Cadillac Owners Forum banner

1 - 11 of 11 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
213 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hi,
Just found this board while searching the net for trouble shooting my Caddy. I just picked it up 3 weeks ago and have run into a couple problems. First off after checking a couple threads here I was able to access my computer codes (Thanks Guy's.) My "Service Engine Soon" light had come on after driving it for a week. The codes are E39, E98, and E99. Can anyone tell me what these mean? Possible problems? Most importantly, possible solutions? The light will stay off for a day or two and then come back on. It's off when restarting but may come back on the same day or not for two or three. The car seems to run great but I noticed my fuel economy has been falling off. What range of MPG should I be expecting for mostly highway driving? The engine is a 4.9 litre. The second concern is my stereo. I made a mistake and tried turning it on during freezing rain. The antenna didn't come up (probably frozen) and the stereo won't work now. I have checked the fuse which seems fine. Does the stereo have an internal fuse? Anything else I should be checking?
I'm really hopeing someone can help me with my concerns so please write with any advise!
Thanks,
Tim
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,009 Posts
*E and P mean the same thing*

P039 .............................. Torque Coverter Clutch (VCC) Engagement Problem

P098 .......................................... High RPM P/N to D/R Shift Under ISC

^ I got that a few times.... what happened with me, I was stopped, put the car in Neutral and set the parking brake, forgot about that, and hit the gas, realized it was in neutral, and put it in Drive as soon as I let off the gas, but the enigne RPM was high enough to set the code.......good way to see if when you lend your car out (if you do) if they neutral dropped it.....

P099 .................................. Cruise Control Servo Applied, Not in Cruise

taken from:

http://209.145.176.7/~090/awh/dtcobd1.html

with my '93 CDV I was getting 16-19 around town (depending on speed/my driving/temp/distance/stop and go etc..) and on the highway, cruise at 75, AC on I was getting 28.....
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
213 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
Hi Rick,
Thanks for the reponse. Any thoughts on what needs to be done? Does anything need to be done? And, how do I clear the codes? Sorry for all the questions but the last Caddy I owned was a 69 and it didn't have all the high tech gadgets, needless to say. Any thoughts on the stereo problem. Anyone... Jump right in I need help from those more experienced with these than I. That means all of you.
Thanks,
Tim
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
45 Posts
with your stereo..is it stock or aftermarket..either way check to make sure the antenna is working..possibly going up..if it was freezing rain maybe it was frozen and ur burned the antenna motor out. i know on my 91 deville i have to wait til it is warm to play the radio or til the antenna can come up on its own
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
213 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
The stereo is stock. How can I tell if it's the antenna motor or the stereo itself? Nothing happens when I oush the power button. The stereo does not seem to power up and the antenna doesn't go up either. I have checked the fuse in the fuse box and it's fine. I was told by a mechanic that the stereo itself may have an internal fuse, but don't know how to check that out. Do I need to pull it, and if so, where would I look for an internal fuse?
Thanks,
Tim
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
54 Posts
Hi Tim. Thanks for the welcome in my introductory thread. :bouncy:

If your stereo is stock, and there isn't an alarm or other aftermarket doo-dad that is wired into the stereo's power circuit, and the radio fuse in the i/p fuse panel is fine, and the radio doesn't power on, then I think you might have a bad radio.

Do not, repeat... do not condemn your radio without having a qualified technician look at things. While I'm not aware of any late-model GM stock radio having an internal fuse... I can't say for sure. In the shop, we would just go over the basics, and then send the radio out for detailed diagnostics and repair.

The antenna is commanded to extend and retract by the stereo. No power at the radio, or a problem that prevents the radio from powering-on will cause the antenna to not extend.

The easiest, long-distance suggestion I can offer is to swap a known-good radio into the circuit and see if it works. You can also grab the schematic for the circuit and test the power and ground connections (there are more than two).

::sigh:: Diagnosing anything over long distance is a very touchy thing. There is absolutely no replacement for a qualified technician doing the hands-on thing.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
213 Posts
Discussion Starter #7
Hi Ellisss,
Thanks for the help :worship: . Any thoughts on the computer codes? I have cleared them and the Caddy seems to be running fine.
Thanks,
Tim
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
54 Posts
One more note on the radio issue...

You need to be careful when checking fuses, no matter what design they are. I've seen ATC and ATM fuses blow, but the break in the fuse wasn't visible to the naked eye. Always test fuses with a test light connected to ground.

As far as the codes you mentioned...

I'm not a walking encyclopedia on either OBD1 or OBD2 codes. I remember what the usual OBD1 codes were by heart, only because it was hammered into my head after years of diagnostic work. I can say what the common and usual OBD2 codes are... like P0300 being a generic misfire code, P0301 being a misfire on cylinder #1, etc. So, I can't say, without having a scan tool in front of me, what this or that code means.

What I can do, is offer you some suggestions on how serious you should take things.

First, if your SES light (or 'check engine' light) ever begins to flash while the motor is running, then bring your car in for service immediately. A flashing OBD2 SES light is an idication of an emission-raising failure that will, not may or might, but will damage your catalytic converter... carbon-foul your spark plugs... and saturate your oil with fuel.

