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Suspension, Brakes and Tires Discussion, Shake Shimmy STS in Item Specific Cadillac Discussion; Originally Posted by El Dobro Has anyone tried the updated lower control arms? Myself, I will not put out the ...
  1. #106
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    Re: Shake Shimmy STS

    Quote Originally Posted by El Dobro
    Has anyone tried the updated lower control arms?
    Myself, I will not put out the money for the control arms. I have yet to hear that the control arms solved the issue. Everything that I have read, with folks who have had them changed, has stated the vibration still existed after.

    Don

  2. #107
    JPL189 is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: Shake Shimmy STS

    El Dobro,
    My dealer, who was actually pretty helpful at attempting to eliminate the problem, replaced the lower control arms under warranty. Although he felt there was some minor improvement, I couldn't feel any significant improvement.

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    Re: Shake Shimmy STS

    Okay, I ordered the upper mounts from www.gmpartsdirect.com and they are set to be here on Tuesday. Hopefully the new mounts will cure the problem, but, I am thinking ahead a little. As stated earlier, the only cars that seem affected, are cars that do not have dogbones. So, aside from the dogbones themselves, what else does our dogboneless cars need, to retro fit them in there? I have a 2002 Seville, and know for a fact, that a 2002 Eldo, has dogbones. I cannot imagine, that the N* in the two cars is different. So, that would make me assume, that any engine bracketry would just bolt in place. But what about the upper radiator mount? Is it different between the two cars? Can an Eldo mount be bolted to it? Does anyone know the answers to these questions? Thanks in advance.

    Don

  4. #109
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    Re: Shake Shimmy STS

    Logan,
    Any new resloutions? It sounds like you are on the right track to root the cause. I also would like to retro fit my 99 sts with the up dated sub frame mounts. So far Michellin Tires and Road Force balancing has taken care of 95% of my shimmy/shake.
    Frank

  5. #110
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    Re: Shake Shimmy STS

    Don-I can't see any differences on the engines. When you buy the dogbones for an Eldorado from GM, they come with the bracket that mounts it to the radiator support. Whether or not it'll reach on the Sevilles is another story.

    I don't know how soft the three oil-filled engine/transmission mounts on the Seville are, but I can tell you that the mount in the back is fairly soft. That's why I keep thinking it's the engine that ampliflies the shake. I mentioned before that one of the board members put a solid racing mount in place of the front mount and he said that the ride improved.

    I have a book that GM put out on the '98 Sevilles just before the introduction and it has blurbs in there how the changed the engine mounting to isolate it better and how they used new bushings on the front control arms to absorb wheel deflection over big bumps. Maybe it's a combination of the two that's creating the problem.

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    Re: Shake Shimmy STS

    Quote Originally Posted by El Dobro
    Don-I can't see any differences on the engines. When you buy the dogbones for an Eldorado from GM, they come with the bracket that mounts it to the radiator support. Whether or not it'll reach on the Sevilles is another story.

    I don't know how soft the three oil-filled engine/transmission mounts on the Seville are, but I can tell you that the mount in the back is fairly soft. That's why I keep thinking it's the engine that ampliflies the shake. I mentioned before that one of the board members put a solid racing mount in place of the front mount and he said that the ride improved.

    I have a book that GM put out on the '98 Sevilles just before the introduction and it has blurbs in there how the changed the engine mounting to isolate it better and how they used new bushings on the front control arms to absorb wheel deflection over big bumps. Maybe it's a combination of the two that's creating the problem.
    So the '97 & '98 - newer N*'s have different engine / tranny mounts? Also the Eldo's engine mounts are different? I was unaware of this. The only thing I knew as definites, were the cradle, and the dogbones. Well, maybe I am getting too far ahead. Let me do the upper cradle mounts, and see what happens.

    Don

  7. #112
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    Re: Shake Shimmy STS

    agood1...that is why I think Logan is on the right track with the cradle mounts.
    Yep.

    I just had my tires balanced (as in road-force) and rotated again today. Before this, my vibrations were occurring between 72-77MPH. Now that the tires have been rotated, the range is 70-75. It's still there, it just occurs in a different range.

