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2013 CTS-V Sedan
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Discussion Starter #1
So the are v will start at 62k....WOW...(fully loaded over 77k...that's more then my fully loaded V currently...so I'm expecting high 90s for the new V? Fully loaded?
 

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2012 CTS-V sedan, 2017 CT6, 2000 Eldorado ETC
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I certainly hope not but, possible. I don't think I can justify $90k. I read somewhere that there were only going to be 4 options on the V3. Recaro seats, PDR, Carbon fiber kit and sun roof. I find it hard to believe there won't be a break color and rim options (unless those options are somewhat standard, like paint options). I think all I want is the Recaro seats and the PDR, not sure on the carbon fiber option. ATS-V PDR is $1300, Z06 PDR is $1750, ATS-V Recaro is $2300 my 2012 Recaro's were $3200 (I think). Some reports say no gas guzzler tax which will help. Mine was $2600 on 2012 A6. I am still hoping for under $80k base. Not sure it will happen though.
 

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I really think GM's pricing is way out of whack over the last year. They are going to have a lot of cars sitting on dealer lots and they will have to resort to big incentives when they see that guys like us won't buy the 3rd gen CTS-V if it's priced at over $90K. Time will tell, but all my pricing predictions so far have come true. Dealers can't sell ATS or CTS vehicles without putting thousands of dollars of incentives on the hoods of these cars. They have a 6 month supply of ATS vehicles on dealer lots and a 4 month supply of CTS vehicles on dealers lots.

Johan's strategy of keeping high MSRPs and making less cars is going to shoot Cadillac and GM in the foot. They need to make Cadillacs priced way less to make it appealing to potential German luxury vehicle buyers in order to woo them into dealer showrooms. All they are doing right now is pushing people off the fence and into German luxury dealership showrooms. Why would anyone buy a Cadillac when a similarly equipped BMW or Mercedes is around the same price?!!! Someone that wants to buy an expensive luxury car isn't going to come to Cadillac for a couple thousand dollars in savings. This isn't rocket science. Cadillac needs to prove themselves in the marketplace and once they have people hooked, then slowly raise the prices. That strategy works everytime! What GM is doing with their pricing across their entire brand lineup is just assinine!
 

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Started with '04 BR V, moved on to '09 Slvr V, now '13 CRT coupe
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Where are you guys finding the price breakdown for the options? All I've seen is the press release regarding the base prices for the ATS-V sedan and coupe.
 

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I really think GM's pricing is way out of whack over the last year. They are going to have a lot of cars sitting on dealer lots and they will have to resort to big incentives when they see that guys like us won't buy the 3rd gen CTS-V if it's priced at over $90K. Time will tell, but all my pricing predictions so far have come true. Dealers can't sell ATS or CTS vehicles without putting thousands of dollars of incentives on the hoods of these cars. They have a 6 month supply of ATS vehicles on dealer lots and a 4 month supply of CTS vehicles on dealers lots.

Johan's strategy of keeping high MSRPs and making less cars is going to shoot Cadillac and GM in the foot. They need to make Cadillacs priced way less to make it appealing to potential German luxury vehicle buyers in order to woo them into dealer showrooms. All they are doing right now is pushing people off the fence and into German luxury dealership showrooms. Why would anyone buy a Cadillac when a similarly equipped BMW or Mercedes is around the same price?!!! Someone that wants to buy an expensive luxury car isn't going to come to Cadillac for a couple thousand dollars in savings. This isn't rocket science. Cadillac needs to prove themselves in the marketplace and once they have people hooked, then slowly raise the prices. That strategy works everytime! What GM is doing with their pricing across their entire brand lineup is just assinine!
I couldn't agree more with this post. Assuming all other things are equal, the cars are made here in America, don't need to be shipped over in a cargo ship. That alone should be worth $1,000. I am not taking anything away from BMW or AMG, but part of the appeal of the V2 for me was the tremendous value proposition, if you can say that about a $72k car. My V2 was $73k MSRP. After my GM discount, conquest incentive, and other stuff, plus them paying off my old lease, I walked out of there for $59k. Let's wait and see what they actually get for this thing. But I have to say, at $90k, no sale from me.
 

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Gone; ‘09 V, ‘13 V coupe. Curr; ‘14 PG Vsport prem w/Kona interior
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Yep. With the ATS V topping out in the mid $70k range it wouldn't be surprising if the V3 hits $90k.
Too bad GM doesn't pay de Nysschen based on Cadillac's quarterly profits. I'll bet if they did Johan would start seeing things differently!
 

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Yep. With the ATS V topping out in the mid $70k range it wouldn't be surprising if the V3 hits $90k.
Too bad GM doesn't pay de Nysschen based on Cadillac's quarterly profits. I'll bet if they did Johan would start seeing things differently!
I don't think the V is a cash cow for GM. More of a prestige thing. Escalades are where they make their real money I heard. Take a Chevy Tahoe, add nice shiny bits, and charge crazy money. They can't build those things fast enough.
 

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Gone; ‘09 V, ‘13 V coupe. Curr; ‘14 PG Vsport prem w/Kona interior
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I don't think the V is a cash cow for GM. More of a prestige thing. Escalades are where they make their real money I heard. Take a Chevy Tahoe, add nice shiny bits, and charge crazy money. They can't build those things fast enough.
Yeah, I understand that. GMC/Chevy's truck line alone made up %50 of GM's profits last year.
But that's GMC/Chevy not Cadillac.
de Nysschen's pricing strategy is hurting all of Cadillac, not just the V series. Look at all the incentives that are being offered to get CTS, ATS, etc.. off the lots. Right now the only Cadillac vehicle that is selling well is the Escalade.
The current pricing strategy is not helping the brand to build prestige.
 

