[Lewis98272]

I recently bought a used set of OEM struts for my eldorado. And payed a pretty penny for them. When I received them in the mail, they looked a tad beat up but showed no signs of leakage or damage. So I had them installed, and man, what a pleasure this thing turned out to be to drive. However, it's been snowing quite a bit here lately which had caused quite a few nasty pot holes here on main street. And sure enough, with my luck I hit a really nasty one. Everything appears to be fine, however my Right Front strut has starting dripping fluid. And it's now making a hollow thud type noise while going over bumps. When I first bought the car about a year ago, the dealership installed a passive gas charged strut on the front driver side and left all the other Stuts alone. After telling this to Basscatt, I went with his warning (to either change to all passive or all original), and decided to go with OEM replacement units. It took me several months to aquire these struts and I've put about 13k miles on them this last year. I'm really kind of upset with myself for hitting that pot hole and ruining this set. I just bought two new Monroe gas charged units Part #: 30142. It was listed on rockauto as Monroe Specialty Strut -replacement for their conversion strut- or something. Bought them for about 26 dollars a peice. However they came in the mail and look just like a regular strut. I've tried looking for reviews but cannot seem to find any, even on monroe website. I know these are cheap (being 26 dollars a peice) but what should I expect ride quality. Bass had said awhile back that unless I drive in a very spirted manner I wouldn't miss the active shocks, but are these that I bought any good? And should I expect a decent comfortable quote ride? Thanks so much again you all. I really do always appreciate your input.

 

[MoistCabbage]

Assuming they're the correct part number, they'll ride just fine. As Bass said, you'll only notice the difference if driving aggressively.

You will have to do the resistor trick to stop the codes and warning messages.

 

[Lewis98272]

Is that very difficult? I'm sure it's been discussed a billion times in here, but a 4.5 k ohm and solder/shrink wrap right?

----------

By the way, what is the difference between a gas charged strut and one filled with hydraulic fluid? (Other than the obvious). What are the pros and cons of each? If I'm not mistaken, original equipment on Eldos Sevilles and DeVilles 2000+ both passive and active suspensions were hydraulic filled correct?

 

[basscatt]

Re: 2002 ETC Stuts. monroe?

Is that very difficult? I'm sure it's been discussed a billion times in here, but a 4.5 k ohm and solder/shrink wrap right?

----------

By the way, what is the difference between a gas charged strut and one filled with hydraulic fluid? (Other than the obvious). What are the pros and cons of each? If I'm not mistaken, original equipment on Eldos Sevilles and DeVilles 2000+ both passive and active suspensions were hydraulic filled correct?
=============
Bass had said awhile back that
unless I drive in a very spirted manner
I wouldn't miss the active shocks,
but are these that I bought any good?
I'm hurt -
have I EVER lied to you? -

I would never recommend something
that I didn't KNOW was the best solution -
all things considered -

the reason you won't find reviews on the Monroe 30142 -
is that it is just one part of the entire 90011 kit -
and most people don't know you can buy the strut alone -
don't let the excellent price concern you -
it IS a top-quality part -

what is the difference between a gas charged strut
and one filled with hydraulic fluid?
all struts are filled with hydraulic fluid - oil -
"gas charged" struts and/or shocks
use a low-pressure charge of nitrogen gas
in the air chamber over the oil
rather than plain air - at atmospheric pressure -

the theory is that over time - during heavy use -
air bubbles can form in the oil of "regular" struts/shocks -
foaming up the oil - giving a soft/weak/sloppy ride -

the higher pressure nitrogen gas has less tendency to "mix" with the oil -
so no foaming - and a more constant ride -

under "normal" driving conditions -
in a side-by-side comparison -
you would NOT notice any difference -

driving the BAJA 1000 -
you WOULD notice a difference about halfway through -

======================
You need 4.7K Ohm 1/2W resistors
RadioShack #271-1124 -

a pack of 5 costs around $1.50 -
you will only use 4 of them -
one for each strut/shock -

 

[Lewis98272]

Thank you Bass for all of that extremely useful information. Looks like I've got a good little project for this weekend!

