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i just think Cadillac needs to add about $1000 worth of luxury bits to the XT5 to make it competitive in its market and to differentiate it from a Chevy. And who says wagon are "uncool"? :)
 

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i just think Cadillac needs to add about $1000 worth of luxury bits to the XT5 to make it competitive in its market and to differentiate it from a Chevy. And who says wagon are "uncool"? :)
I apologize. Wagons are cool, especially in CTS-v manual form. However, in the USA, they are slightly less marketable than an ice block in Anchorage. You stand a better chance selling losing lottery tickets and expired egg salad sandwiches. Rebrand them as "sport hatch utility performance utility vehicles" and now you have something the market will flock to........(massive eyeroll)

As for xt5, I think they need to lop off 10k to be competitive against the actual "market" it gets cross shopped against. Leases can stay at $299/mo and everyone wins, or they need to add a decent, interesting powertrain and 5k worth of better materials while eliminating several previously cut corners and not raise the price in order for it to get considered in the market Cadillac pretends it plays in. Realistically BMW x3 and x5 along with offerings from Lincoln and Audi make the fwd based ct5 an odd man out in the "serious" segment of the market. Comparisons to other pedestrian fwd-based cuvs become inevitable and logical once one realizes that chassis and powertrain is the bold line that differentiates the poseurs and aspirants from the credible and capable. Cadillac is currently trying to hang with a crowd that simply outclasses them and it shows. They are a 12 year old sitting in uncle Lou's seat at the Turkey day table trying to be accepted. In reality everyone notices that they are 4'10" 91 lbs and clearly a refugee from the kids cluster around the card table. Until the xt4t/5/6 put some meat on them bones and emerge from puberty with some stones or some knockers, they are unlikely to be respected at the adult table. $1000 of added bling won't hide the squeaky cracking voice, the face full of pimples, or the 2 dimensional physique.

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18 XT5 / 18 CTS 3.6 AWD
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Geeze Ornery hates that he bought a Cadillac, and in fact keeps buying cars he hates since he's owned many Caddy's. Too funny. Name fits at least. Mercedes / BMW / Audi all make cheapo cars too. In fact the new GLB is getting flack all over because of it's cheap build and wimpy engine. The GLK that didn't make it past one iteration was a real dog. I for one have owned 6 Cadillacs in 25 years and they have all been great. Of all, I will admit my XT5 is my least favorite, as I find it too "fat" and doesn't drive very fun. But I'll take it's interior over a BMW X3 any day. The BMW X3 is a festival of hard plastic. Then you mention Lincoln being at the top of the pack of premium luxury. C'mon... the brand has been on the tentative chopping block for 10 years. Finally their brand new models seem to be more in-line with the luxury segment, but until this current lineup they have all been poorly skinned Ford's.

Aside from my XT5, I bought a CPO 2018 CTS last year. I cross-shopped all other luxury brands. I was actually quite excited about a 2019 Audi A5. Drove that and a Mercedes C-Class. The CTS outperformed all of them. Hands down best handling in that segment. And again, the A5 was filled with hard plastic all over the dash and cheap looking plastic "metal" trim. In my CTS whatever material it looks like it is. Metal is metal, wood is wood.

Bottom line is all brands have their dogs, at the end of the day it's your preference. Your perceived value plus the level of luxury you want = satisfaction. Of course if you have the cash to buy higher level models, then you likely aren't going to buy Cadillac cause they don't have the model lineup to compete model for model with the likes of Mercedes. That being said, Mercedes has been in the news recently stating that they have taken the low end offerings too far. And will start focusing less on the bottom line lineup.
 

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5 Cadillac's, all sedans or wagons. Never bought an xt5 or the predecessor srx. Drove a ton of them as loaners and despised every one of them. Partly for what they were (portly, ill handling,etc) but largely because they represented the worst tendencies of Cadillac to phone in a bad badge-engineering job, sell it to a different demographic than they claimed to have targeted, and then just crank them out with no regard for how it tarnishes the overall perception of the brand. Try explaining the genius of the ats/cts chassis to an xt5 driver. You are likely to meet much skepticism if the xt5 is their only experience with the brand.

