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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I ordered our Escalade today and the only option I was not sure about was diesel. I'm concerned it won't have enough pep and responsiveness at highway speeds. I have a 2021 F350 with the 6.7L turbo diesel and it is flat out the BEST engine I have ever had the pleasure to drive. I mean the power and responsiveness is insane. It doesn't matter if you are coming off the line or going 70 on the freeway, there is always more power and it is damn near instant. These turbo diesel are nothing like they were 10 years ago. The "diesel delay" is nowhere to be found and it isn't much louder than the gas versions.

However, GM went a different route and seems to have targeted mpg more than performance. I just cannot imagine that a 3L with 275 horses will have the same responsiveness and power (or even close to it) as the 6.2L 8 cylinder. I would love to get the diesel but don't want to take the chance on it being sluggish at higher RPMS. I realize the torque is the same and I realize the torque (like all diesels) comes on at much lower RPMs. I'm sure it's great in the city but what about highway driving? If GM had opted for a more powerful diesel there would be no doubt that I would have ordered it.

If anyone has taken delivery or test driven the diesel I'd love to hear your opinion. We have about a week to make any changes to our order.
 

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Find a suburban at a dealer with the diesel. I see those here and there. Take one for a test drive and make up your mind. Looking at test results from 0-60 and quarter mile, the diesel is definitely slower. Don't forget, whatever money you save on fuel, you will pay extra on maintenance. Under warranty, I wouldn't be too worried. When you need to start paying for the repairs, it quickly gets expensive. I own a 10 bay shop and I know first hand when small diesels like Mercedes, Jeep, and Dodge truck 3.0L start throwing codes, it can quickly turn into thousands of dollars of repair bills. That pays for a lot of gasoline. Just my opinion.
 

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The horsepower numbers for both engines are meaningless. The V8 likely makes that number near red line and falls off fast down low. Most escalades will never have pedal to floor long enough to come near that number. And TBH, a modern engine that large that only makes that number is a little embarrassing.

Torque is what gets you down the road. In the rpm range where you'll be living 99% of the time the diesel is just a more powerful engine. For highway cruising I much prefer the diesel that can just roll into the power and doesn't need to downshift constantly. When you're making your full potential of torque at cruising rpm, increasing your speed by 10mph or so is a much easier task when you don't need to shift and double your rpm to do it. Find a Tahoe and drive it and you'll have no doubt.

I have a super duty with the 6.7 as well, if you like the way yours makes power and drives you'll like the diesel in this as well. As a no cost option it was a no brainer for me. Most people who rip on diesels have never driven one.
 

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The horsepower numbers for both engines are meaningless. The V8 likely makes that number near red line and falls off fast down low. Most escalades will never have pedal to floor long enough to come near that number. And TBH, a modern engine that large that only makes that number is a little embarrassing.

Torque is what gets you down the road. In the rpm range where you'll be living 99% of the time the diesel is just a more powerful engine. For highway cruising I much prefer the diesel that can just roll into the power and doesn't need to downshift constantly. When you're making your full potential of torque at cruising rpm, increasing your speed by 10mph or so is a much easier task when you don't need to shift and double your rpm to do it. Find a Tahoe and drive it and you'll have no doubt.

I have a super duty with the 6.7 as well, if you like the way yours makes power and drives you'll like the diesel in this as well. As a no cost option it was a no brainer for me. Most people who rip on diesels have never driven one.
What he said.

Don’t forget, there’s a 10-speed gearbox involved here too. After living with the 6.2L for 4K miles now, I’d bet it’s been over 4K RPM maybe 20 times? It lives in that 1500-2500 range and the gearbox keeps it there. Torque is the number that will be meaningful.

That said, the second there’s a bolt-on supercharger for this, it’s going in. 420 HP is stupid low for a truck this size. Almost funny When you floor it, hear the V-8 get all wound up, and barely move.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
The horsepower numbers for both engines are meaningless. The V8 likely makes that number near red line and falls off fast down low. Most escalades will never have pedal to floor long enough to come near that number. And TBH, a modern engine that large that only makes that number is a little embarrassing.

