1984 Coupe DeVille Engine Swap! - Page 31
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RWD 19xx-1984 DeVille and Fleetwood,
1985-1996 Fleetwood and Brougham Forum Discussion, 1984 Coupe DeVille Engine Swap! in Past Cadillac Vehicle Discussion; I'll be playing with the DeVille tomorrow. I went to the local performance parts shop (E & D Performance) looking ...
  1. #451
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    Re: 1984 Coupe DeVille Engine Swap!

    I'll be playing with the DeVille tomorrow. I went to the local performance parts shop (E & D Performance) looking for shims today. They didn't have any packs of JUST shims (just shims and starter bolts) so they went out back and just GAVE me 3 shims they had laying around! Wooooo! I've gotten parts from them for this project before, and I will definitely continue to do so. Especially after that!
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  2. #452
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    Re: 1984 Coupe DeVille Engine Swap!

    I got my starter shims installed yesterday. I put all three of them in, and the starter isn't making that loud "clank" noise when it engages, but it still won't turn over. The battery I was using is a good one, and I do have the proper Olds flexplate in there. What I don't know is if I don't have the starter shimmed enough, or if my starter is junk. I noticed that the pinion drive doesn't want to disengage all of the way when you let off of the key. Here is a video of what it's doing.



    Any ideas?

    (Also, thanks to my lovely girlfriend Amber for turning the key for me. )
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  3. #453
    csbuckn is offline Cadillac Owners Master
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    Starter engagement looks good, it will fully disengage when it's spinning the motor so I wouldn't worry about that. Did you take any plugs out. I think you should turn it over a few times by hand to get them rings moving. It will be a big pain in the butt but that will probably get things moving.
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  4. #454
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    Quote Originally Posted by csbuckn
    Starter engagement looks good, it will fully disengage when it's spinning the motor so I wouldn't worry about that. Did you take any plugs out. I think you should turn it over a few times by hand to get them rings moving. It will be a big pain in the butt but that will probably get things moving.
    This....I'd roll it by hand a few times.

  5. #455
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    Re: 1984 Coupe DeVille Engine Swap!

    You should be able to grab the flexplate and spin the engine over (barely) by hand (two hands, actually).

  6. #456
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    Re: 1984 Coupe DeVille Engine Swap!

    Doh! I forgot to pull the plugs this time. I put them back in last since I had all of the starter engagement issues. It moved that little bit the first time when they were out, but it didn't spin or expel any Mystery Oil. I can get the big breaker bar and spin the engine with the plugs out after work tomorrow. Thanks!

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    Re: 1984 Coupe DeVille Engine Swap!

    You don't need to take the plugs out.

  8. #458
    The-Dullahan is offline Cadillac Owners Master
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    Re: 1984 Coupe DeVille Engine Swap!

    ^This. Still though, if you've not spun the engine manually, I would start there.

    Earlier, I asked you if you were certain that the starter was engaging.

    At the same time, having seen a better video now on a computer, instead of a cellphone, while on a sunny highway, I am still not so sure. It looks (as Sam already said too) like the starter is not quite lining into the teeth where it should. This may just be the way the video appears. I'd say spin it a few times, then try again.

    Though only the Gods (and maybe not even them) know when my engine swap project will start (being in the same state as my engine/Cadillac would probably help, but that is a luxury I seldom have) I can say that I actually turn the engine over essentially every time I look at it. May haps I can avoid this pain when the time comes.
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    Re: 1984 Coupe DeVille Engine Swap!

    Here's what comes to mind, in order of least to most likely.

    - backwards flexplate (?)
    - bad battery
    - bad cable connection on battery or starter
    - bad ground

  10. #460
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    Re: 1984 Coupe DeVille Engine Swap!

    Quote Originally Posted by jayoldschool View Post
    Here's what comes to mind, in order of least to most likely.

