PCM P 0410 Secondary Air Injection System Malfunction
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Northstar Engines and System Technical Discussion Discussion, PCM P 0410 Secondary Air Injection System Malfunction in Cadillac Engine Technical Discussion; I figured the title of the original thread was misleading so 01 DTS 40k Ok so today I'm driving as ...
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    codewize's Avatar
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    PCM P 0410 Secondary Air Injection System Malfunction

    I figured the title of the original thread was misleading so

    01 DTS 40k

    Ok so today I'm driving as I usually do when the SES light comes on. I get to my destination and pull the codes.

    I see
    PCM P0410 Secondary Air Injection System Malfunction
    What the heck does that mean?

    I also see an SDM code U1064 History

    I think I understand the function of the system but the code keeps coming back so I'd like to know what the components of this system are that can fail?
    Ownership:
    91 Brougham d'Elegance 350
    02 Deville DTS
    01 Deville DTS:
    Custom installed Volant CAI
    Custom PCM
    Body color engine components
    Cruiser Alloy wheels
    EBC brakes and rotors
    Eibach springs
    Corsa exhaust
    Sportwing Spoiler
    Semi-custom interior
    Custom quad Hi-Beams
    Future Plans: More interior work.


    Memberships:
    National and regional Cadillac & LaSalle Club
    Proud Volunteer - Northstar Tuning Project
    Guinness World Records - Largest Cadillac Parade

    ----------------------------

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    ewill3rd is offline Cadillac Technician
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    Re: PCM P0410 Secondary Air Injection System Malfunction

    Code,

    Start up your car cold, if you don't hear a sound like a vacuum cleaner running under your car you probably need a new air pump.
    First, check the maxi-fuse in the underhood fuse block for the AIR pump.
    If it's blown then you need to get under the car on the driver's side.
    Remove the front cover and look at the bottom cover on the air pump, if it's dislodged and full of water the pump probably sucked up some water and committed suicide. There is a bulletin out to replace the air pump and the intake duct with a redesigned part that is not so suceptible to water intrusion. Also it's possible that the connector is burnt up, I have seen some with new air pumps set codes because of a fried electrical connection.

    Subject: Service Engine Soon (SES)/Check Engine Light MIL Illuminated, Secondary Air Injection Reaction (AIR) Pump Ingesting Water, DTC P0410 Set (Replace Secondary Air Pump/Inlet Hose Assembly or Filter Kit) #02-06-04-024G - (06/05/2006)



    Models: 2000-2003 Cadillac DeVille

    2001-2002 Cadillac Eldorado

    2001-2004 Cadillac SLS, STS

    2001-2003 Oldsmobile Aurora

    with 3.5L V6, 4.0L or 4.6L V8 Engine (VINs H, C, Y, 9 -- RPOs LX5, L47, LD8, L37)




    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    This bulletin is being revised to update the model year for Cadillac DeVille, parts usage information and enhance the bulletin content. Please discard Corporate Bulletin Number 02-06-04-024F (Section 6 - Engine).


    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Condition
    Some customers may comment on the "Service Engine Soon" (U.S.) or "Check Engine Soon" (Canada) malfunction indicator lamp (MIL) being illuminated.

    Technicians may find these additional conditions:

    • DTC P0410 set.

    • Evidence of water in the Secondary Air Injection Reaction (AIR) Pump.

    • Secondary AIR Pump shorted out/inoperative.

    Cause
    This condition may be due to water being ingested at the secondary air injection reaction (AIR) pump inlet hose, causing the pump to short out or seize up.

    Diagnostic Information
    DTC P0410
    Refer to SI for diagnostic information on DTC P0410.

    If the diagnostic information above indicates a faulty AIR pump, follow the correction procedure below.

    Notice: After the service procedure in this bulletin was been completed, the Secondary Air Injection Shut-Off valve(s) must be checked. A stuck valve (from carbon) can cause exhaust condensation to collect in the air pump causing a repeat non-function AIR pump.

    Correction
    Aurora and DeVille
    Notice: A new Secondary AIR pump and Inlet hose assembly (kit), P/N 19515548 , is now available and must be installed if the AIR pump is replaced. Non-replacement and re-routing of the AIR pump inlet hose when servicing the AIR pump may result in a repeat non-function AIR pump from water ingestion.

    Turn the wheels to the left.
    Open the hood and install fender covers
    On DeVille models, remove the upper filler panel. Refer to SI for information on the removal of the upper filler panel.
    Remove the left headlamp assembly. Refer Headlamp Replacement in SI.
    Remove the exiting AIR inlet hose retainer located between the inner and the outer fender.
    Remove the secondary AIR pump. Refer to Secondary Air Injection (AIR) Pump Replacement in SI.
    Remove the AIR pump inlet hose from the vehicle.
    Install the new Secondary AIR Pump and Inlet Hose Assembly (Kit), P/N 19515548. Refer to Secondary AIR Injection (AIR) Pump Replacement and Secondary Air Injection Pump Outlet Pipe/Hose Replacement in SI.
    Remove the left front inner fender splash shield retainers.
    Reposition the splash shield to allow access for the new hose assembly installation.
    Important: Install the new Secondary Air Injection Pump Outlet Pipe/Hose Assembly to the new Air Pump before installing to the vehicle. This will allow the housing on the hose/pipe assembly to fasten to the pump without damage to one of the holding fasteners.

    Important: Located on the inner fender behind the air box there is a oval stamped hole. The new AIR filter must snap into this hole in order for the AIR pump to avoid ingesting water. Removal of the Air Cleaner Assembly may be necessary.