Aside from that, there are two basic kinds of failures when talking about your SES light. Hard and soft. Hard failures are present all the time, and are an indication of possible circuit or component failure. Soft codes are more-or-less intermittent, and may be caused by high-resistance harness connections or failure conditions that aren't permanently present.

(note: I'm highly simplifying things here. There are actually three classes of OBD2 codes within each subdivision... class A, B, and C. 'A' codes are those that turn on the SES light on the first trip after a drive-cycle is completed. 'B' codes require two trips, and will not cause the SES light to come on until after the second drive-cycle with the fault present. There are also things called 'pending codes', but I'm already probably giving you too much information.)

If, after clearing any single code or group of codes, if returns immediately or within a day or two of driving... then you can quite reliably assume that there is indeed a failure somewhere. Whether or not it's something that requires immediate service is something that only a trusted, qualified technician can tell you.

If, on the other hand, a code (or multiple codes) does not return after days of driving... then a few things are possible.

Electronically controlled transmissions and transaxles are highly succeptable to setting false codes. Driving over uneven or non-standard surfaces can cause both trans and ABS codes to appear. The software in both PCMs and ABS modules has specific routines to lessen the occurance of false fault indications... but it's in no way foolproof.

Engine, drivability, anf/or fuel delivery fault codes can also be incorrectly set by any number of variables that are out of the driver's control. Poor quality fuel is possibly the most prevalent of them all.

Believe it or not, the engine's misfire counters can be set off by driving over rough road surfaces. The misfire detection circuit, if you can believe this, is actually the engine's crankshaft speed sensor and PCM. The PCM detects tiny changes in the frequency generated by the crankshaft sensor. A cylinder misfiring will cause a drop in crankshaft speed for that particular part of crankshaft rotation... which will then be seen (and reported) by the crank sensor... and interpreted by the PCM. Again, there are specific routines in the PCM's software to detect variations in crankshaft speed caused by rough roads... but it's not foolproof. All this means, and what I'm trying to say, is that there are times when the SES light is on for no good reason at all.

If you get an SES light, and clear the codes, and they do not return in any decent amount of time, then it's okay to assume the codes were false. (this is my own opinion, and not to be taken with anything but a grain of salt.)

Here's a note for those people clearing their codes by removing the battery cables for a few hours... You are also clearing out the PCM's databases and matrices for fuel trim, idle speed, and other learned behaviours. It's not a hugely terrible thing, but don't complain if MPG drops and idle speeds are wacky for a while.

--
Ellisss
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
213 Posts
Discussion Starter #9 (Edited)
:worship: :worship: :worship: Well after having cleared the codes and driving for 2 days here's what I got... E039 - Torque Coverter Clutch (VCC) Engagement Problem. So can you tell me what might be going on and how serious it might be? The car continues to run great.
Thanks,
Tim
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
54 Posts
TimsToy said:
:worship: :worship: :worship: Well after having cleared the codes and driving for 2 days here's what I got... E039 - Torque Coverter Clutch (VCC) Engagement Problem. So can you tell me what might be going on and how serious it might be? The car continues to run great.
Thanks,
Tim
You're not going to like what I have to say. :lildevil:

What is going on is that your PCM has identified a problem with the engagement of your TCC. Could be a bad (worn or balooned) torque converter. Could be a problem in the transaxle's valve body, causing a lack of fluid pressure. Could be a stuck solenoid (on the valve body).

This particular transaxle code is rarely false. Sorry. :mad:

Not cheap to fix, either.

--
Ellisss
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
213 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
O.K. Checked with a local G.M. Tech and he said maybe swap out the PROM as a 1st option to trouble shoot this. I also found this article on the net at caddyinfo.com. Any thoughts, anyone?
Thanks,
Tim

P039 TCC/VCC Error

P039 Solved Jim Wakefield Time: Wed, 13-Mar-2002 08:26:45

Well, it's been a week since I posted about the TSB for a new MemCal and the problems I was experiencing with the P039 TCC/VCC transmission code...

After 1 week of MANY short and a few long trips (I've been on vacation from work) I'm happy to report that I have not yet been able to set the P039 code again since installing the new PROM...

A little background on my car, experiencing intermittent P039 code mostly on cold starts, usually about once every 10 trips... I figured out that in my situation it was during low RPM/high torque situations (slight incline/grade)... Usually the code would set when the torque converter was still locked but the powertrain had a larger demand placed on it such as climbing slight grades...

I found a TSB for 93-95 Caddys with the "Y" code motor that listed a revised memcal PROM to cure the problem that I've seen many on this board are experiencing... Since I couldn't find
anything wrong physically with the trans after a couple weeks of troubleshooting, I decided to give the updated PROM a chance ($50)...

Now, even when I try I am unable to create the conditions from before to set the P039 code... Previously I was able most of the time to set the code when I purposefully drove the car a
certain way (mostly very light throttle up an incline, trying to keep the TCC engaged)...

