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Discussion Starter #1
I am posting this as a generally pleased and proud previous owner of three CTS's and recently a SRX. These aremy company supplied vehicles and leased so I do have some constraints when choosing my cars. All of the vehicles have been 3.6 performance package with upgraded wheels, NAV, sunroof etc.
When I visited my dealer to look at the new CTS I was shocked at the pricing of this car. The list prices of my
previous "loaded"cars were 45-47k. The 2015 2.0 luxury CTS was now 54,000+
While I was considering this vehicle lease I was frustrated and felt 'cheated' that this vehicle had 4 cylinder
power 17 wheels, 6 speed tranny, etc.I looked around and am going to lease a Hyundai Genesis 2015. With a
list of 52,500 it has 6 cylinder, 8 speed automatic, heads up display, full traffic safety features, and a Lexicon 17speaker stereo. It is wider than the CTS and has a 4" longer wheel base and has better warranty.
The residual and money back are better than the CTS also (CTS currently only offers 750 dealer money on
2015). Cadillac seems to be wringing their hands on this car and the ATS by shutting production and limiting
lease incentives.

I calculated that a similarly equipped CTS would be 65k!

Despite apparently being a great car I don't think it takes a genius to understand why sales have tanked so thoroughly.
Too bad Caddy did not present a modest price increase and raise prices if and when the CTS caught on. As it is the car was DOA and apparently the also pricey ATS had had a similar fate recently.
Overall their pricing is inconsistent between models with a loaded ATS as much as an XTS.
Really wish Cadillac had not driven me out of the fold but I wish them luck in seeking their new target consumer whoever that is.
Thought they had a good product at fair price until their new president thought he could topple MB and BMW
overnight.
 

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2014 CTS 3.6 Luxury
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You can still get great deals on 2014 CTSs. I picked up my Luxury 3.6 for $34k and couldn't be happier. Don't know I'd pay $52k for a Hyundai.
 

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2010 CTS Premium AWD 3.6 DI (Sold)
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My brother has a 2015 Genesis and it is a compelling alternative to the CTS. I looked at his and I was very impressed! Even with the V6 AWD it has plenty of pull. I also believe there is a bump up in dealer experience that Hyundai provides Genesis buyers that is probably better than I received at my Cadillac dealer which is roughly the same I got from the Cvevrolet dealer on my Corvette.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Appreciate the comments. My dad actually had one of the early Genesis cars and was impressed. The new ones seem that much better.
As far as pricing, if I was buying and could get 15,000 off that might open up some options. But this is a lease and currently the 2015
2.0 luxury is as far as I can go up the CTS chain. It is approx 40 a month more than the Genesis and I know the dealer is doing everythinghe can to keep me in the brand. As stated I was pretty much narrowed in on another Caddy. Lack of NAV initially on the car I wanted (it was deleted for some reason) and then 2.0 4 banger along with price really got me thinking about how I could do better outside of Caddy for same money.

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Here you but locked in lease and 2014 not in the mix. If I could get a 2014 with all the goodies on a competitive lease I would certainly look at it.Kind of funny in a way. 52,000 for a Genesis,that is exactly how I felt about potentially spending 65,000 fora CTS.
 

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Cadillac CT6 (2019)
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While I agree Cadillac was way-too aggressive with the new CTS pricing, and it appears you know what you don't like about the CTS, you do presume that the Genesis will be all things positive; I hope you come back and relay your experiences with the Hyundai (and see whether it gives you the 'Full Monty', or not). Personally (my butt) is not going to be in a Hyundai (and that is just one brand on my list, there are others that I won't bore anyone with).
 

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Discussion Starter #6
I have spent a lot of time giving thought to this and thought I would add additional comments. They are just my opinions.

Major diff at same price point 4cyl vs 6 cyl. 6 speed vs 8 speed

Warranty for HDai is better. Caddy free maintenance is great but company pays for this so not a factor

I like the Genesis interior better- much more room in back. More of an old luxury car feel with some knobs, analog clock, etc instead of
the CUE which does not turn me on. The Caddy materials are maybe a half a notch more refined (leather and stitching)

Expanded lane avoidance, Head's up display, sun shades, 17 speaker stereo with CD - Genesis options are superior at same price point

Love the Genesis front - Caddy is cool also probably nod to Genesis
CTS IMO has nicer rear end

Overall styling a toss up- I did find myself mistaking ATS for CTS

Bottom line is I like both vehicles but price/ value is a no brainer for Hyundai.

Thanks for putting up with my comments. Wouldn't bother if I was not so frustrated with Caddy's latest pricing/ marketing.