Torque is what gets you down the road. In the rpm range where you'll be living 99% of the time the diesel is just a more powerful engine. For highway cruising I much prefer the diesel that can just roll into the power and doesn't need to downshift constantly. When you're making your full potential of torque at cruising rpm, increasing your speed by 10mph or so is a much easier task when you don't need to shift and double your rpm to do it. Find a Tahoe and drive it and you'll have no doubt.

I have a super duty with the 6.7 as well, if you like the way yours makes power and drives you'll like the diesel in this as well. As a no cost option it was a no brainer for me. Most people who rip on diesels have never driven one.
Torque is important, don't get me wrong, but HP numbers are not meaningless. I guess you could say they are if you also know the displacement because you don't really need to know both, and in this case, the displacement for the diesel is what I'm worried about. The diesel is 2.6 seconds slower 0 to 60 than the V8 gas yet they produce the same torque. It looks like my concerns were correct. The way I like to drive that will be a problem. I like there to be quickness all throughout the range. I wish Cadillac would have given us the option of the monster 6.6L turbo diesel they put in their HD trucks.

To the guys who opted for the diesel, congrats, it looks like there isn't a wrong choice here, just a matter of how you drive and what you enjoy when you drive and what is important to you. I'm sticking with the V8 this time around.
 

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Torque is important, don't get me wrong, but HP numbers are not meaningless. I guess you could say they are if you also know the displacement because you don't really need to know both, and in this case, the displacement for the diesel is what I'm worried about. The diesel is 2.6 seconds slower 0 to 60 than the V8 gas yet they produce the same torque. It looks like my concerns were correct. The way I like to drive that will be a problem. I like there to be quickness all throughout the range. I wish Cadillac would have given us the option of the monster 6.6L turbo diesel they put in their HD trucks.

To the guys who opted for the diesel, congrats, it looks like there isn't a wrong choice here, just a matter of how you drive and what you enjoy when you drive and what is important to you. I'm sticking with the V8 this time around.
If “the way you like to drive” is with your foot to the floor (or in any other way that exploits horsepower), you’re in the wrong car. You’re going to be sorely disappointed in the gas engine. It’s a joke. “Quickness all through the range” is a hilarious thought with this thing.
 

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Horsepower number without a curve plotted with rpm is in fact meaningless. Take it from someone who used to race 2 stroke motocross bikes and make jokes about power bands. It's a peak number that never happens in real world. The 6.2 does not make power all through the range. 0-60 running through gears with foot to floor has almost no real world application for a family SUV. The bigger diesel engines in HD trucks would be too heavy to give you the ride and handling you want and that's if they could find a way to get them to fit in the first place.
 

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Horsepower number without a curve plotted with rpm is in fact meaningless. Take it from someone who used to race 2 stroke motocross bikes and make jokes about power bands. It's a peak number that never happens in real world. The 6.2 does not make power all through the range. 0-60 running through gears with foot to floor has almost no real world application for a family SUV.
Ding, ding, ding.
 

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A 5.0l V8 diesel is the perfect size for this truck. GM had one on the drawing board for a long time but stepped away from it. My concern would be passing someone on a 2 lane rd. I've had many different diesels and my daily driven is a Mercedes R350 3.0 l. diesel. It got stage 1 programmed with all the filters and piss taken out. Works great, but over 65mph passing someone, it runs out of steam. I have to tell you though, my '15ESV feels quicker off the line to 60 than the '21 ESV.
 

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I ordered our Escalade today and the only option I was not sure about was diesel. I'm concerned it won't have enough pep and responsiveness at highway speeds. I have a 2021 F350 with the 6.7L turbo diesel and it is flat out the BEST engine I have ever had the pleasure to drive. I mean the power and responsiveness is insane. It doesn't matter if you are coming off the line or going 70 on the freeway, there is always more power and it is damn near instant. These turbo diesel are nothing like they were 10 years ago. The "diesel delay" is nowhere to be found and it isn't much louder than the gas versions.