As I tried to point out earlier, there are 2 Cadillacs right now- one that makes fine sedans on unique platforms, and another that peddles half-effort cuvs based off corporate fwd platforms. CUVS already start at a ride and handling handicap due to high CG and short wheelbases plus bad mass distribution. It's hard to look good in the company of true lux brands when you don't put in the effort to overcome that inherent deficiency.

Regarding Lincoln, I specifically had the Aviator in mind as an example of a nicely executed and well rounded lux utility that combines handsome looks, exciting powertrain, and appealing interior appointments. Yes, Lincoln took a 10 year walk on the darkside with rebadged fwd fords, but to see Cadillac doing the same now is nauseating. I actually do retain a reverence for the once mighty Cadillac and want to see them thrive but their current trajectory has the hallmarks of self-destruction. They seem to value today's quick profit over building brand equity and establishing credibility as a player in the top tier. Capitalism is great and today's xt5 is likely quite profitable but i would argue that every $10k earned on an xt5 sale does $20k of damages to the overall brand. Sometimes you are better off declining to participate in things that pay well today but hurt your reputation tomorrow.

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You know what, I agree with most of what you just said in your last post. Your prior posts where very "ornery" lol. But this last one I certainly agree with much of it. LOVE my CTS, but when it's time to trade in my XT5 in the next year or two I will check out the Mercedes offerings for sure. I will note that my second favorite Caddy I've owned was the first generation SRX. That was not built on any Chevy platform, and boy was it a great SUV that last me over 10 years of great running with it's mighty NorthStar V8 roaring!
 

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My 1st showroom new caddy was also an sigma platform srx, which I simply called a cts tall wagon to avoid confusing people who know the 2nd generation Mexican built fwd SRX, which was essentially an Opel Antara/Saturn Vue at literally twice the price.

That SRX was an eye opener for many folks who had no idea how serious Cadillac was about driving dynamics. Mine was pre-interior facelift. That (tupperware interior) look did not age well, but the exterior style and road manners were very good. Knowing what a good trail they started blazing with SRX 1.0,then seeing an abrupt turn toward a badge engineered anonymous CUV from Mexico on the SRX 2.0 is probably one reason I am so disgusted with where the xt5 stands in the lineup today. Obviously there are fans but I still don't think it's doing the brand any favors.

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It's just a shame to me because I want to love American made cars and want GM to succeed, but they keep doing the same crappy things that have made them uncompetitive. I gave up GM cars long ago, but we tried the XT5 because it was new and we loved the looks. After it, we probably won't have another GM product on our shopping list for a long time. It's not been a horrible experience, it's just not lived up to its market competition and price. I just as soon buy a Toyota or Nissan or Ford, except that I don't like the looks of any of their offerings. If I had to buy American, it would probably be a Chrysler product. We've had a two Jeep Grand Cherokees ("WNK" chassis) and liked them and would definitely buy another one when they come out with a new version.

Yes, every make has its dogs. Mercedes-Benz for a long time did not sell it's low-end models in the USA because of exactly what they are experiencing now: complaints about them not being as luxurious as the higher models. MBZ is really only a "luxury" brand in the USA. In other parts of the world, they are as common as Fords or Chevys and they sell plenty of low-end models that compete with common cars. Even some of the models we consider "luxury cars" are offered elsewhere without all the "luxury" features we expect. They used to sell E-Classes with fabric interiors, manual climate controls and crank windows.

Cadillac has proven they can build competitive vehicles with their cars. They just need to translate this into their SUV/CUVs.
 

