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2007 CTS 2.8L
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40 Posts
Discussion Starter · #21 ·
Alright alright, I gotcha on the no information given because no one has tried.
But you've gotta understand why I felt a little bitter. I see countless threads for other people end up nowhere on here...
I participate in another forum for my motorcycle which everyone chimes in even if it's just to say they don't know, to point someone in another direction, or give wild suggestions for possibilities! Which often does create ideas that work!


ANYWAYS! on to the good stuff!

matt, I got the clutch and pressure plate rebuilt with OEM spec materials, the flywheel was resurfaced, and I replaced the clutch slave cylinder with a Sachs

The ECU was not reprogrammed. I will be doing a baseline test, comparing tables in the 2.8 vs 3.6 program, then tuning for performance
Does anyone know any trouble I'll run into reprogramming the ECU?

Parts did have to be swapped from my old motor to the new one. They were:
Oil Pan (AWD had a hole through the middle and a different shape)
Intake Manifold (original throttle body did not fit on the new 2009 AWD intake)
Power Steering Reservoir (mounting points)
Ignition Coils (different plugs)
Knock Sensors (different plugs)
Flex Plate (2009 AWD was an automatic, my 07 is a manual, replaced this with my flywheel)
Oil Dipstick (original is shorter)
Oil Feedpipe (different angle)
Power Steering Pump (I'm not sure if there was a difference, but it was newer :p)
A few misc brackets (mounting compatibility)

Keep in mind, these items shouldn't be too much of a concern unless you're getting an incomplete engine

And yes, all of these items are up for grabs. Just send me $20 to make it worthwhile for me to take time to send it over. Or! make me an offer for something else or something unique (can be anything!)
 

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2007 6 speed manual tarnished platinum
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377 Posts
Ya the corvette forums are that way too everyone jumps in. These cars are on their way down, expensive to maintain and low resale value. Seems a lot of the people that really modded them have moved on to newer stuff and all the posts are my car won't start key stuck is my ecu bad electrical problem I got it salvage or free on a trade 4th or 5th owner one post and never come back. There are some good die hard guys on here but seems like there's always a post about swapping in some crazy setup like a Saab turbo or v motor(which seems to of happened with tons of drama and never finished) and you never hear of it again. Props for being realistic and reporting back.
On to better stuff lol. No one in my area would resurface dual mass flywheels, didn't matter, it was junk when I got it out. Springs were broken in it and that center bushing was shot. Next time around I'm dumping for a spec 1 piece with a replaceable friction surface.
How many miles were on the newish motor? If I may ask, what did you give for it? Awd CTS or some other gm product? Good to hear that's all you had to change.

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Oh did you keep the single exhaust?
 

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2007 CTS 2.8L
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40 Posts
Discussion Starter · #23 ·
Sorry, forgot to specify...

It was a 2009 CTS AWD mated with an automatic trans
Mine is mated with a manual trans

Had 30,000 km on the new motor
Bought for $1800cad shipped to our driveway

Yes, I kept the single exhaust... sneaky ;)
 

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2006 3.6L CTS, Hotchkis Sway Bars, FE2
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526 Posts
Lol, I asked for help... and genuinely could've used some tips...
But the thread went dead even :/

Anyways, I was gonna post some simple pics, but couldn't on my phone

As for the video... What kinda video were you looking for?
I'm avoiding pushing it too hard as I just put in a new clutch
Video of it running. Even if its just you revving the crap out of it in your driveway. Just something man. Its awesome that you were able to accomplish this and we all want to see the finished product!
 

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2007 6 speed manual tarnished platinum
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377 Posts
Even though you're breaking that clutch in, can you feel a difference? I really babied mine for 500 miles or so, I'm sure people hated being behind me at stop lights lol. But is it like wow this is different?
When you pulled the motor did you pull the trans with it or did you take the trans out first separately? That was such a huge pain especially that bolt behind the coolant pipe assembly that the heater hoses attach to, it looked like if you could pull it as an assembly it would be tons easier.
 