However, GM went a different route and seems to have targeted mpg more than performance. I just cannot imagine that a 3L with 275 horses will have the same responsiveness and power (or even close to it) as the 6.2L 8 cylinder. I would love to get the diesel but don't want to take the chance on it being sluggish at higher RPMS. I realize the torque is the same and I realize the torque (like all diesels) comes on at much lower RPMs. I'm sure it's great in the city but what about highway driving? If GM had opted for a more powerful diesel there would be no doubt that I would have ordered it.

If anyone has taken delivery or test driven the diesel I'd love to hear your opinion. We have about a week to make any changes to our order.
I had the same dilemma of gas v.s. diesel, plus I was equally torn between the black or white exterior. I test drove a Silverado with the Diesel and loved the instant fuel mileage shown while driving, but still wasn't 100% sold that I'd want to hear my Escalade making that diesel clatter even if it COULD go 600 miles on a full tank. Like any turbo, the acceleration wasn't immediate, but once it kicked in... IT KICKED IN at least on surface streets, I can't speak to highway passing. The Silverado was quiet enough inside, and I'd hope the Escalade has added sound deadening for a luxury truck, to further drown out the louder engine.

Ultimately, I submitted my order last month for the white model with diesel just to get into the ordering queue. In the weeks to come, I'll continue to scan local dealers online to see if any have a diesel model I can stop by and take a look at. I'm told nothing on my order is set in stone until it's been assigned a build number by GM, so (unfortunately), I should have PLENTY of time...
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
If “the way you like to drive” is with your foot to the floor (or in any other way that exploits horsepower), you’re in the wrong car. You’re going to be sorely disappointed in the gas engine. It’s a joke. “Quickness all through the range” is a hilarious thought with this thing.
Lmao, I find it hilarious that you have no idea a SUV can, relatively speaking, feel quick or feel like you are driving a boat through mud. I've made that mistake before and won't make it again. The diesel has torque down low in the RPM range but will not feel quick and sporty at highway speeds (FOR A HUGE SUV). That is what I meant and it is true. You either care about that or you don't.

The diesel has a 2.5 second slower 0 to 60. That will be felt, regardless of your feelings (which appear to be hurt because somebody didn't like your choice in engines).
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
A 5.0l V8 diesel is the perfect size for this truck. GM had one on the drawing board for a long time but stepped away from it. My concern would be passing someone on a 2 lane rd. I've had many different diesels and my daily driven is a Mercedes R350 3.0 l. diesel. It got stage 1 programmed with all the filters and piss taken out. Works great, but over 65mph passing someone, it runs out of steam. I have to tell you though, my '15ESV feels quicker off the line to 60 than the '21 ESV.
I agree. But they have a great 6.6L that would have been awesome as well. That is probably overkill but this is their flagship! All I can think is they are trying to get ahead of the EPA and the continual tightening of the noose in regards to emissions. The fact that they chose such a small diesel for such a massive and heavy vehicle means it is all about MPG and they most definitely achieved that. I found some reviews that hinted at exactly what you are (and me) concerned about. At highway speeds don't expect much.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Horsepower number without a curve plotted with rpm is in fact meaningless. Take it from someone who used to race 2 stroke motocross bikes and make jokes about power bands. It's a peak number that never happens in real world. The 6.2 does not make power all through the range. 0-60 running through gears with foot to floor has almost no real world application for a family SUV. The bigger diesel engines in HD trucks would be too heavy to give you the ride and handling you want and that's if they could find a way to get them to fit in the first place.
The HD trucks are a very similar platform. Why wouldn't they be able to fit that engine in basically the same amount of space? Even if they didn't want to try and fit the 6.6L in, 3L is quite the compromise don't you think? Why not the 5L they were working on? I suspect it has everything to do with EPA emissions.

I agree, without seeing it plotted you don't get the full picture, but to try and say a vehicle that goes 0 to 60 2.5 seconds slower is actually just as quick but just not in that one metric doesn't make sense. You wouldn't have to run through the gears with foot on the floor to be able to feel and appreciate the faster V8. That increased power will be felt in many, many different driving situations. The V8 will be quicker through most of the range otherwise it would not beat the diesel so severely from 0 to 60. This is just common sense. My point though, was that people these days think all they need to know is the torque. That isn't true either. Case in point, you have two engines with the same torque, yet one is much faster than the other.