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Right on Rudeney! The problem is the leadership seems to believe only trucks and utes are worth making, and the consumer kind of reinforces that by gobbling up even the worst of the Cuvs while turning up their nose at some mighty good efforts in the sedan arena. A vicious cycle has formed where the remaining sedans are being neutered, decontented and dumbed down (in respose to what? Perceived price pressure?) to a degree that even seriously interested sedan buyers lose interest, throw in the towel and look elsewhere. Right now, one could conclude we are being frozen out of sedans and pushed toward hi-profit low appeal utes. Watch next as they take away the most appealing aspects of current vehicles to get you to accept a compromise electric version. Its already begun if you notice the demise of larger displacements and higher performance engines and the replacement with tiny, unrefined, forced induction motors and cvt's. Look at the base engine now in ct4 & ct5. Look at the malibu! Look at 3 cylinder trailblazers! Yukons with 3l diesel as the up -level choice (i actually love that motor, but its rather small for a yukon). We are being forced to accept a future we did not request and we are being groomed to do so without resisting by the slow yet systematic elimination of our more appealing options.

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2019 XTS Luxury AWD, 2004 SRX N* AWD (gone)
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After having a Luxury Sedan I would never go back to an SUV, CUV. The XTS is so much better all around than the G1 SRX I had, and is what I consider a true Luxury vehicle. I liked my SRX, but it does not come close to the XTS Sedan imo. I`ve looked at other brands (in parking lots...luckily no owner ever saw me, lol) and I just don`t like the look of the interior(s), and nothing bites me like the look of a Classic looking Cadillac from the outside, whether XTS, CTS, ATS. CT6. I hope the new CT4 & CT5 change the look from side profile as it looks too much like a BMW to me, but from the front and rear it looks like a Cadillac...the interior...eh, not so much.
 

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I bought the XT5, the '17 in mid '16, (yeah one of the firsts), and calling it not bad is a disservice; I would call it quite good. And it wasn't a derivative of a corporate GM product, it was the lead vehicle; the derivatives came later and Cadillac shared their platform with others. If I would cast any diversions it would be maybe that Cadillac failed to move the XT5 further than it did (after introduction). You can take my mini-evaluation with a grain of salt as I have moved on and up to a CT6 but I just wanted to get back into a sedan; but three plus years with the XT5 was enjoyable, capable and fulfilled my needs nicely.
 

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Agree with philly88 about the first generation SRX. Purchased 2004 new and was the best and longest owned vehicle I've owned. No major problems in the 12 years I owned it. Got rid of it after watching the underbody change into rust . Replaced it with Buick LaCrosse and am very happy. Was going to get another Cadillac but got scared off after reading about problems on this forum. Have 08 Chevy Equinox as second car and am thinking of upgrading next year. Have always had GM's but will definitely check out foreign SUV's.
 

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Got rid of it after watching the underbody change into rust
Mine was a 2007 (updated interior) Sport V8 fully loaded. Loved the sound / roar the engine made, probably the last V8 I'll ever own. Owned it until 2018, when like you said it rusted out. Ontario here and the road salt kills our cars big time. At ten years you're lucky if rust isn't claiming your car here if it's winter driven. If it wasn't for it being rusted out the mechanical components were still going strong. It was my wife's SUV and she loved it, her "black beauty". When we replaced it with the XT5 she was literally sad at the downgrade in luxury feel. And that's compared to a 11 year or SUV. And it was a downgrade in luxury for sure. The updated interior version was very nice inside and IMO still nicer looking than the current Cadillac SUV lineup. Anyhow, it's gone.
 

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In MB there was a saying to never buy a car from Ont. due to the corrosion from excessive salt being used on the roads. Here we use salt, but I guess not as much as Ont. I make sure to wash the underbody and wheel wells as best I can when I go to the car wash. I guess salt has to be used in winter but still...Freaking salt, why not just use sand...(maybe it would cost too much for spring clean up).
 