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Super Moderator
'05 CTS-V
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8,568 Posts
...if you['re] involved in a crash and things dont match up ie vin/engine codes etc, the blame will be all at your door.
:hmm: The blame for what?

But you've gotta understand why I felt a little bitter. I see countless threads for other people end up nowhere on here...
I participate in another forum for my motorcycle which everyone chimes in even if it's just to say they don't know, to point someone in another direction, or give wild suggestions for possibilities! Which often does create ideas that work!
As matt0305 pointed out, it's mostly just the demographic of CTS owners. When these cars were new, the typical CTS buyer was not someone buying a car to "mod", they were just buying a sporty entry-level luxury sedan. And now that the cars are older and more affordable, again you're not seeing very many enthusiast buyers because there's very, very little aftermarket support.

The ECU was not reprogrammed. I will be doing a baseline test, comparing tables in the 2.8 vs 3.6 program, then tuning for performance
Does anyone know any trouble I'll run into reprogramming the ECU?
I'm assuming you're working with HPTuners? If so, there shouldn't be any problems tuning the ECU. I don't think EFI Live supports the V6 CTSs. Have you done any datalogging yet with the stock tune? Pretty interesting that you're able to run the 3.6 on the 2.8 ECU without any changes - I would've thought the extra 25+% displacement would be beyond the fuel injectors' and ECU's capacity to adjust the fuel trims. Any idea if the two engines use the same injectors?
 

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2007 6 speed manual tarnished platinum
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377 Posts
I looked it up they don't use the same injector, delco part for the 3.6 is 2173034 the 2.8 is 2173033 for what its worth. Tell me more of this HPtuners software AAIIIC.
 

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2007 CTS 2.8L
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40 Posts
Discussion Starter · #28 ·
Ok, it's no rev video, but it's just some pics I quickly took at random spots in the swap
https://www.flickr.com/photos/alx-fletcher/sets/72157636561911063/
(towards the end of that album)

I've been very careful and critical on myself to prevent a placebo effect =p
But yes, it has more pull. Even on the highway in high gear, I can keep it there instead of downshifting.

Matt, we separated the motor from tranny because we were pulling it out of the top
Yes, mating bolts were a huge pain
We left the one right at the top beneath the coolant pipe assembly off. Got all the rest on.

AAIIIC, I gotcha. Well, hopefully we'll be getting that community soon! Would be quite cool :yup:

And back to you Matt! lol
Yes, the fuel injectors are in fact different
Even between the 07 3.6 and 09 3.6
 

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Super Moderator
'05 CTS-V
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8,568 Posts
Could be that the difference in the injector sizing is roughly the same as the difference in the displacement so it all works out OK.

HPTuners is one of the two main tuning suites that folks use for GM vehicles (the other being EFI Live, but I don't see the V6 CTS listed on EFI Live's website). Their website can you tell you a helluva lot more than I can. :) But basically, a tuner (a shop or individual) gets the software, which allows you to interface with the ECU using a laptop and the OBDII port. You have to buy a key (I think they call it a certificate) to allow you to tune an ECU associated with your VIN. (A shop can buy a more expensive certificate that would allow them to tune multiple ECUs in a given family of ECUs, but an individual would just need to be able to tune their own ECU/VIN combo.) The software gives you pretty much full access to the ECU - fuel, timing, injector scaling, engine displacement, you name it. If you don't know what you're doing you can cause just as much harm as good.
 

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2007 CTS 2.8L
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40 Posts
Discussion Starter · #30 ·
Yupp, thanks for the info AAIIIC

We are using HPtuners, just need to buy the credit for my car

Also AAIIIC, would you happen to know of any security issues or such that we would have when we flash on the 3.6 to replace our current 2.8?
Any prep work we should do in case of a fault?

