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Discussion Starter #1
I posted recently about leasing a new Hyundai Genesis Ultimate after 12 yrs of Caddy leases. I frankly was maybetoo passionate about Caddy's recent changes to CTS pricing and their marketing approach in general, I felt like a
loyal customer who was (at least momentarily) forced from the brand.

Sent the letter below to Cadillac and was very disappointed in the response. Basically they sent a form letter 'thanking me for making comments on my SRX and that they were always happy to hear from their customers'.

I did not expect a letter from their new prez but thought maybe somebody would read my letter.

Anyway sincere good luck to those on the board. Cadillac is a proud name and I wish them well even though
I think they have lost their way.


April 21, 2015
Cadillac Customer Assistance Center P. O. Box 33169 Detroit, MI 48232-5169

Dear Sir or Madam:
As a loyal Cadillac customer for the last decade (3 CTS’s, 1 SRX) I am writing this to express my
disappointment and dismay with the current Cadillac marketing /pricing scheme that makes little sense to me.
My lease on the SRX will recently be completed and I was planning to replace it with a CTS. In the past I had
leased well equipped CTS vehicles with Performance Package. These were V6 powered and very well equipped with MSRP’s of $ 44.000- $47,000. I was shocked to find that a 2015 CTS AWD with Luxury Package (even
after recent price adjustments and additional options added) was a 55,000 car. This is with a 4 cylinder engine and 6 speed transmission. Desirable options for me such as mag ride, 18” wheels, heads up, and most
importantly 6 cylinder engine, suddenly makes this a $62,000 vehicle.

I get that the car is now longer and supposedly “competes” more fully with the E class and 5 Series and that
you now have the ATS which requires its own niche However, the precise market spot that the CTS served so
well for me has been abandoned and you seemingly expect former owners to ante up 10-15k to continue with
this model.
Considering the pricing of the XTS which is a larger car with V6 and many desirable options included (sorry it is not my ‘style’ and leasing support has not been very aggressive), the CTS pricing is a mystery and offers
questionable value. Somebody obviously thought they could instantly mark up pricing to MB, BMW, and Audi
levels. I see the marketplace has not responded favorably to this and the fact that 2014 CTS cars are being
reduced $10-14,000 is not reassuring to a potential 2015 owner.
Additionally, where I found both first and second generation CTS vehicles exciting and unique, I am lukewarm
on the new CTS styling and particularly don’t care for CUE and run flat tires (from previous BMW experience).I have heard of idle problems with 3.6 V6 and while a serviceable engine I can’t say I was ever impressed with
the engine/transmission performance overall. When I step on the accelerator on my SRX it is like stepping in a hole until power kicks in and I was surprised to see a similar effect on the 3.6 CTS I test drove.
Despite my original intent to stay with the Cadillac family, I will be leasing a new Hyundai Genesis. With every package offered the V6 AWD Genesis is approximately 3,000 less that the 2.0T Luxury I was looking at. My
lease payment will be 100 per month less for the Genesis than a 3.6 Luxury I just priced. The Genesis car has 8 speed transmission, 17 speaker Lexicon stereo, heads up display, full parking and safety tech features, 18”
wheels standard, is wider with longer wheelbase and has better warranty.
The bottom line was that this market segment ‘change’ for the CTS caused me to look at other vehicles in the mid luxury segment. The Genesis and Lexus GS 350 looked like strong values compared to the CTS.
My intent in sending this was not to engage in a debate over the merits of the products but simply to offer my perspective as a loyal Cadillac buyer who has been pushed into another direction because of current Cadillac
marketing.
Sincerely,
 

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Cadillac wants (actually, NEEDS) to anchor their spot in the luxury market, frankly, if you're shopping in the "mid" or "entry" luxury market, you're at best a "potential customer".

I don't recall ever seeing BMW, Mercedes, or Audi (or even Equus) advertising rebates or discounts on purchases - occasionally, they advertise lease deals, but they have manipulated the residual values to maintain resale prices.

Lexus, Acura, Infiniti, Genesis - see purchase incentives all the time.

