[jcar302]

Well, it happened, what i've been warning my father about owning a luxury car out of warranty.
Only a couples months out of warranty now, his 2000 sts engine blew a HG, and water in the oil trashed the engine, i'll assume the bearings and rings.
Car has been properly maintained and driven by a 55 year that drives pathetically slow. Has seen very little full throttle runs.

My parents are at the dealer freaking out as we speak.
Based on the fact that they have made several complaints about oil useage over the last year and a half. IMO a quart every 700-1000 miles was way too much, hell my explorer burns 0 quarts every 5000 miles.

Is this a common problem? Was there any recalls on this car?

This car has been a nightmare, i wanted him to rid of it long ago. Always sounded like it had a valve tick, shredded front tires like they were going out of style, and the trunk has leaked water 1/2 a dozen times.

 

[Playdrv4me]

Sadly, everything you mentioned there... save for the valve tick, which was probably nothing, are COMMON problems.

The oil consumption is nearly as severe an issue as the headgasket problem, BUT you can live with it, the headgasket problem results in more damage if its not repaired. I wouldnt say the car is DONE per-se, but it will be about a 2500-3000.00 repair.

You mentioned that your dad drives "pathetically slow" with no high throttle usage... Well, contrary to what you would believe, this is actually a bad thing. The Northstar builds up deposits quickly if not given wide open throttle runs at least every so often, its an engine thats designed to be wound out and run.

If the naysayers are keeping count (ajtxcman), add another 2000 to the list. :nono:

 

[jadcock]

The valve tick was probably carbon deposits from being under-used. Burning over a quart of oil every 1000 miles IS too much oil -- that should have been corrected earlier in the car's life. Is your father the original owner? Most Northstar engines will use a quart of oil every 1000-4000 miles, depending on how deep the hone pattern is on that particular engine. My '97 SLS used a quart every 4000-5000 miles...not much. My '01 STS seems to use a quart every 2000 miles or so (but I haven't owned it long enough to know). My '01 actually had a new engine installed by the original owner because of oil consumption issues. It probably wasn't driven hard enough and the rings gummed up.

My '97 had almost 160,000 miles on the original head gaskets when I sold it. And it's still going strong in Arizona (my brother owns the car). My '01 only has about 25,000 miles on the new engine, so way too early to tell about head gaskets. Head gasket failures on the 2000+ engines are pretty rare. Nothing's impossible, but it's certainly not as "common" as it is with the earlier engines.

Edit: it's also odd to see coolant in the engine oil, even with a head gasket failure, on these engines. Sounds like a situation that is out of the ordinary.

 

[jcar302]

Also forgot, twice it had water pump issues.

Seems after my father (who is used to be in a high power position) called a meeting with all top guys at cadillac, they landed up making him a deal to either fix it for $500, or offer him trade in value towards another car.

At least they seem to be making good.

 

[JC316]

Damn that sucks. Another one bites the dust. Well if he decides to sell it outright, tell him that I would be interested in it.

 

[jcar302]

If they are truely going to give him trade in value, which is about 8K, i'm trying to convince him to put it towards an awd srx.
Although for some reason he wants to keep this POS and pay the $500 to have it fixed.

 

[EDBSO]

If they are truely going to give him trade in value, which is about 8K, i'm trying to convince him to put it towards an awd srx.
Although for some reason he wants to keep this POS and pay the $500 to have it fixed.

Fix it and trade for a Toyota and he will have the same oil consumption problems but not before 1,200,000 miles.

 

[danbuc]

I say fix it, and then beat the dog piss out of it.


I seem to remember something about the 2000 model year run of N*'s suffered from a porous block problem. Something about the aluminum which was used or some crap. That's why I stayed away from 2000 Sevilles. Anyway, coolant in the oil is BAD, and likely trashed the rod and crack bearings. If that milkshake made it up tot he heads, I'd be concerned about the cam bearings and races as well. Sucks, but with only 50k on it, the car's still got a lot of life left in her. Plus, SRX's aren't as fun to drive as Sevilles...and they don't have that cool factor the STS does either.

 

[jadcock]

Bottom line is, even if he puts a whole new motor in, for a few grand, he'll have a car that's classier and "cooler" than most new cars out there today (including ANY Toy from Japan :stirpot: ). No reason to dump it now. He's already into it. Might as well fix it and run it like he owns it.

 

[Ranger]

If they are going to fix it correctly (with Timeserts) for $500, that is a steal and he should kiss them. Jump on it.

 

[misfit6794]

I thought it had been almost a week without a headgasket post. Yea toyotas are rock solid, biggest expense is oil changes and tires.

 

[jcar302]

I think it helps that we are long time cadillac customers at this dealer, i think at this point my parents are 6 deep.

Wouldn't it be wiser for them to just get a Junk Yard engine? I can't imagine them rebuilding an engine that's had the bearings and rings washed out.

