[Yaemish]

The coolant supplement tablets kept my leak at bay just long enough for the weather to change. The temporary seal popped this morning but tomorrow it will hit 50 degrees, so I know what I'll be doing.

I bought the gasket kit from Rockauto, containing all the gaskets for the job as well as some additional. Is there anything else that I should replace while the crossover is out of the car?

 

[Submariner409]

See the nearby thread on this by postman. Coolant crossover gaskets. Also, others in here and in Tech Tips.

Google "cadillac forums northstar engine coolant crossover" or something close, always preceded by "cadillac forums .....".

 

[Yaemish]

Thanks. I've found the procedure. I know that it is a pain in the ass but I should be able to do it.

I was just wondering if there would be any other things that should be replaced proactively while it is out. I do have a p0741 occasional (vac leak) somewhere.I wonder if it will be easier to locate.

 

[2manyhotrods]

You need to drink a full bottle of "patience" 30 minutes before undertaking this job.
2 additional bottles of "patience" when upon completion you find coolant leaks the following morning from slipped out of place gaskets.
When 6 more hour have passed and your task is succesfuly completed (again) with no leaks you may kickback with a bottle of your favorite Kentucky Bourbon and say "NEVER AGAIN".

----------

And that's why I decided to throw $$$$ at my local Cadillac dealer, the experts, and let them do it (TWICE!).

 

[basscatt]

Thanks. I've found the procedure. I know that it is a pain in the ass but I should be able to do it.

I was just wondering if there would be any other things that should be replaced proactively while it is out. I do have a p0741 occasional (vac leak) somewhere.I wonder if it will be easier to locate.

=================================
I do have a p0741 occasional (vac leak) somewhere.
I wonder if it will be easier to locate.
P0741 is not a vacuum leak -

it is a transmission problem -
caused by worn seal deep in the trans -
preventing the torque converter from locking up -

the ONLY solution is to remove the trans -
replace the seal and torque converter -
then reinstall the trans -
typically a $2500 to $3500 repair -

 

[samert]

I was just wondering if there would be any other things that should be replaced proactively while it is out.

The coolant pipe fitting that threads into the rear of the crossover doesn't like to be messed with after several years. I just replaced my TCC Solenoid this weekend and once I disturbed that coolant pipe it started to leak. So I replaced the stock fitting with a brass pipe to barbed hose nipple fitting, a short pc of heater hose and a couple hose clamps. A new fitting and the pipe cost approx. $50.00 at the dealer or online but the dealer typically doesn't stock it at least in my area so its couple days wait for the parts unless you do the retrofit like I did today. it cost me about $10.00 for the retrofit parts.

You can read about the repair at this link, post #4.

http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/cadillac-deville-1985-2005-including-1985/680961-2003-deville-tcc-solenoid-replacement-cradle.html

 

[Innovator]

Yaemish, I replaced the crossover gaskets during my head gasket repair and a couple things I would suggest are:

1)Use silicone grease on the gaskets.They are in such a location that you want a long lasting repair, this will help assure that.

2)I noticed on the front most, block side bolts that the tapped holes actually go straight through into the coolant jacket, but the others do not.I discovered this when I had the heads off. I believe it to be a design or manufacturing error, since it serves no purpose.I cleaned the holes and the bolts and then applied a thread sealant to prevent leakage.Seeing as how you will have the heads remain on and won't be able to see into the jacket, I suggest doing this to ALL the bolts.

 

[Yaemish]

Thanks for the tips. I almost have it out after fighting with it all day. The last part that I'm unsure of how to remove is the tube connected in the back beneath where the egr connects. It looks like it has a fitting around it, I can't tell what size it is but it is larger than all my wrenches.

It also seems like it is leaking a bit when I moved the crossover around. How do I remove it and if it is leaking, what gets replaced?

 

[samert]

The last part that I'm unsure of how to remove is the tube connected in the back beneath where the egr connects. It looks like it has a fitting around it, I can't tell what size it is but it is larger than all my wrenches.

It also seems like it is leaking a bit when I moved the crossover around. How do I remove it and if it is leaking, what gets replaced?

Yaemish,
It sounds like you are referring to the coolant pipe fitting I was telling you about in post #6. It takes a 1- 1/16" wrench or socket but it's almost impossible to get a wrench or a socket on it with the crossover in the car. In the link below it's part #1 and the pipe is #2. The pipe has a plastic retainer that holds it in the fitting. There will be 2 tabs that you squeeze and then pull the pipe out of the fitting. Unfortunately, these 2 tabs get brittle and often break off when you try to squeeze them and then the pipe is hard to remove. If you can get the pipe out of the fitting then you should be able to remove the crossover from the engine. If it is leaking, its possible this could have been your coolant leak or it just started since you disturbed it.

http://parts.nalleygmc.com/showAssembly.aspx?ukey_assembly=387546&ukey_make=1023&ukey_model=14474&modelYear=2002&searchString=HOSES

 

[Yaemish]

I was able to get it off. It did crack but I was still able to release it. I found In another post that its a "quick disconnect". I wonder if I can just get a new one or if I have to do what you suggested. The pipe seems to be fine, I guess I don't understand what prompted you to engineer something different.

 

[samert]

I was able to get it off. It did crack but I was still able to release it. I found In another post that its a "quick disconnect". I wonder if I can just get a new one or if I have to do what you suggested.