    - backwards flexplate (?)
    - bad battery
    - bad cable connection on battery or starter
    - bad ground
    Chamus suggested a bad ground on the phone. Any problem if I ground it to the cylinder head? I'll try and find a bigger bolt to ground it to either way. Also, I have been using the 590 cca battery that my winter beater has in it. (It's the wrong battery for my '93 FWD DeVille so it's REALLY wrong for my '84.) My local Advance has an 800 cca battery for 130 bucks. I could use a new one in the FWD DeVille, so I could buy that, try it in the '84, and then have a good new battery for my '93. I will take a picture of my battery connections, but my starter connections are clean and nice and tight.

    I also checked the cylinders for any trace of the oil I put in before storage. They are bone dry. I hosed a little Marvel Mystery Oil into each. It can't hurt anything, right?

    Thanks for helping me plow through this problem. My DeVille and I thank you guys.

  11. #461
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    Re: 1984 Coupe DeVille Engine Swap!

    Quote Originally Posted by jayoldschool View Post
    You should be able to grab the flexplate and spin the engine over (barely) by hand (two hands, actually).
    I was going to post this yesterday almost word for word.


    If you can' turn it, then take the plugs out and hope and pray it is just super good compression.

  12. #462
    csbuckn is offline Cadillac Owners Master
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    I still don't think it's the starter. The noise it was making at the end of the video tells me that it's getting enough juice from the battery but the motor is just too hard to turn. I would rotate the motor one full rotation by hand just so you can get any crud off the newly honed cylinder walls. Didn't you mention that the motor had been very hard to rotate by hand before? I will say that there is no way I can rotate my motor by hand. It was so hard to rotate when I first built it that I thought my starter wasn't going to turn mine also. Probably why my starter was giving me problems.

  13. #463
    cadillac kevin's Avatar
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    Turn it by hand? I don't think that's possible with the spark plugs in it. When I took a serp. setup off a 350 in the junkyard, I could not rotate the front pulley with a breaker bar.
    My dad said back in the day (i.e. back in the 80s when he lived in the hood....so its probably something he learned from some old guy), you'd use a breaker bar and try to turn the front pulley of the engine. If it turned, the engine had really bad compression. If it stayed put, you'd pull the plugs and try to turn it again (to make sure it wasn't seized).
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  14. #464
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    Re: 1984 Coupe DeVille Engine Swap!

    Quote Originally Posted by csbuckn View Post
    I still don't think it's the starter. The noise it was making at the end of the video tells me that it's getting enough juice from the battery but the motor is just too hard to turn. I would rotate the motor one full rotation by hand just so you can get any crud off the newly honed cylinder walls. Didn't you mention that the motor had been very hard to rotate by hand before? I will say that there is no way I can rotate my motor by hand. It was so hard to rotate when I first built it that I thought my starter wasn't going to turn mine also. Probably why my starter was giving me problems.
    It was at first. Once I got it rotating it was fine and I could turn it over with relative ease with the breaker bar on the crank nut. I took the plugs out today and tried turning it with the breaker bar, and I couldn't get it to budge. I will say that I had some crappy angles for leverage. When I got the engine turning the first time, it was on the stand in the basement, and I could get at the crank nut from any angle I needed to. Unfortunately I can't get a good angle in the car. Hence me spraying a little Marvel Mystery Oil into each cylinder. I will let that marinate for a few days and see what happens.

    What confuses me the most about all of this is when I had the crappy ancient battery in the car and a big marine battery hooked to that to boost it (about a week ago), the starter must have popped into alignment once (it wasn't shimmed yet) and it turned the engine about an inch. I wasn't imagining it or just seeing things, as I had my hand on the crank pulley when it moved. My hand actually moved over and followed the belts when it lurched. That is why I am so persistent in thinking the engine isn't stuck.

  15. #465
    csbuckn is offline Cadillac Owners Master
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    By hand I mean with hand tools. I've turned some motors with my hands at the crank pulley and flexplate but not a new one. You can turn the motor by putting a prybar between the starter and flexplate and turning it, lots of leverage that way.

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