering, mask properties, allergens.....
Below is the only complete, peer reviewed study we have on the subject, so your reference to "literally all other info" leads me to believe you are referring to mainstream news sources...which is laughable.


The good stuff comes in the text after table one.

And genuinely sorry to hear of any family member suffering by wearing a mask. However, outright allergy is rare...I'd look especially hard-eyed at any manner of data purporting any CO2 hypercapnia (even progressive) or O2 deprivation
Sources for these claims?

since the micron-sized beasts can't fly by themselves (and despite all attempts to contrive purposes to the contrary) their only purpose is to vastly reduce velocity of exhaled vapor that 'might be' carrying the virus to others.
And as the above referenced study concludes, the risk from 3ft is 12.6% with no protection whatsoever. So like I said, sure they offer some protection, but it's difficult to claim that limited protection is worth the tradeoffs.

And the 'legal precedent' ruse is too much for any grown-up to take without laughing and crying at the same time. As with any other societal health issue, we might as well go back and debate the "100% the choice of the individual" not to wear a seat belt, to refute impacts of second-hand smoke, and for anyone who is afraid of drunk drivers to just stay off the road.
There is tons of legal precedent for seat belts, and the science on second-hand smoke is conclusive. Completely unrelated and terrible comparisons.
 

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Well said FTSS, and to the others that don't agree I guess it's mere coincidence that cases have radically jumped up after all of those parties and places where people went out on beaches without masks suddenly everything skyrocketed. That's one hell of a coincidence and it is the law in some places to wear one or you can be fined. If you're so medically bad off that you can't wear a mask for 20 or 30 minutes to go shopping then maybe you should have someone do it for you. A lot of people will do it for free for you.

Roy
 

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oh, my, and this thread started out as humorous. Which ever side you're on, what can it hurt to wear a mask? Since we're getting all serious and stuff, here's my stance: my wife is immune suppressed, thanks to a transplant anti-rejection drug. You come anywhere close to my house or her without a mask and it won't be pretty.
 

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oh, my, and this thread started out as humorous. Which ever side you're on, what can it hurt to wear a mask? Since we're getting all serious and stuff, here's my stance: my wife is immune suppressed, thanks to a transplant anti-rejection drug. You come anywhere close to my house or her without a mask and it won't be pretty.
I have no argument against the voluntary wearing of masks. So I agree with you. The problem I have is the mandated wearing of masks. I don't get close to people I don't know...mask or not, I just don't...but if for some reason I have no choice, I wear a mask.

Also, if I had any kind of immune system deficiency or any respirator-related illness, I would just stay home until this is over. Which is another reason why I don't give people who DO wear masks all the time a hard time - you never know what their situation is. Perhaps they are being "sheep" but perhaps they have real reason for concern. Either way, it's not worth being a d1ck about it.
 

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Mask wearing is no big deal. Better potentially safe than sorry. For 26 years or so I periodically wore all types of "masks", from diver's helmets to air breathing to asbestos filtration.

There are emergency air breathing manifolds throughout a submarine - the orange thingy in the overhead in the link picture. One part of submarine qualification was to don an air breathing mask and, beginning in the forward torpedo room, without removing the mask, connect and disconnect from every emergency manifold in the submarine. You could miss 3 of the over 100 manifolds.


Emergency surface.jpg
 

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It is actually sad that it took a pandemic for people to realize that they need to wash their hands, keep a social distance, refrain from touching everything, and generally keep things clean.

However, some people are going off the deep end to follow the rules. Then there are those who do the opposite, because someone else told them to be respectful.
 
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