I've had SUVs that had no get up and go to them and it blows, hard. Not saying that this diesel is like that, but I'd rather not chance it when the reviews I've seen have said the V8 feels more responsive and quick (relatively speaking). I don't care about MPG (other than having to fill up more often) so I'd rather have a quicker (relatively speaking and in most, but not all situations) SUV.
 

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Lmao, I find it hilarious that you have no idea a SUV can, relatively speaking, feel quick or feel like you are driving a boat through mud. I've made that mistake before and won't make it again. The diesel has torque down low in the RPM range but will not feel quick and sporty at highway speeds (FOR A HUGE SUV). That is what I meant and it is true. You either care about that or you don't.

The diesel has a 2.5 second slower 0 to 60. That will be felt, regardless of your feelings (which appear to be hurt because somebody didn't like your choice in engines).
An SUV certainly can. We cross-shopped this with an X7 M50i and GLS 580, both of which fit the bill (especially the BMW). However, this SUV cannot. It’s a boat. It’s horribly underpowered even as a boat that is mated to a gearbox specifically designed to do the opposite of what you are describing. If you are expecting anything even remotely approaching a “sporty feel” (anywhere in the power band or at any speed), you are buying the wrong car. But, do what you’d like.
 

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I've had SUVs that had no get up and go to them and it blows, hard. Not saying that this diesel is like that, but I'd rather not chance it when the reviews I've seen have said the V8 feels more responsive and quick (relatively speaking). I don't care about MPG (other than having to fill up more often) so I'd rather have a quicker (relatively speaking and in most, but not all situations) SUV.
This is a hilarious comment for someone making a horsepower argument. You’re literally describing torque here.
 

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Abundantly clear that some of you have not driven a similar platform vehicle with both engines in them, that's OK, but just admit it.....

The HD 6.6L and other large diesel engines have nothing to do with the truck they're in and everything to do with towing. Are you planning on pulling a 30,000 lb trailer with your escalade?

Part of what I think is hilarious about this discussion is those of you arguing the 6.2 V8 is some kind of sporty engine. I guess this is why they keep putting that old tech V8 out there and advertising peak HP numbers and 0-60 times..... still pulling in the target demo with it.

The way I see it, with the diesel I get better range, mileage, smooth power that works well for the kind of driving this thing was made for, and the performance is basically a wash. Going to take something a lot more powerful than this naturally aspirated 6.2 to make me feel like I'm sacrificing anything significant in terms of real world power.
 

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Abundantly clear that some of you have not driven a similar platform vehicle with both engines in them, that's OK, but just admit it.....

The HD 6.6L and other large diesel engines have nothing to do with the truck they're in and everything to do with towing. Are you planning on pulling a 30,000 lb trailer with your escalade?

Part of what I think is hilarious about this discussion is those of you arguing the 6.2 V8 is some kind of sporty engine. I guess this is why they keep putting that old tech V8 out there and advertising peak HP numbers and 0-60 times..... still pulling in the target demo with it.

The way I see it, with the diesel I get better range, mileage, smooth power that works well for the kind of driving this thing was made for, and the performance is basically a wash. Going to take something a lot more powerful than this naturally aspirated 6.2 to make me feel like I'm sacrificing anything significant in terms of real world power.
Ding, ding, ding, AGAIN.

Wait, you mean to tell me that a push-rod small block V-8 tied to a 10-speed transmission WITH DFM is NOT a sporty engine?! Get. Out. lol.

It's weird that they put the L87 in all of their high-performance vehicles, then! GM 6.2 Liter V8 EcoTec3 L87 Engine

The only thing sporty about this truck is one of the styling trim packages. The powertrain is the farthest thing from it. You're 1000% right about the target demo on 0-60, though (literally spit out my coffee this morning reading that).

Cheers.
 