    This appears to be a matter of harmonics and the resonant frequency that will change with regard to change in the balance and rotation of the wheel/tire combination. In other words, it doesn't matter if you're running with the OEM GoodYear Eagle LS' (that gathered a lot of complaints in previous threads) or Michelins (that a lot of us went to as replacements), and it doesn't matter if you have had the tires road-force balanced (as a lot of us had done). The problem may seem to be marginal at times, however it still exists.

    Logan is definately on the right track here. It is just a matter of finding the right cradle bushings to eliminate this issue.

    Question,

    Would it be possible to make replacement bushings out of a material like urethane or UHMW?

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    Re: Shake Shimmy STS

    I received the new upper cradle mounts today, and, they do not appear to be any stiffer than the old ones. I will not know for sure until I get the old ones out though. Hopefully it is nice this weekend, so I can swap them. I will update when it is done.

    Don

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    Exclamation Re: Shake Shimmy STS

    It had been very mild here in Nashville, then winter came...

    So, I have been driving the car with the sockets still trapped in place and the stiffened upper strut mounts. The only problem I have is a pop sound every now and then.

    Car has been driving smoother then it ever did before. Its a currently a joy to drive.

    I have the solid cradle mounts ready to go.....just waiting for some warmer weather.




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    Re: Shake Shimmy STS

    Don,
    Can you make a note of the part numbers on the cushions you ordered? I have looked at replacing mine....but I can't get the correct part numbers....

    Logan, hopefully you will get some better weather....been pretty nice in Atlanta, but as they say around here. "if you don't like the weather in Atlanta, just wait a couple of days"

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    Re: Shake Shimmy STS

    I had some time after work today, and tried doing the mounts. The upper mounting plate, has a sleeve, that the bolt goes through. I could not get the mount plate off, as the cradle would not drop down far enough. After re-examinimg this, I came to the conclusion, that the upper plate, is most of the problem. The rubber wears, and the lower mount plate, presses on the sleeve in the upper plate. Thus, not having pressure where it belongs, on the rubber mounts. I am going to try and find an appropriate spacer, that I can put between the lower mount, and the lower mount plate. This will distance the lower plate, from the upper plate sleeve.

    On a side note, this day is just wonderful. Not only did this project bust, but my windshield cracked this morning. Nothing hit it, it just cracked. So I am getting a new one tomorrow, at a cost of $343.01. SOB. I hope everyone elses day is going better than mine.

    Don

  12. #117
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    Re: Shake Shimmy STS

    Quote Originally Posted by agood1
    Don,
    Can you make a note of the part numbers on the cushions you ordered? I have looked at replacing mine....but I can't get the correct part numbers....

    Logan, hopefully you will get some better weather....been pretty nice in Atlanta, but as they say around here. "if you don't like the weather in Atlanta, just wait a couple of days"
    I posted the numbers on the previous page.

    Don

  13. #118
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    Re: Shake Shimmy STS

    Don,

    Are you saying you could not replace cradle mounts....are made into the cradle?

  14. #119
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    Re: Shake Shimmy STS

    Quote Originally Posted by agood1
    Don,

    Are you saying you could not replace cradle mounts....are made into the cradle?
    The cradle mounts are as follows. A lower mount plate (bolt goes through it, and lower mount sits between it and the cradle), lower mount bushing, cradle, upper mount bushing, upper mount plate. The bolt goes through it all, and goes into the frame. The upper mount plate (between the frame and upper mount bushing) has a sleeve in it (it is about 3-4" liong, and the bolt goes through it), that makes contact with the lower mount plate. When I lowered the cradle, it only dropped about 3". I loosened the left side motor mount, and the left side strut. This didn't help any. Anyway, I couldn't get the upper mount plate off. The sleeve was still in the cradle, and I needed more room. I couldn't figure out how to get the cradle lower, so I just put it all back together. I am now on the hunt for some heavy rubber, or thick steel, to make a shim, to install between the lower plate, and the lower mount. This will stop the lower plate from contacting the sleeve, and allow the rubber mounts to compress and do thier jobs. I hope this wasn't confusing. I know what i am trying to say, and I confused myself with this.

    Don

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    Exclamation Re: Shake Shimmy STS

    I also have not found the room to remove the upper mount plate.

    I am begining to think the you remove the mount bolts on 1 side....and loosen the mount bolts on the other side. Maybe that will provide enough room...

    I also cannot figure out how the lower rubber comes off the cradle....



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