 

[motomack]

Re: 2002 ETC Stuts. monroe?

Well, how did the Monroe 30142 struts work out for you? I have searched and scoured for parts and information for so long that I can't wait any longer because my 2002 ETC is bouncing way out of control. I bought one 30142 and took many measurements to compare to the original AC Delco and there are many differences. Most notably is the bracket that the vertical stabilizer bolts to has a much larger diameter hole and off to the side more which might cause the front end to sit lower? Anyone actually try a set of these Monroe 30142 with any luck? Also, I disconnected the wiring to the passenger right strut and got no lights or warnings. I bought the Radio Shack 4.7K ohms resistor and was prepared to put it in place but so far haven't needed to. I will be disconnecting the driver's side left strut soon to see what happens. Would like to have all the electrical bugs figured out before I actually install some passive struts. I see Gabriel has a passive strut for 80 bucks each but I have tried Gabriel before for front and rear on my old 89 Eldo and they didn't last very long. I am about to give up and go with the Arnott passive kit but hate the idea of paying so much for just a passive strut with a resistor built in. Also, I have seen the Arnotts in person and they say assembled in USA but are made in China. I think the USA made Monroe 30142 for 35 bucks is the way to go if they actually fit right, ride right and the Radio Shack resistor works. Would like to hear from everyone, especially basscat and moist cabbage...thanks!

 

[basscatt]

Re: 2002 ETC Stuts. monroe?

Well, how did the Monroe 30142 struts work out for you? I have searched and scoured for parts and information for so long that I can't wait any longer because my 2002 ETC is bouncing way out of control. I bought one 30142 and took many measurements to compare to the original AC Delco and there are many differences. Most notably is the bracket that the vertical stabilizer bolts to has a much larger diameter hole and off to the side more which might cause the front end to sit lower? Anyone actually try a set of these Monroe 30142 with any luck? Also, I disconnected the wiring to the passenger right strut and got no lights or warnings. I bought the Radio Shack 4.7K ohms resistor and was prepared to put it in place but so far haven't needed to. I will be disconnecting the driver's side left strut soon to see what happens. Would like to have all the electrical bugs figured out before I actually install some passive struts. I see Gabriel has a passive strut for 80 bucks each but I have tried Gabriel before for front and rear on my old 89 Eldo and they didn't last very long. I am about to give up and go with the Arnott passive kit but hate the idea of paying so much for just a passive strut with a resistor built in. Also, I have seen the Arnotts in person and they say assembled in USA but are made in China. I think the USA made Monroe 30142 for 35 bucks is the way to go if they actually fit right, ride right and the Radio Shack resistor works. Would like to hear from everyone, especially basscat and moist cabbage...thanks!

=================================
Would like to hear from everyone, especially basscat and moist cabbage...thanks
what do you want to hear -
that I haven't already said?

if you don't want to spend $600 to $700 for EACH OEM strut -
the Monroe 30142 is the best choice - $62 - for the pair - including shipping -
http://www.partsgeek.com/pr1b8kh-cadillac-deville-strut-assembly.html?fp=pp

 

[MoistCabbage]

Ditto. I'd recommend the monroes before anything else if you want to go passive.

 

[motomack]

Re: 2002 ETC Stuts. monroe?

What I'd like to hear is from someone who actually put on a pair of passive Monroe 30142 and how they got the vertical stabilizer strut to match up since that particular strut is different in many ways to the stock strut. I can't even find a pair of electronic struts in AC Delco or Monroe at any price new. I can only find Delcos for the front right and they are anywhere from $550 to $750 and I won't consider buying a used left strut. Do the 30142 struts keep the same front end hight or is it lower? Why don't I get a warning or code since unplugging the front right strut or do both front struts have to be electrically unplugged to get codes? I know Submariner is a big fan of original equipment at any cost but where can you find an active pair in Delco or Monroe? Anyone have experience in the Arnott front passive kit SK-2178 and would you buy them again when they wear out? From what I am learning I will pass on Suncore and Strutmaster passive kits. This is the information I hope to find, please, and thank you for any and all replies!