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Fair enough. As an STS owner I would think you would appreciate the decision to not go with a 4 cylinder (even turbo). In the past I ruled out the "base" 5 series and Audi 6 because I thought a mid size luxury car should have a 6 cylinder. On this go around that is what the CTS offered in my price range. The 2.0T badging on trunk just did not seem right on a Cadillac.
 

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2014 CTS 3.6 Luxury
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I would visit the Genesis forums before buying. I'm sure Genesis's have their fair share of issues, as do Caddys. Good luck with your purchase and let us know how you like the Genesis.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
I would visit the Genesis forums before buying. I'm sure Genesis's have their fair share of issues, as do Caddys. Good luck with your purchase and let us know how you like the Genesis.
Have been on the Genesis forums and things look pretty good. My first CTS was in the shop like 11 times for service but I really liked
the car and had no long term distaste for Cadillac. I had a passion for my CTS's and was excited to get them equipped the way they
were. I kind of lost that but it is renewed with the Genesis (at least so far).
 

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14 CTS 2.0T, (traded 08 CTS 3.6)
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I say get what you think will work best for you and best of luck to you.

Just out of curiosity I went to the Genesis forum and it's filled with concerns about option availability and mechanical problems with the cars. While I was at it, I checked out a 5-series forum and one of the sticky posts is a consolidation of known problem areas (15 of them of varying seriousness). Surprisingly, the CTS comes up in several posts getting respect, but covering the range from it either being a serious competitor or an old man's car (more a reference to the brand).

If you're leasing, I don't know why you are concerned about the warranty but not the free maintenance? But whatever, enjoy whatever you choose.
 

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2010 CTS Premium AWD 3.6 DI (Sold)
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"While I was at it, I checked out a 5-series forum and one of the sticky posts is a consolidation of known problem areas (15 of them of varying seriousness)."

Remember the BMW 5-series sales volume is more than double that of the CTS so you will see more posts. BMW 3/4 series sales may be more than Cadillac overall..

PS: CTS sales were down over 48% last month to only 1,500 deliveries while Guinesis sales for March 2015 are 3,064!

Also a note on the "robust" Cadillac sales:

In the United States, Cadillac is pleased to announce an initiative to expand its service loaner/courtesy car program to support the customer experience at Cadillac stores across the country. Cadillac dealers have expanded their courtesy transportation fleets by approximately 1,000 additional units, which are reflected in March sales. The revised program further aligns Cadillac to meet customer expectations for courtesy transportation, providing newer, fresher vehicles to Cadillac owners while their vehicles are being serviced, and reducing utilization of daily rental cars for this purpose
 

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2017 MB C300 Cabriolet, 2019 Volvo V90CC
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"While I was at it, I checked out a 5-series forum and one of the sticky posts is a consolidation of known problem areas (15 of them of varying seriousness)."

Remember the BMW 5-series sales volume is more than double that of the CTS so you will see more posts. BMW 3/4 series sales may be more than Cadillac overall..

PS: CTS sales were down over 48% last month to only 1,500 deliveries while Guinesis sales for March 2015 are 3,064!

Also a note on the "robust" Cadillac sales:

In the United States, Cadillac is pleased to announce an initiative to expand its service loaner/courtesy car program to support the customer experience at Cadillac stores across the country. Cadillac dealers have expanded their courtesy transportation fleets by approximately 1,000 additional units, which are reflected in March sales. The revised program further aligns Cadillac to meet customer expectations for courtesy transportation, providing newer, fresher vehicles to Cadillac owners while their vehicles are being serviced, and reducing utilization of daily rental cars for this purpose

Careful, you're mixing your beer with your cars....

This reminded me of a back and forth I had with a Azera owner a couple of years ago on Edmunds.com. I was talking down his Azera and he was talking down my 300C. He claimed the Azera did everything the Chrysler did for thousands less. My comment was that I was sure Rosie ODonnell can do everything Michelle Pfeiffer can do. But I'd still rather take home Ms Pfeiffer.

You have to factor in image and just like Cadillac doesn't quite have the image of Mercedes, Hyundai doesn't quite have the image of Cadillac no matter what the ad men say. The only question left open is are you willing to pay extra for that image.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
I say get what you think will work best for you and best of luck to you.

Just out of curiosity I went to a Genesis forum and it's filled with concerns about option availability and mechanical problems with the cars. While I was at it, I checked out a 5-series forum and one of the sticky posts is a consolidation of known problem areas (15 of them of varying seriousness). Surprisingly, the CTS comes up in several posts getting respect, but covering the range from it either being a serious competitor or an old man's car (more a reference to the brand).