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2011 CTS-V Sedan
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Sales are down year over year but profits on each sale have nearly doubled. Cadillac is producing better cars than it has in decades and they are selling for far less than advertized. In my area the base ATS is selling for $28,000. That's $4,000 less than the base A4, 328i and $9,000 less than the C300. That's a lot of car for the money. People are getting turned away by the sticker but there has never been a better time to buy a Cadillac.
 

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Gone; ‘09 V, ‘13 V coupe. Curr; ‘14 PG Vsport prem w/Kona interior
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^^^I don't disagree that now is a great time to buy a Cadillac. Heck, with all the great discounts and incentives a new Cadillac can be had for well below the original (inflated) price.
Overpricing even a great car and then having to offer everything but the kitchen sink to sell them does not help Cadillacs image/prestige.
 

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The problem is the MSRP GM has been setting on their cars. Most people shopping for Cadillacs look at the MSRP, not at the price they can ACTUALLY get the car for. Most people don't know they can get the car for THOUSANDS off MSRP. That's the problem. People look at the MSRP of the new GM vehicles and they run out the door and think to themselves...why should I buy a Cadillac when I can get the Mercedes or BMW for around the same price? The MSRP is what is hurting GM and Cadillac. Nothing more. Whatever value we all saw in the V2's pricing is now gone. The V2 value was such that offered better performance over the German luxury brands but for tens of thousands of dollars less. Now that gap is narrowing at a scary pace and I keep scratching my head and shaking my head at what GM is thinking. I don't know how long it will be for GM to realize that their inflated pricing will slowly decrease their sales volumes. If history is any indication, it shouldn't be long. Once they see cars collecting dust on dealer lots, they will start the big incentives because they will have NO choice in the matter. If you want to move the metal, you have to make it attractive to the consumer. Cadillac hasn't earned the right to charge the prices that GM is publishing on the window stickers. It will take Cadillac AT LEAST 10 more years before they can start creeping prices higher. In the meantime, give people a nice car with a good value and then let the brand speak for itself.
 

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Johan is an idiot. One of Cadillacs differentiators is it's value proposition compared to the Germans. Setting a high MRSP and discounting the sh!t out of it is a bad idea.

1 - Makes people wonder why the price is slashed....is something wrong with the car versus competitors and will resale / residual be garbage?
2 - People shopping for cars will see a high MRSP and not even bother going into the showroom.

Drives me nuts.
 

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The cars ARE that good. Period. The public will eventually get there. If not, they're stupid.
The cars may be that good, but the brand definitely is not. Lousy dealer experiences and service horror stories. I never had the problems with service I've had with Cadillac when I had a BMW, Lexus, or Infiniti. They need to weed out the bad dealers, improve the quality of the showrooms, and most of all, bring the service up to the level people spending this kind of money demand. Period. They just don't have that yet, and it will take a long time. I've never had a BMW SA tell me to come back in two weeks for an appointment because they were too busy, or tell me that "we don't do that type of work on Fridays", but my Cadillac SA did before I switched to a better dealer.
 

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2012 V sedan crystal red/ light titanium A6, 2010 GS LPE 650
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I have a bone stock ( except for corsa sport axle back exhaust) 2012 CTS-V A6 sedan with 23,000 miles, that I am planning to replace with a 2016 C7 Z06 A8 coupe. If I was going to stay with a CTS-V, I would just do a stage 2 upgrade with Vengeance Racing and have more power than the V3 at a cost of maybe 6 to 9 grand, depending on what goodies I added to the package. A lot cheaper than a new V3 if it's priced up around the 85/90 grand range. I still think the V3 is a better car than the M5 or Mercedes, but the status conscious pretentious types will always go to the BMW, Porsche, Mercedes etc.
 

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The cars may be that good, but the brand definitely is not. Lousy dealer experiences and service horror stories. I never had the problems with service I've had with Cadillac when I had a BMW, Lexus, or Infiniti. They need to weed out the bad dealers, improve the quality of the showrooms, and most of all, bring the service up to the level people spending this kind of money demand. Period. They just don't have that yet, and it will take a long time. I've never had a BMW SA tell me to come back in two weeks for an appointment because they were too busy, or tell me that "we don't do that type of work on Fridays", but my Cadillac SA did before I switched to a better dealer.
The dealer experience is a post buy issue. True, Cadillac has a brand image problem but the dealer has little to do with that.

The first CTS was a great effort.
The seconds CTS brought on great improvements but wasn't there yet.
The third CTS is on par with cars in this segment and is a 10Best winner.

Again, public perception. Which is about a decade behind reality. Since the first CTS is little over a decade old, I imagine people might wake up.

None of you complaining about pricing has driven a new CTS. The cars are that good. Don't want to pay the price, fine. Go buy a Chevy.
 

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Jim is right, if you think the price is too high, you will be replaced. I personally think at 90k the car is a fair deal. And, I'm happy they will produce less volume. One thing I always liked about my V's is I don't see them on the road very often. There's a lot of people not happy with Johan's strategy but as Jim said, you will be replaced.
 
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