By every objective measure, the new CTS is as good - or better - than the A6, E-class, and 5-series so why shouldn't they charge the same? (And in actual fact, Caddy is $5-10k cheaper for similarly equipped)
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Don't want to be argumentative but the market doesn't seem to feel that the CTS is an equal value to the E Class, A6 or 5 series. This
is represented in objective sales results, the need for drastic discounting to dump remaining 2014 models, and dropping a factory
shift.
What I do see (and several Caddy salespeople and managers I know agreed) was that they stepped away from their traditional healthyCTS customer base (they are also doing this with pricing to some extent with the ATS) thinking they could immediately compete with the higher end marques and so far the results are not good.
Just don't see how they are going to turn this around. They have reduced production and lowered prices. The car has been out for twoyears and has received good to great press (except for infamous CUE) and yet still hasn't gathered any sales momentum.
 

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I'm curious to what you were expecting back from Cadillac? Did you think they would have sent you a $10K coupon so that you could buy a 2015 CTS?

You leased a Hyundai--enjoy your Elantra loaners.
 

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I wouldn't take your response as argumentative, I think your assessment of the market is correct - but they have to start somewhere. Hindsight being 20/20, yes, they may have been a bit aggressive with the price increase, but to take the brand where they need it to go, they have to increase prices.

At least they got the product right first. The cars are true competitors now.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
I'm curious to what you were expecting back from Cadillac? Did you think they would have sent you a $10K coupon so that you could buy a 2015 CTS?

You leased a Hyundai--enjoy your Elantra loaners.
Just had hoped somebody would have read my letter before firing off a generic response which made no sense.

I own a new Mercedes and have owned several BMW's and I looked to lease the best vehicle for me regardless of 'prestige'. It turned
out to be the Genesis.They seem to have a better handle right now in making and marketing cars that they can actually sell. Based upon what I have seen in my first week of ownership I am very impressed. I was a long term (12 years) Caddy customer and wanted to remain one but their direction left me cold. I wanted the marque to succeed and have a product that continued to meet my needs.
No need to bash any car maker because frankly there are many making great cars.
 

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Mercedes is a Mercedes, Audi is an Audi, BMW is a BMW,,, Cadillac is a Chevy, GMC is a Chevy... This is the perception that causes Cadillac to have to sell there cars so much cheaper than Audi, BMW and Mercedes. When your BMW needs an oil change you go to the BMW dealer, When you Cadillac needs an oil change most people go to the Chevy dealer, as there are not many stand alone Cadillac dealers.
BS. I don't recall any Chevys with cut and sew interior or twin turbo V6s, and you would have to live somewhere pretty remote to even consider going to a Chevy dealer instead of Caddy.
 

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'Some' Cadillac dealers just need to re-invent themselves to provide a 'premier' experience that a proportionally higher number of other luxury makes achieve. My dealer is very good, but it is evident from this forum that this is surely not universal. Lexus came on the scene with a competitive car (not the best, but in the ballpark), offered exceptional buying/owning experience and made its own niche (others have followed); Cadillac (to an extent) rested on its laurels (pun not intended), created an exceptional performing car but fell a little flat with 'experience'. This, just my opinion (and surely the complete explanation goes deeper than my observation).
 

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Look carefully at that audi, it is a rebadged VW typically.

Mercedes is a Mercedes, Audi is an Audi, BMW is a BMW,,, Cadillac is a Chevy, GMC is a Chevy... This is the perception that causes Cadillac to have to sell there cars so much cheaper than Audi, BMW and Mercedes. When your BMW needs an oil change you go to the BMW dealer, When you Cadillac needs an oil change most people go to the Chevy dealer, as there are not many stand alone Cadillac dealers.
 

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I thought it was the other way around. LOL
The connotation that "VW" invokes a product that is crap, needs some qualification. Not to play devil's advocate, but the VW "family line", besides Audi, also includes Porsche and Bentley, and there's certainly nothing wrong with that. BTW, I owned a 2011 VW CC, and the drive and quality were excellent.
 