 

[MoistCabbage]

Assuming the springs are clocked correctly onthe struts, ride height will be the same.

Unplugging any of the struts/shocks will trigger a code.

Arnott/Suncore/StrutMaster are all massively overpriced. They charge many times what a normal damper costs and all you get for the extra money is a $0.20 resistor.

We recommend Monroe all the time and with the exception of a couple of improper installs causing ride height issues, everyone is always happy with them.

 

[motomack]

Re: 2002 ETC Stuts. monroe?

Thanks for the quick replies, as I will be checking daily for any and all info or reccommendations. I have unplugged the front passenger strut and been driving for days now and no codes come up. I will be unplugging the front driver's next to see what happens and if I get the code I will try putting in the 4.7K ohm resistor to see if that works. I have used Monroes for years and they are decent for the money. I have tried Gabriel on 3 different vehicles and will not be going with them again. I agree the Arnotts are basically an average strut with very, very expensive resistors but they seem to match up closer to the stock struts almost exactly dimension-wise. I do want to try the Monroe 30142 struts, but right off the bat the stabilizer link mount is way different and does not match up. Also, someone mentioned their coil springs clang with after-market struts and I hate to keep dealing with these sorts of problems. Anyone out there actually have the Monroe 30142 on their own 2002 ETC now that can comment on their experience and if they would use them again? Please.

----------

Another thought, anyone use passive GM or AC Delco struts from a 2002 ESC in place of active struts on a ETC? Read another thread of GM 22064723 and 22064724 for around $140 from Rock Auto that is for a 2002 ESC. Anyone know if these would bolt up, stabilizer link match up and keep the same ride height? Thanks.

 

[motomack]

Re: 2002 ETC Stuts. monroe?

Just disconnected front driver's wiring and got the dreaded "vehicle speed limited to 90 mph" warning. Also got RSS C0584 and RSS C0579 codes. So I put in the 4.7 K ohm 1/2 watt resistor Radio Shack #271-1124 only on the driver's side and left the passenger front strut wires disconnected with no resistor and successfully cleared the codes and the speed warning went away. Took the car for a test ride and seemed to have a slight boost in low speed accelleration? Anyway, no warnings or codes for now but will keep driving to see what happens until I decide which struts to get. Would love to get a pair of the cheap passive Monroe 30142 on there if I can get everything to fit, such as the stabilizer link and hope the ride height is correct and no coil spring clanking noises. Thanks to all for their wisdom and time!

 

[MoistCabbage]

There is no difference in acceleration.

 

[Lewis98272]

The ride is amazing, the ride height is exactly the same. However, the base (where the spring sits) is flat on the stock strut and on these, their beveled. So when the suspension is loaded (resting normally off of a lift on the ground) and I go over a decent bump, the second rung of the spring comes into contact with the strut spring base causing a sharp metallic like noise in the cabin and a small but firm shudder in the steering wheel. Other than that, cruising down the freeway at 80mph, the car rides like a dream.

----------

Oh, and that's another thing, where the stabilizer bar link bolts into the strut is not the same. The OEM struts had a raised edge (kinda like a welded in thick washer). But these are flat. So I had to find some washers to bridge the gap so I could tighten the bolt. However the bolts keep working loose, I've tried everything including lock washers to no avail. I am really considering going with OEM ESC passive struts as I'm very displeased with how the fitment on these turned out. They ride great, but you have to do so much 'modification' in order for them to work properly. My advice after personally installing these on my 02 ETC last week. Stay away. Buy the OEM ESC passive units.

