GM coolant additive???

[supernan1414]

I have been reading the posts over the past month and want more info about the GM aditive or pellets some here have mentioned nessessary. At 100,000 miles had radiator flush at the dealer I bought the car from and on the bill it says Dexcool Kit and also MOA Additive. At approx 200,000 2 heater hoses were cracked, while I was driving check coolant level came on stopped the car had it towed to the nearest dealer they replaced them and added 3.75 gallons of coolant. There is no mention of a additive on this bill. The next month the water pump went and they added 1.5 coolant, no mention of additive finally a couple months later the radiator developed a crack and that was repaced no mention of adding any coolant on that bill. The water pump and radiator were done at local shops. Should I take it to a dealer and ask them to add this additive or is it something I can buy and put in the tank???? I now have 212,000 on this car ????

[Night Wolf]

ah gosh... when you went to the mom and pop shop, are you sure they used Dexcool... the orange stuff?

if they used the old green stuff, then your engine is slowly eating itself from the inside out....

The tabblets are nothing more then crushed ginger, they are the same thing as BARRS leak stop-leak and conditioner, the kind you get in the tubes, its a powder. It is NEEDED for the Northstar and if it wasn't put in, then I would do it ASAP, you don't need to go to the dealer for that as it isn't hard to open the radiator cap and pour the powder into it.

[Ranger]

You can buy the tabs at any GM dealer or go to Walmart or such, and buy Barleaks product "HDC" (tabs) or "G12BP" (powdered version). DO NOT put them in the surge tank. They need to go into a high flow area (radiator hose). If put in the tank, they may clog it as it is a low flow area. They are mandatory on the 4.1 4.5 & 4.9 because a failed head gasket can leak into the oil. The Northstar is designed such that that will not happen as we have been told by a GM engineer. Use of them in the Northstar is just a precaution against porous castings or nuisance gasket leaks. It's a good idea to have them but, don't loose any sleep over it.

[Ranger]

Originally Posted by Night Wolf

ah gosh... when you went to the mom and pop shop, are you sure they used Dexcool... the orange stuff?

if they used the old green stuff, then your engine is slowly eating itself from the inside out....

Please don't start myths like this. People read this stuff on the internet and take it as gospel. Nothing could be farther from the truth. Green coolant will work as well as Dex. The only difference is that if it is used, you are relegated to 2 year/30K coolant changes instead of 5yr/100K.

Besides, he specifically said he went to the dealer and specifically mentioned Dex-Cool.

[Night Wolf]

Originally Posted by Ranger

Please don't start myths like this. People read this stuff on the internet and take it as gospel. Nothing could be farther from the truth. Green coolant will work as well as Dex. The only difference is that if it is used, you are relegated to 2 year/30K coolant changes instead of 5yr/100K.

Besides, he specifically said he went to the dealer and specifically mentioned Dex-Cool.

myths!?

First, he said he got the w/p done at a local shop as well anti-freeze put in.

I am going to leave my personal thoughs on Dexcool out of this (as I did in the first reply)......

but notice what I said? MIXING Dexcool and normal green stuff.

Meaning, the car origanaly had Dexcool, the dealer put Dexcool in it, if the local shop put the regular stuff in when it was really low and failed to completly flush the system, then that means that Dexcool *MIXED* with the green stuff.

If you don't know what can happen when Dexcool gets mixed with the tradional green stuff, then call any local GM dealer and ask them.

Please, I know what i am talking about, there is no need to make it look like I am going around telling lies, I think everyone here knew me a little better then that.

[Night Wolf]

BTW the last 2 coolant changed I did on my '93 Coupe... the first time using the GM tablets and the 2nd time using Barrs leak powder, I poped the radiator cap and put them in. Over a year and lots of miles later, no clogs. When we first got the tabllets at the GM dealer, I asked if I can put them right in the raditor, the tech said its fine, when it hits water it disolves.

The coolant supplement is required on the Northstar also. It is filled with it when it leaves the assembly line and there is a sticker under the hood as well as being listed in the service manual. Not to mention the dealer even put it in when you took or for a cooalnt change.

It is more then just a "precaution" GM woudln't waste what turns out to be millions of dollars on something (putting this stuff in from the factory) as just a "precaution" It is required.

*BTW if I got a car with Dexcool, and the Dexcool stayed in it (it wouldn't.... but if it did) I would NOT wait 5yrs/100k miles to change it... it would be about half that MAX.

[Ranger]

Sorry, I missed "local shop" on the last line.
Better reread your post. The word "MIXED" was never used. You said "if they used the old green stuff, then your engine is slowly eating itself from the inside out....". Even if you meant mixed, and it was, the engine is not going to self destruct.

Note paragraph 4 in the link below.
http://www.theherd.com/articles/dex_cool.html

[Night Wolf]

it requires a little thought here, but makes perfect sense.... this is what he said:

The next month the water pump went and they added 1.5 coolant, no mention of additive finally a couple months later the radiator developed a crack and that was repaced no mention of adding any coolant on that bill. The water pump and radiator were done at local shops.

So some shop besides the dealer replaced the water pump and the radiator. Nothing wrong with that.

He said they added 1.5 gallons+ of coolant. Nothing wrong with that either.

*both of these were done at the local shop*

This is what I said:

ah gosh... when you went to the mom and pop shop, are you sure they used Dexcool... the orange stuff?

if they used the old green stuff, then your engine is slowly eating itself from the inside out....

*THEY* impling the local shop that did the w/p and rad, and filled it with coolant.

