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Discussion Starter #1
I just got my Nav unit today. I was gonna install it in my non nav cts with bose system. I'm not so much a tech guy...so I went to my dealer today to ask them if they can do it for me. So when I'm there I find out that there's some other audio store who does all the Audio and Electronic install for GM. So I call them and tell them the whole deal...now comes the interesting part. They first tell me that they are not sure that its even possible (to transform a non nav to a nav). I said OK..:bigroll:...that's weird...then the guy says how do you know that the Nav will work? Now I got frustrated...I said what the hell are you talking about...its a Factory Nav why the hell won't it work? Then when I said that a lot of people from this forum has done it, he says he has no idea how that is possible....:eek:......so finally he tells me to call in tomorrow and talk to the "manager of tech" who can better answer my question. I also told them that I have all the instructions (from cadillacfaq) on how to intall it, but got the same answer...call in tomorrow....so now tell me guys what the hell is this??? Incompetence or what!!!!
By the way, I'm in Toronto, Ontario....if anybody around here did it, let me know where you did it!!!
Take Care!
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I never realised that dealers were so imcopetent....but after this I cannot agree with you more!!!!
 

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Okay, I'll be the guy with the unpopular view.
I agree that there are a lot of incompetent techs in the world and there are surely some at GM dealers too BUT.....
I have to point out that what you did is a little naive (sp). To think that all you have to do to install a particular option in a car that didn't come with it, is buy the actual component and pop it in is more than over simplification on your part. Not all cars come wired for all the options you know. There are different harnesses for different applications. For instance, years ago I bought a car without power door locks. They were an option, so I figured, how hard can it be to install them? Well let me tell you, after buying a ton of parts, and scavenging a few more from the local junkyard, I STILL had to custom wire the doors entirely myself.
As for the dealer subbing out certain jobs, it's actually quite common to have them sub out stuff like electronic installs, especially customized ones like yours.
And as for the stereo shop, first of all, I'm sure there's not a lot of Cadillac customers doing what you're doing, at least not enough locally to make it any kind of "common knowledge" retrofit, so it wouldn't surprise me at all to get the questioning reply you got. Plus think about it from their standpoint, you bring in a component you bought from someone else, and want it custom installed. Then you want them to use YOUR instaructions to install it and THEN you'll probably want them to guarantee the installation too. You see anything wrong with this? Any reason why even IF they could do the install, they might not WANT to?
 

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Installing the Nav unit in a not nav car is basically a cob job. Yes it can be done, is it 100% perfect install? Maybe, more probably 95% or less.

Its NOT a normal thing what you are asking them to do. Its more a do it yourself thing that YOU have to do. You could print out the on-line instructions and then give them to the install place, that may encourage them to try it, but its not like they can open a manual somewhere that tells them how to do it.
 

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Now the SMART thing for them to do would be to offer to sell you the nav and install it for you...

ITS CALLED A UPSELL... and its a service the dealers could offer to help them make $$... yet another way for them to make money... Instead they choose to say its not possible (which we all know it is- yes 95% ish- but good enough for most) and wont even give you the time of day...

Reed
 

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they wont touch it, since in theory it is not possible, since it is not 100% legit. So they cannot warrant it and such. they dont want to be bothered, they have better things to do like rip people on oil changes and brake pads and such.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I can live with the 95% probability and I also won't ask for any kind of warranty on the install (C'mon that's just absurd for this kind of install). But all I'm asking is for them to check out my stuff before flatly saying NO!! Don't you think that's just too pessimistic? I just remebered - When I got the car I asked them whether it was possible to take the car first and then put the NAV unit in, they said yes (this was because they did not have any in stock with Nav unit; so if I wanted one with Nav unit I had to wait almost 2 months). And now they are saying NO just becasue I did not buy it from them . Is that fair at all??
 

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My how times have changed. Years ago when the cars hit the dealers they were just about stripped by todays standards. A huge percentage of the options were dealer installs. In fact that is where the real money was made. The dealer got maybe 20% off the original sale but got to keep 40% of the dealer installs. Even stuff like A/C and deluxe heaters could be a dealer install. Engine and transmission packages were not. Radios were a vast array both OEM and aftermarket. The OEM stuff came as kits and included all wiring and instructions. It all plugged into existing harnesses or the harnesses were included in the kit.
 