My impressions of drivability differences... Well, I'm happier with the PCM's management of the TCC now... One thing I've never liked about GM since changing to 4spd AOD transmissions
has been the delayed disengagement of the TCC under light throttle conditions... This new PROM seems to unlock the TCC at the slightest increase in throttle position, almost like a
slight downshift when I ease into the throttle... It seems IMO, the perfect calibration for my style of driving for both locking up and unlocking the TCC...

So for those of you out there that might be experiencing the same problem as I was, it might be worth a shot after you've exhausted other troubleshooting options and the transmission is
in good working order...

Here is a repost of the TSB from last week...

[START]

TSB# 87-65-17
DTC P039 Set When Driving Up Slight Grade After Cold Start

Subject:
DTC P039 Set When Driving Up Slight Grade After Cold Start
(Diagnose/Install New PCM)

Models:
1993-95 Cadillac Eldorado, Seville 1994-95 Cadillac Concours,
Deville With 4.6L Engine (Vin Y - RPO LD8)

Condition:
DTC P039, Torque Converter Clutch Engagment, May Set When
Driving Up A Slight Grade After A Cold Start.

Correction:
A PCM Calibration Enhancement Has Been Released For The Above
Listed Vehicles. If A Vehicle Is Encountered With This
Condition, And All Of The Diagnostic Procedures Listed In The
Service Manual Have Been Performed With No Resulting Correction,
Then Update The Vehicle With The Applicable Calibration Listed
Below.

Parts Information:
Part Number Description 16266755 1993 PCM PROM, 16266762 1994
PCM PROM, 16266767 1995 PCM PROM

Parts Are Expected To Be Available From GMSPO On June 1, 1998.

Jim
94 Eldorado ESC, 96 Corvette





PO39 FIXED w/PROM!! BIG NEWS TO MANY Double H
Jim's post about changing the chip proved to be extremely valuable, to me. Some info - 1994 Concours bought used last summer with over 100k miles. Nice seller, car was well-mainained mechanically, not so cosmetically. The aesthetics, the mileage, but also the "SERVICE ENGINE SOON" telletale going off regularly all contributed to a low purchase price. I addressed the aesthetics and have done more maintenance, but that telltale was going off for....40,000 miles
now! Yes, I've figured out ways to try to 'go around' setting it off, but frankly its a nuisance. This PO39 "TCC ENGAGEMENT PROBLEM" code is VERY common in 1994 Concours' - I've personally discovered a half dozen Concours' with this code going off regularly, of mileages varying from under 50k to over 100k. I've tried all the suggestions Al had, to no avail. The only fix
as I saw it is a trans-rebuild costing $1500+. Given that the car runs great otherwise, this is not an option I was considering at this time.

Along comes JIM WAKEFIELD and his persistence and enthusiasm, to arrest this problem in his car (1994 Eldorado - same drivetrain). He and his neighbor discovered a TSB never previously discussed here, about a replacement PROM for the computer that will address this matter. Scroll down - Jim had success in curing this deficiency with just a chip change as noted in the TSB. I figured I'd give him a solid week just to be sure it had been addressed and apparently Jim is still smiling.

I ordered the chip from my buddy at the local Chevy dealer parts counter. I was reluctant because upon looking up my VIN, a different chip was coming up then the one that Jim Wakefield noted
in that particular TSB. BUT, when we looked up that specific chip number - it came back that it would work in my year/model of Cadillac - although along with the Eldorado and the Seville. This
grouping of notably different cars, all on the same chip - had me concerned. My Concours weighs a bit more than Jim's Eldorado; the idea that both cars would be operated under the same (PROM)
parameters was not credible to me. Still, at $44 total purchase price I had to take a shot with this.

Got the new chip home yesterday and engaged installation Friday afternoon. On the drive home from the dealer, I deliberately tried to set the code and I don't know if its coming easier or I'm
just good at it - but I set it off my very first try so its going off easy. Got home - first off - the chip has a notably different Letter Code than the one it would replace. The old chip in the
car reads BKFZ, and even my 1994 Eldorado I had years ago had a BK-- chip. This new chip starts with a "C". So I knew it was a whole series off from the one it was replacing, but like I said -
I was willing to take this $44 chance. Installed chip via shop manual instructions (ground yourself to avoid static). Go to start the car - pretty much expecting it won't even start...it
started! Expecting "Monitored Functions" problems right after start-up....nothing! Ran the codes - only the codes because I changed a chip, as expected according to shop manual....so no
codes! Took it out....couldn't set the code!!!!!!!!!! Was out last night in various driving conditions, most of which would set the code if I didn't work at it to 'drive around' it - NO CODE AT
ALL ALL NIGHT.

This is huge news to me. I love this car, and this was one 'unaddressable' thing that really bugged me. And dare I say this out loud? A deficiency that has plagued my car for some
40,000 MILES, I think ITS FIXED

HUGE THANKS TO JIM WAKEFIELD AND HIS NEIGHBOR. You are going
to make a number of Cadillac enthusiasts (who have this problem), a lot happier. As for me, I'm very grateful to you, for this.

Best,
Double H
 
1 - 11 of 11 Posts
About this Discussion
10 Replies
4 Participants
TimsToy
Top