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We had a diesel GL a few years ago which was rated with more torque than the gas TTV6 counterpart. If you are easy on the pedal you will not notice a difference but once you want to get a jump off a light or pass someone when moving you really miss the extra power. And no, a diesel does NOT pass better at highway speeds. I went on a road trip with my buddy and our families and he had the same year GL but with the gas TT V6. While I crushed him gas mileage wise it was comical how faster he was on the highway. Now I know it's a different make but a diesel is a diesel.

One of the main reasons I didn't get a 6th Escalade and went with a Nav is the engine. The 6.2 is unbecoming in a $100k truck. It's rough at idle and sounds like it will grenade any second when pushing it hard. I was hoping GM would go the Nav's route and do a nice 3.5L TTV6 pushing 500hp/550tq. That would be the best of both worlds. Great gas mileage (I average 22mpg in my extended Nav at 75mph, at that speed my ESV would get 17) very smooth and refined and gobs of low torque AND power. The engine just pulls and pulls and sounds great in the process. Hopefully the 6.2L is just a bandaid and GM is working on a better drivetrain but to fully redesign an all new truck and go with the same 14 year old engine is beyond me.

But back to diesel. One major thing no one talks about is refueling. I found that to be the biggest damn problem. First you have to learn which stations have a diesel pump and then you have to get in line for that one diesel pump at the station. God forbid you pull up to the one damn pump and the twit in a Jetta or even a regular gas car went inside to get some snacks, take a dump or line up the next streetwalker for the evening. Or maybe it's a landscaping truck filling up 100 gallons in the truck and (10) 5 gallon cans. By the time you are done you could have charged up a Tesla. The other issue is the pumps are dirty as hell, so bring disposable gloves.

In summary- Diesels get great mpg, are loud, have torque but are not magic unicorns and suck at refilling. Primary targeted buyers- mpg at all costs and those that tow.
 

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We had a diesel GL a few years ago which was rated with more torque than the gas TTV6 counterpart. If you are easy on the pedal you will not notice a difference but once you want to get a jump off a light or pass someone when moving you really miss the extra power. And no, a diesel does NOT pass better at highway speeds. I went on a road trip with my buddy and our families and he had the same year GL but with the gas TT V6. While I crushed him gas mileage wise it was comical how faster he was on the highway. Now I know it's a different make but a diesel is a diesel.

One of the main reasons I didn't get a 6th Escalade and went with a Nav is the engine. The 6.2 is unbecoming in a $100k truck. It's rough at idle and sounds like it will grenade any second when pushing it hard. I was hoping GM would go the Nav's route and do a nice 3.5L TTV6 pushing 500hp/550tq. That would be the best of both worlds. Great gas mileage (I average 22mpg in my extended Nav at 75mph, at that speed my ESV would get 17) very smooth and refined and gobs of low torque AND power. The engine just pulls and pulls and sounds great in the process. Hopefully the 6.2L is just a bandaid and GM is working on a better drivetrain but to fully redesign an all new truck and go with the same 14 year old engine is beyond me.

But back to diesel. One major thing no one talks about is refueling. I found that to be the biggest damn problem. First you have to learn which stations have a diesel pump and then you have to get in line for that one diesel pump at the station. God forbid you pull up to the one damn pump and the twit in a Jetta or even a regular gas car went inside to get some snacks, take a dump or line up the next streetwalker for the evening. Or maybe it's a landscaping truck filling up 100 gallons in the truck and (10) 5 gallon cans. By the time you are done you could have charged up a Tesla. The other issue is the pumps are dirty as hell, so bring disposable gloves.

In summary- Diesels get great mpg, are loud, have torque but are not magic unicorns and suck at refilling. Primary targeted buyers- mpg at all costs and those that tow.
Agree. If we were talking about the Navigator gas engine (although, frankly, even the TT V6 in that felt and sounded a bit comical, at least compared to the X7 and GLS we cross-shopped it with), we’d be having a substantially different conversation. But, with the 6.2 GM decided to go with here, it’s just a joke. Literally, the worst part of the vehicle. Its only saving grace is the rumor about the supercharger bolt-on.
 
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