If you're leasing, I don't know why you are concerned about the warranty but not the free maintenance? But whatever, enjoy whatever you choose.
Thanks for your comments. On my lease because of mileage the factory warranty runs out on the Caddy not the Hyundai(57,000 mile lease) . You are
right somebody else is paying for any work so it is not a major concern. But it is nice to be under warranty. On my present SRX the
power steering is crazy noisy when cold. Also have had ongoing TPMS probs. Other than that no issues.

Hyundai has come along way but it will always be known first for low cost vehicles. If the Genesis performs well for me and I like its styling and features I really could care less what the name on the badge says.
 

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2015 CTS4 Premium, Obsession Red Tintcoat, Kona Brown Int.
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This past December I was faced with the same tradeoffs: 2015 CTS Premium or the new Genesis. I ended up with the CTS. The huge price difference between the Cadillac and the Hyundai made it a very hard decision: I'm nothing if not cheap!

Having a 2013 XTS Premium, I wanted a smaller car. The Genesis was bigger (longer) than the CTS, heavier than the CTS (I have to have AWD and that was what excited me about the 2015 Genesis in the first place). I also wanted fold down rear seats (FDRS). Not available on the Genesis. Granted, one doesn't get a lot more room for hauling "stuff" in the trunk of a CTS (unlike the XTS, which is cavernous!), but they do come in handy and I wanted them. The lack of FDRS also ruled out the Lexus GS350.

There is also the "prestige" factor of having a Cadillac parked in the driveway vs. Hyundai. The Hyundai dealer brought it up and addressed it directly. He said potential customers from Medina (Bill Gates country) come in to see the Genesis, think it is a great value, but just can't make the mental jump to cruising up to the country club in a Hyundai.

When I bought the XTS in late 2012 I traded in a 2008 BMW 535xi. Bad decision since I wanted a CTS, but was too impatient to wait for the 2014 CTS refresh.

If you can afford it, buy the car you really want. Ignore the "prestige factor". The Genesis is a great value, well-equipped, and appearst to be well put-together, too. But, the CTS is a fantastic vehicle, too.

I've had my CTS since 12/26/2014 and have about 3,700 miles on it, including a road trip from the Seattle area to Lake Tahoe. The CTS is an awesome car. Better than the BMWs I have owned. I've had absolutely no problems with it. Cadillac of Bellevue, has been great to me and appears to treat its other customers at least just as well and I highly recommend them.

Good luck with your decision!
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Thanks for sharing your thoughts in detail I hope I was clear that I liked the CTS and was not bashing the car but only the Caddy
marketing approach and the value now presented. Since I will lease in April I am waiting to see the 'programs' for both cars. My
perspective in leasing (and having someone else paying for it) is no doubt different than someone throwing their own money at a
product.
I've wrestled with the image thing. I agree for the most part Caddy has a certain cachet. The Genesis is very subtle now in that they
have removed any Hyundai logo (except for the ugly H in back and the dealers are already replacing that with the Aston like Genesis
winged logo- sign me up),That said, if I went with 2.0 luxury my 'fear' is that I will be driving it saying- hey it would be cool to have
the heads up, and a 6, and 8 speed tranny and 17 speaker stereo etc etc.
At my current lease price point I feel that Caddy has reduced the product that I can now afford- product I was happy with in the past.
With their declining sales you thing they would whack the lease program to make a 6 cylinder premium more affordable.
The XTS offers a great value but it is bigger than I need and I would like an AWD and a bit more sporty persona.
For me the 3.6 performance would be a great vehicle and similar to what I had leased in the past. The pricing has moved on
unfortunately and made me rethink what I am getting for my money. The poster who wrote about his wife's 300C made a good point.
Here is a car with Hemi power,large size and optioned out and it is offered art well under CTS 4 banger prices.
 

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Very nice car. With options I would want it is 65,000 vs. 52,500 for comparable Genesis. Genesis would still have 8 speed
auto. I still have some trouble telling CTS from ATS. Especially front and sides.
Looks like the 2016 CTS will actually get a GM 8 spd tranny compared to the Aisan sourced unit they use now. Maybe we will also see the 8 spd finally in AWD.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Not sure how you figure. I have seen this video and it is a V Sport CTS with all the bells and whistles. At the end of the test they say
the CTS is a better car but Genesis is what they would probably buy because of the value. My choice was (is) a 2.0 Luxury about
15,000 less than V -sport. Although I could probably opt for the 5.0 Genesis I wanted AWD. As stated multiple times my 'apples to apples' comparison is heavily stacked in favor of the Genesis. Otherwise, if somebody would give me a free car I would take a 71,000
CTS V sport over a 57,000 5.0 Genesis without much thought.
 
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