 

[motomack]

Re: 2002 ETC Stuts. monroe?

Lewis98272, was hoping to hear from someone who actually owned a 2002 ETC and actually tried out the passive Monroe 30142. I am assuming you used the Radio Shack resistor #271-1124 on both sides of the front and no longer experience problems with codes or warnings? I have one new 30142 that I have been comparing to the stock struts (still on the car and hard to get side by side but took many measurements) and see many differences. I did notice the base was different on the Monroe but never realized it would cause the spring to clang. My attention was the mounting bracket on the side of the strut where the vertical stabilizer link attaches. You mentioned using washers to bridge the gap to tighten the bolt which I also would have tried. But the hole in the stock strut bracket is not only thicker it is tapered to match the tapered end of the vertical stabilizer link for a pressed fit, and has to be thicker for that purpose. Also, the hole on the Monroe is off to the side or about 1/4" further away from the shock body than stock, which I believe will cause the stabilizer link to pull the coil spring down a bit and make the front end of the car sit a tad lower? I don't imagine you would notice the front end hight change unless you carefully examined after installing only one strut. I got O'Reilly's to get a set of exact replacement Arnott SK-2178 in and compared them side by side with the Monroe 30142 and you can better see the differences. I have not been able to compare the Arnotts with stock but I believe they would be a very close match. Also, the Arnott has the thicker tapered hole on the mounting bracket and appears to be in the correct position. I have read a thread of someone in Canada having a terrible experience with Arnott customer service because one strut would not extend and it was not possible to compress the coil enough to get it on. I have read from another who had Arnotts on a couple thousand miles and hated them and went back to stock active struts, which of course stock active would be best. But I have read from a few others that just don't like Arnott because basically they are a pair of fifty dollar struts with a pair of $300 resistors. I understand not liking the price but would like to also hear from someone who actually has the Arnott SK-2178 on their 2002 ETC to know how they fit and ride and if they would buy another set? I have found these Arnotts for $285 a pair shipped free from shockwarehouse.com and seriously considering them. I am also seriously considering the stock passive GM22064723 left and GM22064724 right that fit the ESC model. I think most ESC's come with a softer coil spring but the strut would actually bolt up exactly on the ETC. So you would basically have a passive strut with a stiffer coil spring giving a little firmer ride on the ETC, which should be better for all the potholes in NE Ohio? The stock ESC struts would cost about the same as the Arnotts so without actually trying either set or hearing from someone, it's a toss up. The Arnott advertises USA but I have physically had them in my hands and is stamped made in China, though mentions assembled in USA. The nice thing about the Arnotts is you don't have to wire up your own resistor since they have one in the kit and I think you could zip-tie it out of the way and go with another brand of passive struts in the future. I was ready to buy another Monroe 30142 and tackle this job, but after hearing from Lewis98272 and knowing the specs are off, I am thinking of Arnott or stock ESC struts. Before you swap struts Lewis98272, shop around for different vertical stabilizer links and you will find that Duralast brand (from AutoZone $22) does not have tapered ends and will mount better in the flat round hole in the Monroe bracket without washers and they should not come loose. But also, notice that brand link is about an 1/8" shorter in length compared to stock and along with the further offset bracket on the Monroe might pull the front end height down a bit more? Instead of going through a complete front strut replacement job and front end alignment, check out a couple different brands of stabilizer links (NAPA brand is also like Duralast which is also different than stock in that the threaded end is not tapered like stock and more like a regular stud) and you won't need washers and it won't come loose because it is near impossible to use washers on a tapered bolt and keep it tight...that make sense? Thanks!

 

[MoistCabbage]

Deleted.

 

[motomack]

Re: 2002 ETC Stuts. monroe?