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The connotation that "VW" invokes a product that is crap, needs some qualification. Not to play devil's advocate, but the VW "family line", besides Audi, also includes Porsche and Bentley, and there's certainly nothing wrong with that. BTW, I owned a 2011 VW CC, and the drive and quality were excellent.
That wasn't the point. The OP expressed concern about his "premium" vehicle sharing components with "lesser" vehicles. Audi does this A LOT - every car is practically identical to a "VW" model at a 50% premium.
Porsche does it less, but there isn't much difference in a Cayenne and Toureg or Macan and Tiguan
 

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The OP did get left behind. The previous CTS was a tweener. The new CTS carries on the CTS name, but is really the new STS. The ATS is the new CTS. I think Cadillac messed up the naming here. I can see that they wanted to give their best car (car of the year winner) their best name (CTS), but it is too confusing to too many people. The new CTS and ATS are much better cars than the previous CTS, but you have to appreciate the chassis, (and the interior in the case of the new CTS) to see this. The sales manager gave me a long talk about who Cadillac doesn't want, and who they do want as buyers, and they seem to be willing to go through some pain to get there.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Sorry, but I can't fully agree with you. The ATS is definitely a smaller car than the 'old' CTS was.As such I did not see the ATS as an option at all. The new CTS is marginally larger than the old car but I (subjectively) did not see much advantages in rear seat room or trunk room in the new CTS. As far as interior of the new CTS I personally did not care for it. The CUE system left me cold and for me it (the interior style) was very similar to the SRX I had.
I guess I resent being told I cannot appreciate the chassis quality of the new CTS. I thought the normally aspirated 3.6 uninspiring with the 6A and I wasn't interested in the turbo four. Handling was great but IMO run flats are not ideal.
For kicks I checked the CTS inventory of my former dealer. It did not appear they had sold one CTS in two months.
Anyway I have moved on to the Genesis and have been truly impressed. This is a large car (a few inches longer than CTS but a few inches wider and a wheelbase about 4 " longer. When I went into a parking lot this morning a lady was taking a picture of the car and asking me what it was. Maybe Caddy has decided who they don't want as a customer but so far they haven't been able to attract who
they want.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
It's been a month of Genesis driving- I get more enthusiastic about this car every day.

I have had several people ask me what car this is commenting they thought it was a European exotic. This included my 7 series driving neighbor who drove the car and said 'I could have saved myself alot of money buying one of these'. Frankly had a twinge of ego
'concern' in buying a Hyundai but this has been eliminated.
Love Nav in that it is very intuitive AND I can enter locations while I drive. Granted I am comparing NAV from 2012 SRX but it frankly
sucked as far as display, control, function and this is a feature I use alot.
My SRX remote was very limited in distance (the dealer said that is just the way it was and had to do with sensor location). The
Genesis works from much farther away.

Fit finish has been every bit up to Caddy standards. I like the more traditional interior design much better but can't say the quality is
better or worse than Caddy,

One year Sirius, weather, traffic, stock market better than 90 days from Caddy I had.

Like having a spare, Did not have one on 2 CTS's one SRX.

Ride quality, quietness, all fantastic. I am sure the CTS handles better but on my limited test drive did not make a big impression.
Similarly power with 3.8 8 speed has been very pleasing.

For some idiotic reason no fog lamps with 3.8 Genesis. I am sure they will fix next year, Lighting is overall cool with an auto high beam
dimmer and light leveling.

Anyway know the Genesis talk is perhaps off base on this site. Will be happy to share problems if and when they develop. I loved my CTS's but had a large share of problems with three cars (numerous sensors, tires, TPMS, and rear end.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Congrats... I'm jealous, I can't wait to get rid of mine, which is coincidently in the dealership where it will probably be all week...
Thanks for the comment. My first CTS (not kidding) was in the shop like 10 times in three years. That said I still liked the car.
At least Caddy and Hyundai have some of the best warranties.
Good lunck.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Assume you would look at 5.0 and I would be jealous. Just could not pull the trigger without AWD availability. That said I am completely satisfied with acceleration and engine performance of my 3.8. A little growl and seamless accel with 8 speed.
Good luck on the AC odor - I can imagine this is a frustrating problem. As a sidebar GS 350 F was an interesting car. It was just out of
my lease numbers and I am not a huge Lexus fan but it combines some nice virtues and build quality for under 60g.
 

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Right, but you can get a gnarly V8 in a Chevy SS, but only a cheesy 2t V6 in a Caddy
I don't recall anywhere to factor in number of cylinders on a time sheet ... Just how fast you went... And 420>415 (weight is almost identical between the SS and CTS)
 
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