Thanks



https://www.flickr.com/photos/alx-fl...7636561911063/
 

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2007 6 speed manual tarnished platinum
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377 Posts
Cool a tuning tutorial. This is where everything gets fuzzy for me. Does the body control module contain the Vin security stuff? Is it in the ecu, is there a separate security module? I mean I know on later model GM cars you can't even swap radios without a trip to a dealer to program it. Clean car, that pic underneath with the transmission and the jack stand and 2x4s brought on a bad flashback lol. Hey what did you use for a clutch alignment tool? Being these don't use a pilot bushing the tool that came with was useless. I had to center it off the fingers. The pic of your dash the security icon is lit. Did you have problems?
 

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2007 CTS 2.8L
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Discussion Starter · #32 ·
Cool a tuning tutorial. This is where everything gets fuzzy for me. Does the body control module contain the Vin security stuff? Is it in the ecu, is there a separate security module? I mean I know on later model GM cars you can't even swap radios without a trip to a dealer to program it. Clean car, that pic underneath with the transmission and the jack stand and 2x4s brought on a bad flashback lol. Hey what did you use for a clutch alignment tool? Being these don't use a pilot bushing the tool that came with was useless. I had to center it off the fingers. The pic of your dash the security icon is lit. Did you have problems?
Hey again matt,

The security icon and message popped up when it first started. But when I hit clear, it didn't retain or come back.

About the BCM containing VIN security stuff... I don't know, hopefully someone can chime in on this...

Yea, clean car, but paint is screwed.
The place I work at has giant stacks that create fallout that's sort of acidy and wrecks your paint
Yes, the place I work at sucks for the environment
Maybe a plastidip is due ;)

Clutch alignment tool??
Wah??
Why??
Did I do something wrong??
Lol
Used a socket that fit perfect
 

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Hey SlightlyCoolWhip,
It's pretty funny that I'm in the same boat as you were in! I have a 2.8 that's going out and I'm looking to get a 3.6 in her.

My question is: You installed the 3.6 with 304 hp in yours? Was there any custom fabrication ? Or did it all just line up? Does the car run fine with the stock tune (old 2.8 ecu?)

Thanks for any replies!
 

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2007 6 speed manual tarnished platinum
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377 Posts
The 304 HP is direct injection. Something tells me that's a whole other beast. The ly7 is just a bigger lp1 and assume that's what he used.

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Actually in post 12 he says ly7.
 

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2007 CTS 2.8L
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40 Posts
Discussion Starter · #36 ·
Yup matt, you're correct

The DI version would be awesome... but this car is my daily driver, so we didn't want the extra possible complication
 

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2007 CTS 2.8L
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Discussion Starter · #37 ·
UPDATE!!

Not changing those injectors threw the fuel consumption calculation off
I don't know how far off the instantaneous and average are off, but the fuel consumed is off by about 8 liters

This looks to be because the newer injectors are likely bigger, requiring a shorter pulse to inject the required fuel
Since the computer does not know that the injectors are bigger, it thinks it is injecting less fuel because of the shorter pulses
 

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2007 6 speed manual tarnished platinum
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377 Posts
So did this cause drivability issues? Or it just used more fuel ? Did you ever flash a 3.6 tune or are you still running the 2.8 tune.
 

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Reported Post by Brian.Lapcevic

Hey, I see you've successfully swapped your 2.8 into a 3.6 and i'm wondering how much did this cost you? I currently have a 2006 2.8 cts that is in the shop with a seized engine. I live near mississauga ontario, did you do it yourself or did you get it done at a shop? If you got it done at a shop, would you recommend any? Thanks, have a great day!

Hey everyone!

Have a 2007 CTS 2.8 with an engine about to go. Planning to do a swap to a 3.6 - does anyone have experience with this?

Should it just be a straight reflash of the ECM? Any trouble with security/vehicle acceptance?

Also, any other mechanical issues to be aware of?

Thanks for your help!
 

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'05 CTS-V
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I'm afraid slightlycoolwhip hasn't logged onto the site in about 16 months, so I don't imagine you'll get a response.
 
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