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why not just use sand
Just sand doesn't cut it. You just get hard pack snow with sand shmushed into it. In my city they do use just sand on residential side roads and by the middle of the winter my road is a disaster with ruts and thick ice built up from the snow being packed down. Then come spring and they send the snow plough down our roads to clear the snow pack we literally get 6 to 8" THICK giant sheets of ice torn up. They actually send a front end loader behind the snow plough so they clear peoples driveways when they do this cause you can't move the giant sheets with a shovel or snowblower. On the main roads the salt keeps it clear. But yes, it destroys our cars big time. When I drive in southern US states like Arizona and see 20 year old cars that don't have a speck of rust I envy them. Really brings up the total cost of ownership when an otherwise great car meets its demise due to rust when mechanically it's still strong.
 

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Just sand doesn't cut it. You just get hard pack snow with sand shmushed into it. In my city they do use just sand on residential side roads and by the middle of the winter my road is a disaster with ruts and thick ice built up from the snow being packed down. Then come spring and they send the snow plough down our roads to clear the snow pack we literally get 6 to 8" THICK giant sheets of ice torn up. They actually send a front end loader behind the snow plough so they clear peoples driveways when they do this cause you can't move the giant sheets with a shovel or snowblower. On the main roads the salt keeps it clear. But yes, it destroys our cars big time. When I drive in southern US states like Arizona and see 20 year old cars that don't have a speck of rust I envy them. Really brings up the total cost of ownership when an otherwise great car meets its demise due to rust when mechanically it's still strong.
Would not that act as a traction surface ie. the sand in the snow. Where I live rural, they don`t use sand and or salt, and in the spring it melts with some rutting and slush.
Apparently the new(er) Cadillacs use an aluminum frame and only the welds can get rust as far as the frame goes.
 

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I'm about 400km north of Toronto. We can get wild swings in weather, even Jan and Feb where we might go close to or even above freezing during the day then go to - 10 or more at night. That just creates perfect conditions for thaw freeze disaster. In fact due to this thaw freeze cycle we have some of the worst roads in North America, and get voted as such in a yearly online poll lol. Huge potholes all over in the spring when water gets into cracks then freezes overnight. Ahhh winter.... If I didn't like being Canadian so darn much I'd move to a warmer climate. Free health care pays off though lol.
 

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I would rather have the -40 (minus 60 wind chill) than the wild swings. Our roads get pretty bad here too, but not as bad as yours (I think?) 😛
 

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400km North of Toronto is where the road quits going North and turns to the left (West) lol Only thing north of there is well.... Nothing ! lol

Steve been there!
 

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@ornery : Yep, you're singing to the choir! The consumer is driving the demand for CUV's They want to cargo capacity, roomy cabin and ride height of an SUV but easier parking, so cars like the Honda CRV are are just the ticket. The government is driving the shift to smaller engines and weight reduction in order to meet CAFE standards (note; even those requirements have been mostly repealed, auto makers were already working toward that 54.5mpg by 2025 standard so it was too late to back out). There are many industry followers who believe that by 2030, more than half the cars offered for sale will be electric or at least plug-in hybrid. As much as I like the grunt of a V8, I also like the instant steady torque of a DC motor. But until I can get over 500 miles of range out of a battery pack, I'll not go electric. Yes, 85% of my driving is short errands around town, but with a daughter who live 180 miles away, a 300 mile range is no good - I can't spend the night just to recharge my car. And when I go to the beach, it's 500 miles round-trip plus another 100+ miles of local driving. I don't want to spend my vacation time looking for chargers where I have to wait hours for a full "tank". And once every other year, I make a drive of over 600 miles one-way, so again, electric is just not the thing. I've said this before and I'll say it again: My next car will have a V12. I'm looking for just the right Mercedes-Benz SL600 or SL65.
 

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Rudeney, I'm with you on the range of the electric car. I was thinking at least a rang of 400+ miles with a quick charge of at least another 200+ miles,time for a break for lunch. That would give you around 7-8 hours of driving a day. The problem would still be having charging stations for overnight stays.
 
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