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I don't think Incompetence is the label I'd apply. Liability is more like it. I seriously doubt you'd find a GM dealer anywhere who will install the Nav into a Non-Nav CTS. They'll all tell you it can't be done (even Delphi told me it couldn't be done, AFTER I told them I already did it), and that they're serialized for each car. One reason they won't is that the harnesses are not identical. GM does not make a harness for the retrofit, since the harnesses are pre-made and installed in the cars during assembly. The instructions on the FAQ are not complicated, but there is a risk of cutting the VSS wire, making your speedometer stop working. It takes balls to splice into the wiring harness of a brand new Cadillac, but it's not terribly difficult. If you have the instructions, why aren't you doing the install yourself, rather than selling the Nav? You only need to add one wire to make it functional (VSS).
 

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Discussion Starter #15
You gave the answer yourself odysseus on why I'm not doing it myself - "It takes balls to splice into the wiring harness of a brand new Cadillac" - I just don't have the balls to do it!!! So I guess the easy way to go is - SELL IT!!
 

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Not having done much research I thought I'd lightly address a couple of things and then offer a first hand view from a "dealer tech".

Now I haven't specifically researched your vehicle or what you are trying to do, but as a general rule it is not uncommon for pin assignments in the connectors to be NOT identical between models of radios. In fact they could be very different. That would require moving some wires around and doing some research to determine which wires need to go where. Plus to have a nav system you have to install a GPS antenna, which will require some component removal and installation of said device.

After all this is done, the radio has to be configured to operate properly with the equipment on your car. The scan tool may not want to cooperate, or it may go smoothly.

I know you guys like to modify your cars, but honestly for us techs it's hard enough to keep up with making the car work the way it was designed to operate from the factory. To "re-engineer" the car to work in a way that it wasn't designed takes a lot more time and resources than you might think.
They probably don't want to tie up a tech trying to check everything out and make sure it's going to work when it's all said and done.

Sure you may not be worried about a warranty but what if something else happens? What if they fry both radios in the process, are you going to be happy with that? What if they scratch your trim or mess something up? What they see is a giant can of worms and they don't want to take the lid off.
I suspect that it's possible but I wouldn't really want to get tied up in it either. I mean honestly, if that works what are you going to be asking them to do next!! LOL
(just kidding, but I think you see my point)

I hope it works out for you though. Good luck!
 

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:tisk: I understand your frustration. The first step was to contact the dealer, which you did. I would have had all the documentation from this forum regarding the install. Every time they said " it can't be done", I'd say, "I know for a fact it can be done". Once they put you in contact with the audio shop, things should have gotten easier. Audio shops do "custom" work all the time. This is what they do. They passed up an opportunity to make some easy money on this simple install. I assume "Miscreant" (former member) was the first ever to make the radio to DVD NAV swap. You couldn't ask for a simpler install for the basic NAV to function. More difficult to make the voice commands and NAV guidance to work. I understand "Miscreant" also solved this issue. Odysseus was the second to complete the wiring for the voice commands and NAV guidance. He's provided a "how to" to complete this mod. The same is true for the non HID light conversion to factory Xenons. Tomm and Mbai2 were the pioneers here. These are two examples of super simple mods that can be made to the CTS. What makes these two mods simple is the research of the members above. Both of these mods require additional wiring that would discourage most people from the start. Once it done, and laid out in easy to read and understand instructions with photos, with necessary parts and pieces, almost anyone can complete them. For those that don't frequent this forum, they don't have a clue. If you don't get satisfaction from the audio shop affiliated with your dealer, go elsewhere. Someone will finally realize how simple it is, and will get the job done. Good luck!
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Yes shaft I did read the FAQ before buying the NAV. To be honest I thought that the install would be a piece of cake for the dealers. I guess I was so confident that I did not even bother asking them about the install beforehand. I guess I did not do my research properly. I know what you guys are thingking...THIS GUY IS STUPID!!! I guess I agree with you guys, but hey mistakes happen - I'm only human you know!
 

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Nah, I was only asking becasue we just had a guy a month or so ago complaining that his nav didnt work. It sounded like he just put it in his dash and expected it to work. He had his back on ebay within a week. With so many navs on ebay it I bet there is a high percentage of people who buy them not knowing what they are getting into.
cadillacfaq is the only place I have seen install directions.
 
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