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2003 Deville DTS
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Discussion Starter #1
A little while ago I took my car to the dealership to have this recall performed: Cadillac Deville Electrical System Recall 14V355000

I had this, among a few other non-related items performed, including replacement of an intake manifold and I think the PCM valve.

When I picked the car up, the next day the car randomly shut off on me.

The forums here suggested the most likely culprit to be the two crank position sensors, as GM had a bad batch during my model years.

I purchased two new AC Delco sensors.

I took it to the dealership to have them installed, which they did and ran a "learn" performance.

Picked the car up today and it shut off going 70 mph on the highway. Then shut off 3 more times before I got it home.

I have no idea what to do. No codes are coming up. Could it be bad sensors? They are new. Could it be related to the recall performance?

Please help.

Thanks
 

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2002.5 F55 CORSA STS, 2014 Explorer XLT FWD
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CKPs do not normally cause high speed or even cruise speed random stalls. They usually act up during warmup at loop changeover or during slow speed slowdowns or coasting into a slow turn.

No idea what was involved in your electrical recall fix.

PCV valve ??? Your engine has a fixed orifice, not a rattle valve. No replacement necessary. Maybe the PCV dirty air line was broken/cracked ?
 

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I usually shut down at full warm up. Once it shut down while warming up.

Today it shut down on the highway while the accelerator pedal was depressed. It shut down at 25 MPH and shut down while at a stop sign.

The work performed last time was:

1) Replaced PCV Hose and Intake Manifold

2) Replaced shifter assembly

3) Safety recall: Key ring inserts

After that, it just shut off randomly.

Today, replaced CKP (both)

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It also takes about 4-5 cranks before it starts back up
 

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2002.5 F55 CORSA STS, 2014 Explorer XLT FWD
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You mean "several separate cranking attempts" or "it rolls over 5 times" before it starts ?

Separate cranking attempts with no start is not normal, and is/was probably not the CKP (CranKshaft Position sensor(s).

Something else is wrong. Is the intake ducting - from the filter box to the MAF and TB - in perfect (no leaks) condition and tightly clamped ?
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Good question, I dont know if they have no leaks.

When it shuts off, the digital dash goes black (off completely), all power steering is lost, and the A/C shuts off.

I put it in park, turn the key (crank) to no avail. The response i get from cranking is similar to trying to crank with a dead battery without the clicking.

3 or 4 more cranks and its starts up and goes.
 

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2002.5 F55 CORSA STS, 2014 Explorer XLT FWD
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Sounds like either a dead battery (or shorted cells) or a very loose 12 volt power feed.

Everything going black with an engine stall is 12 volt related - if only the engine stalled, that's one set of problems; total car shutdown is power failure, big time.
 

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2003 Deville DTS
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Discussion Starter #7
How can i diagnose that? The shorted cells, loose 12 volt power feed?? The battery is only about 9 months old.

It's just strange that it started happening after the ignition recall was performed, but they said the recall was performed correctly.
 

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First place to start is battery cables and terminals - at the battery, underhood fuse box, ground studs.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
I am having a hard time thinking it could be battery related. I let the car sit for a month and it started right up, and then does actually start up after those few cranks. I'm taking it back to the dealer Monday and opened a case with GM earlier.

They had it twice within less than 60 miles and did not find anything proactively, nor any codes that indicated the failure.

If anyone has any additional thoughts or opinions, please feel free to chime in. Thank you
 

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Master of the Dark Art of Diagnostics
2003 DHS - two-2002 DHS, 2003 SLS, 1995 Sedan DeVille, 1989 Coupe DeVille
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Cadillac Deville Electrical System Recall 14V355000
that is simply a small plastic oval insert/filler - and a smaller key ring -
put onto the handle of the key - pretty much a waste of time -

this is what you get -



Picked the car up today and it shut off going 70 mph on the highway.
Then shut off 3 more times before I got it home.
NOT indicative of faulty/failing Crankshaft Position Sensors -

No codes are coming up
codes don't just "come up" on their own -
there is a procedure you go through to actually "pull codes" -

go here to learn how to pull codes -
http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/cadillac-deville-1985-2005-including-1985/138257-how-pull-codes-dtcs.html

Could it be related to the recall performance?
no - the key recall has nothing to do with even touching the car -
see the pic above -
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Sorry... what I meant was, no codes come up through a diagnostic that are indicative of this problem. All are related to other problems, like HVAC, ABS, front circuit solenoid, etc.