BTW, i got the full scoop on the cars problems in the past:
3 times for alignment/tire eating
2 times for the water pump
3 times for leaking trunk
2 times for fuel pump

And now this mess.

for an adult driven, well maintained car, this thing really is a POS, i've beaten cars badly and not come up with any of these problems.

I'm guessing from some of your guys posts the HG's are a weak point, which is horrible since there is no boost running through this thing.

 

[Playdrv4me]

Thing is, you wont find another single car quite like the STS for the same kind of money. Id take the 500.00 repair offer and run. That doesnt happen often.

 

[jadcock]

3 times for alignment/tire eating
2 times for the water pump
3 times for leaking trunk
2 times for fuel pump

And now this mess.

Oh, geez, that's nothin'. My father-in-law's Toyota Tacoma has gone through three starters, BOTH rear leaf springs failed/broke, exhaust leaks, and various interior trims falling apart. (That truck is why they don't drive Toyotas anymore). Cars have problems. That's just a fact of life. Jumping ship because of one vehicle isn't the answer. My father-in-law's truck was probably out-of-the-ordinary bad. Your parents' STS might be the same way.

Again, are they the original owners? If not, you can't judge the car -- you have no idea how it was driven or maintained in the past. I don't blame the alignment problems on the car -- that's an alignment guy who can't get it right. Same thing with the leaking trunk. It should have been fixed once. Going back for 3 repeat visits speaks of shoddy labor to me. 2 water pumps and 2 fuel pumps, that's weird. Those are not normally failure points on these cars. Fuel pump replacements are almost unheard of.

If they can promise a repair for $500, and they know about the internal damage to the engine, that sounds like a deal to me. If not, I would look for a used engine, yes. It'll cost him a few grand to purchase the engine and install it. But the car is likely paid for at this point, and a few grand for a replacement engine is nothing, financially, compared with trying to buy something else. Your dad apparently knows that he likes his 2000 STS, and I don't blame him a bit for wanting to fix it. He knows he wouldn't get anything near that nice for the small amount of money it'll take to get it back on the road.

It sucks that the engine needs to be replaced, but that's water under the bridge now. It's time to move forward with a decision. I like his, to want to repair it and get on with life.

 

[jadcock]

And the Toyota-lovers need to get their head of that Consumer Reports magazine and read the news. Toyota has already recalled over 500,000 vehicles this calendar year (and that was in February, just 2 months into the year). Businessweek, in January, reported that Toyota has recalled 9.3 million vehicles in the last three years. They've recalled more than they've built. And of course, that doesn't count the 3.5 million vehicles included in the class action lawsuit they just settled regarding oil sludge formation in Toyota and Lexus engines.

QUALITY? I guess that's Consumer Reports' definition of quality, but it's certainly not mine.

 

[iametarq]

:yeah: A friend of mine has a Toyota Corolla that had some issue that lost nearly ALL of its oil while driving back to MI from New York. When he got it to the dealer in MI they told him it was a "common" problem with some seal...It was so common that his Dad's Corolla did the same thing about 2 months late.

It pains me to see all of this bashing on Cadillac here. :rant2:

If your parent's dealer is fixing it for $500 take it and continue to let your parents love the car!

 

[caddydaddy]

The 2000 Northstars did have casting problems that led to porous blocks. Mine was one of them! At around 44,000 miles I started smelling coolant. I took it to the dealer, and they replaced the water pump. After that, I kept smelling coolant, and they said that coolant was leaking through the block in the intake valley. So who knows if the water pump was leaking or, they just replaced it just in case??? So a new 2002 engine was installed. But luckily for me Cadillac paid for it!
By now though, I would think that all the engines that had porous blocks from that year would have been replaced.

 

[EcSTSatic]

Also forgot, twice it had water pump issues.

Seems after my father (who is used to be in a high power position) called a meeting with all top guys at cadillac, they landed up making him a deal to either fix it for $500, or offer him trade in value towards another car.

At least they seem to be making good.

$500 is a fantastic deal!

Did the waterpump issues ever cause the engine to overheat? Honestly.

 

[Playdrv4me]

The 2000 Northstars did have casting problems that led to porous blocks. Mine was one of them! At around 44,000 miles I started smelling coolant. I took it to the dealer, and they replaced the water pump. After that, I kept smelling coolant, and they said that coolant was leaking through the block in the intake valley. So who knows if the water pump was leaking or, they just replaced it just in case??? So a new 2002 engine was installed. But luckily for me Cadillac paid for it!
By now though, I would think that all the engines that had porous blocks from that year would have been replaced.

Weve had numerous 2002's on here with HG failure as well. Only year I havent seen affected yet is 2003.

 

[Ur7x]

Ya to that.. The parts alone ('serts, new bolts and gaskets) are almost $500.