It is very possible they used Dexcool, then there is nothing to worry about... but *IF* they used the green stuff, then that means it *MIXED* It is implied. If you add only 1.5 gallons of coolant, then there is still some left in the engine, not to mention even if ALL the Dexcool drained out from a faulty w/p it is still a danger to use the green stuff, the Dexcool needs to be throughly flushed and completly cleaned out of the system, simply draining all the Dexcool (or it leaking out some how) then filling it with the green stuff (which the shop MAY have done) is no good.

Weather you like Dexcool or not, they should never be mixed. I simply said that because *IF* it was mixed, to take the car ASAP and get the coolant flushed and refilled with Dexcool or whatever, but don't leave a mix of the green stuff and Dexcool in the engine.

But yeah, the engine will kill itself within time if the 2 were mixed. Obvisouly it isn't going to literally blow up at a random time, but with the 2 mixed it will start eating all the gaskets as well as form some really nice and grungy sludge all over the internals of the cooling system, causing blockage of coolant passages, clogged radiator, failed water pump and many other things that will, within time ruin the engine, which is why I said:

if they used the old green stuff, then your engine is slowly eating itself from the inside out....

[Night Wolf]

Originally Posted by Ranger

Sorry, I missed "local shop" on the last line.
Better reread your post. The word "MIXED" was never used. You said "if they used the old green stuff, then your engine is slowly eating itself from the inside out....". Even if you meant mixed, and it was, the engine is not going to self destruct.

Note paragraph 4 in the link below.
http://www.theherd.com/articles/dex_cool.html

Sorry, but I'll take what GM says themself (not to mix the 2) then some random site on the internet...

funny how things work out, on another car forum I am a regular on, we got into the same exact Dexcool debate.....

but even the Dexcool supporters said it is a bad idea to mix the 2.

It comes down to it being your engine. If you think its fine and wont do anything leave it. Otherwise flush it out. (If the 2 were mixed)

looking at the bigger picture with Dexcool vs the green stuff... again, whatever you personally feel, do it. I am happy to say that none of my 3 cars ever even saw that Dexcool stuff, and they never will, and if I buy any 1996+ GM in the future (which I will be) one of the first things I will be doing is throughly flushing out the cooling system and using the green stuff, changing coolant every ~25k miles as I do now.

[Ranger]

Originally Posted by Night Wolf

BTW the last 2 coolant changed I did on my '93 Coupe... the first time using the GM tablets and the 2nd time using Barrs leak powder, I poped the radiator cap and put them in. Over a year and lots of miles later, no clogs. When we first got the tabllets at the GM dealer, I asked if I can put them right in the raditor, the tech said its fine, when it hits water it disolves.

The coolant supplement is required on the Northstar also. It is filled with it when it leaves the assembly line and there is a sticker under the hood as well as being listed in the service manual. Not to mention the dealer even put it in when you took or for a cooalnt change.

It is more then just a "precaution" GM woudln't waste what turns out to be millions of dollars on something (putting this stuff in from the factory) as just a "precaution" It is required.

*BTW if I got a car with Dexcool, and the Dexcool stayed in it (it wouldn't.... but if it did) I would NOT wait 5yrs/100k miles to change it... it would be about half that MAX.

'93 Coupe? 4.9 right? Yes that had a radiator cap (high flow area). That is where they go. The Northstar does not have a radiator cap. That is why they go in the radiator hose.

Reguarding the "precaution". If you read "The Masters" posts, you would realize that I am quoting him.

Nothing wrong with changing Dex sooner than 5 years. Just qouting what GM says.

[Ranger]

BTW, I never said it was a good idea to mix them, just that the engine will not "eat itself from inside out". I would not mix them, nor would I ever recommend it.

[turbojimmy]

All Dexcool debate aside, it's nice to see a 212k mile Northstar. I think I'll have mine for a long time.

Jim

[Ranger]

Originally Posted by Night Wolf

Weather you like Dexcool or not, they should never be mixed.

But yeah, the engine will kill itself within time if the 2 were mixed. Obvisouly it isn't going to literally blow up at a random time, but with the 2 mixed it will start eating all the gaskets as well as form some really nice and grungy sludge all over the internals of the cooling system, causing blockage of coolant passages, clogged radiator, failed water pump and many other things that will, within time ruin the engine, which is why I said:

The following link is what GM and Texaco say about it. Note number 7.

Again, I do not condone nor recommend mixing but, the engine will not "eat itself from the inside out".
http://www.imcool.com/articles/antif...l-macs2001.htm

I rest my case.

[supernan1414]

I feel confident that Dex-cool was used when the water pump was changed. It was done at a NAPA Auto Care Center, two bay, owner operated shop. They were very knowlegable and believe they know not to mix the two differant coolants. ( We were at our campground when this happened) When the radiator was changed, no mention off coolant on the bill, my husband says they must have filled the radiator with dex-cool but I think they often keep what comes out of it and put it back in. Really don't know for sure, this was done at the shop we normally use, buy tires, oil changes, they surely should know not to put the wrong coolant in. Every time they do a oil change they check my coolant levels.

If we pick some of this addditive up and put in the recemmended amount if there is some already in will it hurt the engine. When the heater hose leaked and they put in 3.75 coolant in you would think they would have put the required amount of this additive, but no mention of it on the bill. This was at a Cadillac dealer.
Drove this car 300 miles today and is still a joy.

[Night Wolf]

Keep in mind of course, this was AFTER GM changed the Dexcool formula to help reduce the effects of it, but not get rid of the problem.

200k on a Northstar isn't a rare case... oil and coolant changes and it'll go for alot longer