If it is not the CP sensors... what else should we be looking for? It's too dangerous to drive with this issue.

Here are all of the codes that are active.

RSS C0584 Current: Right Front Solenoid Circuit Open
RSS C0582 Current: Right Front Solenoid Circuit Low
RSS C0579 Current: Left Front Solenoid Circuit Open
RSS C0577 Current: Left front Solenoid Circuit Low
IPM B0429 Current: B0409 - Air Mix Door #1 Range Error
DDM B1591 : Mirror Vert. Pos Sensor-Out of Range/Open
ABS U1000: Class 2 Communication Malfunction
ABS C1287 Steering Sensor Rate Malfunction
 

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Master of the Dark Art of Diagnostics
2003 DHS - two-2002 DHS, 2003 SLS, 1995 Sedan DeVille, 1989 Coupe DeVille
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19,286 Posts
2) Replaced shifter assembly
why?

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the random shut-downs sound more like a loose battery cable -
or a main ground failure -

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It's just strange that it started happening after the ignition recall was performed,
but they said the recall was performed correctly.

forget about the recall - has nothing to do with it -
they never touched the car during that recall procedure -

the "ignition recall" was just a small piece of plastic -
to fill in the opening in the key - and a smaller key ring -
to prevent you from putting too many keys on the ring -

-----------------

I am much more interested/concerned about the reason for replacing the shifter assembly -
 

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Discussion Starter #13
The shifter assembly was replaced because the shifter was stuck in park, unable to go into any gear without pushing the small orange release clip. There was a Brake Light Switch replaced first, which did not work, and then the brake lights failed altogether. The dealer said it was the shift solenoid, but the way to fix it did not come alone, but as a whole assembly.

Since it was replaced, the shifter shifts into gear from park perfect.

How could I diagnose a main ground failure? And would that, or the loose cable cause intermittent engine shut down? while driving or parked?

I never had the issue until the shift assembly, recall, PCV and intake manifold were replaced/repaired. I understand about putting the recall out of the line of reasoning.
 

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Master of the Dark Art of Diagnostics
2003 DHS - two-2002 DHS, 2003 SLS, 1995 Sedan DeVille, 1989 Coupe DeVille
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19,286 Posts
The shifter assembly was replaced because the shifter was stuck in park
unable to go into any gear without pushing the small orange release clip.
hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
also related to electrical -

There was a Brake Light Switch replaced first,
which did not work,
electrical problem -

then the brake lights failed altogether
starting to develop a pattern here -

How could I diagnose a main ground failure?
strictly "grunt work" -

start at the battery - under the seat -
check that the battery connections are tight -
then check the short ground connection to the floor -

everything MUST be clean and tight -

then go under the hood -
check both the main positive and ground connections and at the fuse boxes -
 

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Discussion Starter #15
I see the pattern, but are you suggesting they could all be connected to the battery issue? I know the shifter not moving from park and the solenoid going out were common issues.
 

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Master of the Dark Art of Diagnostics
2003 DHS - two-2002 DHS, 2003 SLS, 1995 Sedan DeVille, 1989 Coupe DeVille
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19,286 Posts
I see the pattern,
but are you suggesting they could all be connected to the battery issue?

could be all connected -
may be battery related -
may be battery CABLE/ground related -

did you ever have a problem turning the ignition off -
and removing the key?
 

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Discussion Starter #19
03 DTS Short to battery code in history

I've posted recently about stalling while driving and having the CP sensors replaced to no avail. Suggestion about a battery issue. I checked, it seems everything was tight and clean. These codes are in history:


DDM U1301 History: Class 2 Short to Battery
MSM B1327 History: Device Power Circuit Low
AMP U1064 History Loss of Communications with DIM
ABS U1056 History: Loss of Communications with RSS
IRC U1016 History: Loss of Class 2 Communication with VCM


Could this cause the car to shut off while driving? How is it diagnosed?
 
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