What got deleted? Hoping to hear from Lewis and anyone else who has actual experience on ETC struts, including Arnott or stock ESC. Second day driving the car with front left strut wiring disconnected and resistor in place. Car seemed to leap forward when put into drive this morning on cold start-up. Also, tranny seems to shift a few seconds quicker with a slightly harder shift through gears. Will be tracking rpm's over next few days, especially on start-up. Stumped why resistor that works to block codes and warnings is 4.7K ohms when original strut reading disconnected is 12K ohms? Read somewhere that ESC has more gets better gas mileage around town with more torque/less HP than ETC, which has more HP/less torque. Wonder if using this particular value resistor influences the ETC to be more like an ESC? I'm sure you guys figure I'm out in left field by now? After owning 3 Eldorados ('83, '89 and '02) over the last 25 years and doing all my own repairs the mind (and the wallet) does appear to fade!

 

[MoistCabbage]

I deleted my post. Which was, you're over analyzing and overthinking this

 

[basscatt]

Re: 2002 ETC Stuts. monroe?

What got deleted? Hoping to hear from Lewis and anyone else who has actual experience on ETC struts, including Arnott or stock ESC. Second day driving the car with front left strut wiring disconnected and resistor in place. Car seemed to leap forward when put into drive this morning on cold start-up. Also, tranny seems to shift a few seconds quicker with a slightly harder shift through gears. Will be tracking rpm's over next few days, especially on start-up. Stumped why resistor that works to block codes and warnings is 4.7K ohms when original strut reading disconnected is 12K ohms? Read somewhere that ESC has more gets better gas mileage around town with more torque/less HP than ETC, which has more HP/less torque. Wonder if using this particular value resistor influences the ETC to be more like an ESC? I'm sure you guys figure I'm out in left field by now? After owning 3 Eldorados ('83, '89 and '02) over the last 25 years and doing all my own repairs the mind (and the wallet) does appear to fade!

===========================
I'm sure you guys figure I'm out in left field by now
left field? - no - you aren't even in the ballpark anymore -

===================

after reading ALL your posts -
I have reconsidered my recommendation -

DO NOT buy the Monroe struts -
forget I EVER mentioned Monroe -
you will NEVER be satisfied with them -

go with the ACDelco OEM passive struts for the base Eldo -

LEFT -
ACDELCO 505525 - GM 22064723

RIGHT -
ACDELCO 505526 - GM 22064724

======================

if you want to spend twice as much -
and get a crappy strut -
buy the arnott struts -

===================

Stumped why resistor that works to block codes and warnings is 4.7K ohms
when original strut reading disconnected is 12K ohms?
the 4.7K ohm does NOT block codes -

the 4.7K ohm resister represents an ELECTRONIC LOAD -
that the original ACTIVE struts - and shocks have -

the computer recognizes - and accepts this artificial load
as being a fully functioning active strut - or shock -
and is tricked into believing the correct - active unit is there and working -

==================================

Read somewhere that ESC has more gets better gas mileage around town
with more torque/less HP than ETC, which has more HP/less torque.
the ETC has a VIN-9 motor - yes it has different intake cams -
and different computer settings - and is rated higher - 300HP -
compared to the VIN-Y motor at 275HP -

the ETC trans has a lower different "final ratio" 3.77 to 1 -
compared to the base eldo 3.11 to 1 final drive -

that difference means your engine is turning faster at the same speed -
there are charts that show the difference posted quite often -
so - you get less gas mileage -

Wonder if using this particular value resistor
influences the ETC to be more like an ESC?
- absolutely - besides the suspension difference -
the headlights will be brighter -
AND - the turn signals will flash slower too -

oh - if you have a sunroof -
you might notice it closing faster -
so - watch your fingers - :lildevil:

 

[motomack]

Re: 2002 ETC Stuts. monroe?

You guys are great and funny as well! I have always been accused of over-analyzing things and agree. I have a Bachelor of Science degree and since grade school they make you learn many things in depth to the Nth degree that you will never use in life so when there is something I need to do I research it and ask questions in hopes of doing the job right the first time.