I don't think you can buy the plastic "Quick Disconnect" retainer pc separately. I've only been able to purchase it from the dealer with the pipe. You will also need to replace the fitting that threads into the crossover that this pipe pushes into because inside the fitting there is an O-Ring for sealing on the pipe and below the O-Ring is a plastic sleeve that keeps the O-Ring in place and this plastic sleeve almost always has broken into several small pcs over time and may not even be in there anymore. I think its a combination of heat and the Dexcool antifreeze that destroys this plastic sleeve. Without the sleeve in there the O-Ring is not held in place correctly and when you push the pipe back in it will not seal properly.

The pipe seems to be fine, I guess I don't understand what prompted you to engineer something different.

Well......like you have just discovered, I also found this pipe hard to disconnect without breaking the plastic retainer. And since the fitting also needs to be replaced, it's almost impossible to just remove the fitting with the crossover in the car. It takes a couple days to order the pipe and fitting and I had a car tying up the bay in my shop, I was able to create a work around on a Sunday morning with parts from the local hardware that allowed me to complete the repair. Plus if it ever needs to be removed again, just simply remove the hose clamp and slide the hose off the pipe. No plastic quick disconnect retainer to possibly break again.

 

[Yaemish]

I'm gearing up to put this stupid thing back in. I want to get it right the first time. I found this thread, "Johnny-Cash" writes that a rubber o-ring goes between the quick connect and the other plastic part. I didn't see any rubber last night.

I did find a "GM Radiator Quick Connect" pack in 5/8" and 3/4" at Advanced Auto. The clear/white connector is what I just bought and it sits nicely into the black plastic ring I removed from the cross-over. Is this what is need? Do I need a rubber o-ring as well?

 

[samert]

I don't think that white plastic pc is the same as the one you broke while taking it apart. Compare it to the one that came off. That plastic pc needs to go on the pipe and snap over the rib on the pipe and I don't see the relief in the ID of that new pc you have to keep it on the pipe.

The black plastic pc looks like what should already be in the fitting that is threaded into the crossover, so I'm not sure you need that. Look in the fitting and you should see a groove at the top. That is where those 2 ribs on the OD of the quick disconnect snap into to hold the pipe in place. Then below the groove you should see that black pc then below that should be an O-ring and below that should be a plastic sleeve that keeps the O-ring between it and the 1st black plastic pc. If the sleeve is broken or missing altogether then the O-ring is allowed to just push down into the fitting too far and will not seal the pipe when it's pushed in.

Take a photo of the inside of the fitting and post it.

 

[Yaemish]

I need to clarify. The little black part in the pic was removed from the crossover; I will put it back in. I went back out and saw that the broken relief was still on the tube, by the photo you will see that it is very similar to the replacement white version. They fit the black plastic o-ring (pictured, removed from the crossover) the same. I think it is the same measurement as the orginal. Also, it appears to fit correctly into the grooves of the fitting.



I just looked in the fitting and there was a rubber o-ring. I pulled it out to inspect it and it appears to have been sitting on a piece of plastic. That plastic spacer crumbled when I moved the o-ring. I'm guessing that is probably bad and I won't be able to find a generic spacer.

The correct order should be fitting > crumbled black plastic > rubber o-ring > black plastic > new white disconnect? I missed the link to your original post. I get it! Great thinking. I'm off to Home Depot. Also, they need to make your fix a sticky. If those gaskets are shot and you are doing the job, the plastic is probably gone too.

 

[samert]

The correct order should be fitting > crumbled black plastic > rubber o-ring > black plastic > new white disconnect?

Yes, that is correct. So the plastic sleeve in the fitting has disintegrated. That unfortunately is what typically happens over time.

So you have a decision to make. Order the new fitting if you want to maintain the original setup or change it over to the brass barbed hose fitting and modify the pipe like what I did. If you decide to order the correct replacement fitting, I'm still not sure if your new white plastic disconnect is the right replacement for the one that broke. I suggest you put it onto the pipe and see if it snaps over the rib on the pipe and stays on the pipe. Then remove the fitting from the crossover, put the black plastic pc back in (don't worry about the O-ring) and snap the fitting onto the pipe and make sure the new white disconnect keeps it all together.

Wait...... I just went and looked at my old fitting and I think your new white plastic disconnect is the correct one. The 2 little retainer ears should snap over the rib on the pipe and that's what keeps it on the pipe and then they also snap into the groove in the fitting.

You still need the new threaded fitting. It will come with all the plastic pcs and O-ring already assembled. Is it possible that Advanced Auto has the fitting also?

 

[Innovator]

Definitely not worth all this trouble to put it back to the OEM config, which is a poor design to start with. Just install a standard barbed fitting and be done with it.

 

[samert]

Yaemish,
If you still want to go with the factory setup, I found this at NAPA. I think it's a direct replacement to your fitting.

 

[postman2000]

I am currently doing this on a 2002 STS..Thought it would be easier second time around..I did them on my 2000 Deville..No such luck...But if you doing it should order the plenum connecter to do while you have it apart..unless you have recently done that..I took off the EGr valve to clean it up a bit..If you plan on doing so then you should order the EGR gasket as well.Im doing everything that has anything to do with this coolant cross over while its out..Thermostat, water pump and whatever gaskets..i do not wanna see this side of this engine for a long time...all the little parts are cheap so it pays to do them while you have it apart..

 

[Caddy-EaRL]

Dorman 800-401 is the same I believe.

 

[postman2000]

Im also changing the water pump tensioner, pulley and belt...Can you tell how I dont wanna do anything else coolant related to this car anytime soon..Lol