'96 Fleetwood struggles to fire cold. Anyone?

[Fat96]

Hi,

I'm glad to find this forum. Lot's of great info here!

I'm having trouble starting my '96 Fleetwood Brougham when it's cold. It turns over fine, but takes 3 or 4 good spins to catch fire. After running for a few minutes though it will start up again no problem.

Anyone familiar with this?

My mechanic had it for 3 days and it started for him first time, every time. (Ain't that always the way.) He thought it might be the pass key and had me clean it with rubbing alcohol, but no help.

Any insight/advice is appreciated.

[lochenjons]

my suburban does the same thing. i've been too lazy to investigate it. my theory is there's not enough pressure in the fuel lines to get it to fire right away.

let's see what others come up with.

[tankaillc]

I would suggest checking the fuel pressure to make sure the fuel pump is doing it's job properly. Have you changed the fuel filter yet?
If you have acess to a lift or can get your car high enough check the condition of the fuel sending lines to and from the pump will need
a small inspection mirror. the one on my 93 brougham were rusted up bad. had the dealer replace the fuel pump/sending unit/float assembly.

Hope this helps some.

[96Fleetwood]

Welcome!

How many miles are on it?

Is it on the original plugs, wires, and optispark?

[N0DIH]

In every car I have ever had that did just as you describe, it was poor ignition (plugs, wires, cap/rotor). LT1's are known to be sorta hard on the ignition lead from the coil to the Opti.... "keep one in the glovebox" is what Scott Mueller used to say...

Tank also makes a good point which is why I feel the fuel pressure gauge is required in a EFI man's toolbox. Take that "issue" out....

You aren't running E85 now are you? E85 in an unmodified LT1 won't start cold well at all, IF at all. Modified PCM like I run, sure, easy and no problems.... I have probably close to 15K-20K on E85 now.....

PCM sensors. Bad or messed with IAT and CTS will do screwy things (like tell the PCM it is 80F out when it is 20F....). Datalogger is quick and easy test (they should read nearly the same at cold start, your mech should know this).

As for PASSKEY, look for the light staying on an unusual amount of time. If you suspect it, clean as he said, and try using the other key too. Passkey, aka VATS, can be disabled in the PCM tune if you really have issues with it. But clean the keys, run a q-tip with alky on it in the keyhole where the PASSKEY resistor is on the key. In all honesty it doesn't start like a PASSKEY problem, they just don't start.....

[Fat96]

Thanks for your input. To answer questions; 112,000 miles... No ethanol... Wires, plugs, etc. replaced in the last year. I think that was it. My instinct says fuel filter or line, too.

I'll have to bring it back to the mech. I'll update after.

Thanks all.

Kevin

[BEASTcadi]

My 97 Deville (96,000 mi) does the same thing.

I recently replaced the fuel filter and got a new battery. Same problem.

Any updates on what the mechanic said?

[tenmark]

It could be your fuel.

Many stations are selling E10 as regular fuel. And while E10 can be hard on engines not built to run E85 or ethanol fuel. The real problem is that many stations are watering down their fuel with ethanol and selling E10 with higher ethanol concentrations. Like the house watering down an alcoholic drink for profit. And while E10 is only marginally acceptable E10 with with higher concentrations of ethanol like 12% or 13% causes problems and damage.

http://www.wesh.com/automotive/16200238/detail.html

[N0DIH]

If you drive a lot, no amount of Ethanol will hurt, but letting it sit, that can become problematic. It is the water in the ethanol that is the real issue, not so much the alky itself, as most fuel systems from the mid 90's up are make of most elements that aren't affected by Alky. Talked to our resident N* tuner and he said that there was a rash of problems when 10% alky became politically mandated (don't you love politicians screwing around with things they know nothing about??) and it caused untold millions of $$ in car repairs due to bad fuel pressure regulators and rust in the fuel lines plugging up fuel injectors and fuel filters. But now that we have been running it for a long time, it is much less of an issue, we have all paid the price somewhere.... water contaminated alky is bad news for sure, but isn't real common, and if it is, will be widespread problems in the area.

My 99 K2500 454 Suburban (that's 7.4L for you metric heads, affectionately known as the "guzzler") was getting crabby to start in the day and I found it to be RUST on the plug wire in the boot and the top of the plug. I have never seen. My "new" 00 Buick Park Ave Ultra had the same thing ony at the coils. I had to replace 2 coils and the wires to fix. Cleaning didn't cut it, I tried.

Oh, the plugs on the Burb were 6 months old and Autolite platinums. I am done with platinums. NGK TR5's for me... Nothing else. I am back to real plugs not the platinum junk.... It helps keep hot spots out of the chamber so pinging (even inaudible, but enough the PCM hears it) is eliminated and overall power is improved.

[jey]

Interesting. I wonder if I should fire up the Cadillac and drive it around more often. I sometimes go a whole month without starting it up.

[tenmark]

I've got a slow drain, so if mine sits for a week or so, I have to charge up the battery. It's not a problem if I drive it everyday it's just been sitting lately because I'm waiting on my wood wheel.

[N0DIH]

I check for drains by putting my DVM in current mode in series with the battery cables and then start pulling fuses one by one till it stops, then dig deeper.... Start with the Maxi fuses under the hood, that gives a great pointer to the rest of the car where to look.

Just be careful you don't blow the meter by opening the doors and the dome lights come on and draw too much current, some meters will be damaged or blow fuses in the meter.

[racinrod67]

Originally Posted by Fat96

Thanks for your input. To answer questions; 112,000 miles... No ethanol... Wires, plugs, etc. replaced in the last year. I think that was it. My instinct says fuel filter or line, too.

I'll have to bring it back to the mech. I'll update after.

Thanks all.

Kevin

What did you ever find out about your problem? Did you get it fixed? I am curious because I am experiencing the same problem with my 96 N*

[DopeStar 156]

Originally Posted by tenmark

It could be your fuel.

Many stations are selling E10 as regular fuel. And while E10 can be hard on engines not built to run E85 or ethanol fuel. The real problem is that many stations are watering down their fuel with ethanol and selling E10 with higher ethanol concentrations. Like the house watering down an alcoholic drink for profit. And while E10 is only marginally acceptable E10 with with higher concentrations of ethanol like 12% or 13% causes problems and damage.

http://www.wesh.com/automotive/16200238/detail.html

Hmmmmmmm..... This got me thinking about my problem.....