    Route the new AIR pump inlet hose between the left inner and out fenders as shown above.



    Notice: Secure the new AIR pump inlet hose and filter into the opening on the inner fender as shown above. If the filter is not properly secure to the inner fender repeat Non-Function Air pump may occur from ingesting water.

    Snap the filter into the inner fender opening as shown above.
    Reposition the inner fender splash shield into position.
    Install the inner fender splash shield retainers.
    Lower the vehicle
    Install the left headlamp assembly. Refer to Headlamp Replacement in SI.
    On DeVille models, install the upper filler panel. Refer to SI for installation procedures for the upper filler panel.
    Check the operation of the Shut-Off Valve(s). Refer to SI for Secondary Air Injection description and operation of Shut-Off Valve(s) or refer to DTC P0410 for diagnostic testing of vacuum system, hoses, vacuum solenoid and shut-off valves.
    Remove the fender covers and close the hood.
    With a scan tool clear the DTCs and road test the vehicle.
    SLS/STS
    Notice: A new Secondary AIR Pump and Inlet Hose Assembly (Kit), P/N 19515548 (2001-2003 SLS/STS) and 19515549 (2004 SLS or STS only), is now available and must be installed if the AIR pump is replaced. Non replacement and rerouting of the AIR pump Inlet hose when servicing the AIR pump may result in a repeat Non-Function AIR pump from ingesting water.

    Open the hood and install fender covers
    Remove the upper filler panel. Refer to Filler Panel Replacement - Upper in Body Front End in SI.
    Remove the left headlamp assembly. Refer to Headlamp Replacement in SI.
    Remove the AIR hose retainer.
    Remove the secondary air injection (AIR) pump. Refer to Secondary Air Injection (AIR) Pump Replacement in SI.
    Remove the AIR hose assembly.



    Important: Install the new Secondary Air Injection Pump Outlet Pipe/Hose Assembly to the new AIR pump before installing to the vehicle. This will allow the housing on the hose/pipe assembly to fasten to the pump without damage to one of the holding fasteners.

    A new Secondary AIR Pump and Inlet Hose Assembly (kit), P/N 19515548 (2001-2003 Seville) or P/N 19515549 (2004 Seville only), behind the headlamp mounting bracket as shown above.
    Lower the vehicle



    Notice: It is critical that the new AIR inlet hose filter opening is facing downward when installed on the vehicle. If improperly installed Non-Function AIR pump may occur due to ingesting water into the pump.

    Secure the new AIR hose filter with a plastic tie strap to the upper radiator support with the filter opening facing downward as shown above.
    Install the headlamp assembly. Refer to SI Headlamp Replacement in SI.
    Install the upper filler panel. Refer to Filler Panel Replacement - Upper in Body Front End in SI.
    Check the operation of the Shut-Off Valve(s). Refer to SI for Secondary Air Injection description and operation of Shut-Off Valve(s) or refer to DTC P0410 for diagnostic testing of vacuum system, hoses, vacuum solenoid and shut-off valves.
    Use a scan tool clear the DTCs and road test the vehicle.
    Eldorado
    Notice: A new Secondary AIR Pump, P/N 25770944, and Inlet AIR Pump Filter Kit, P/N 15783306, are now available and must be installed if the AIR pump is replaced. Non-replacement and re-routing of the AIR pump Inlet hose and filter when servicing the AIR pump may result in a repeat non-function AIR pump from water ingestion.

    Open the hood and install fender covers.
    Raise the vehicle. Refer to Lifting and Jacking the Vehicle in SI.
    Install a new AIR pump, P/N 25770944. Refer to Secondary Air Injection (AIR) Pump Replacement in SI.
    Lower the vehicle.
    Remove the left headlamp assembly. Refer to Headlamp Capsule Replacement in SI.
    Remove the push-on retainer from the AIR hose.
    Remove the exiting AIR filter from the hose.
    Measure and mark 20 cm (8 in) back from the AIR hose end.
    Cut the AIR hose at the mark made in the above step. DO NOT discard the cut off piece of hose.
    Install one clamp from kit, P/N 15783306, onto the AIR hose.
    Install the connector from kit, P/N 15783306, into the air hose.
    Install the cut off piece of the AIR hose onto the other end of the connector.
    Install the other two clamps onto the open end of the cut off piece of the AIR hose.
    Notice: It is critical that the new AIR inlet hose filter opening is facing rearward when installed on the vehicle. If improperly installed, a non-function of the AIR pump may occur due to water ingestion into the pump.

    Install the new AIR hose filter from kit, P/N 15783306.
    Crimp all three clamps.
    Plastic strap the AIR hose to the headlamp mounting bracket.
    Reinstall the left headlamp and closeout panel. Refer to Headlamp Capsule Replacement in SI.
    Check the operation of the Shut-Off Valve(s). Refer to SI for Secondary Air Injection description and operation of Shut-Off Valve(s) or refer to DTC P0410 for diagnostic testing of vacuum system, hoses, vacuum solenoid and shut-off valves.
    Use a scan tool clear the DTCs and road test the vehicle.
    Parts Information
    Part Number
    Description

    25770944
    Pump Asm - Secondary AIR (Eldorado Only)

    19515548
    Pump AIR and Hose Asm - Secondary AIR Pump (Inlet) (Aurora, DeVille and SLS or STS)

    19515549
    Pump AIR and Hose Asm - Secondary AIR Pump (Inlet) KIT (2004 SLS/STS only)

    15783306
    AIR Pump Inlet Filter - Kit (Eldorado Only)

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    ewill3rd is offline Cadillac Technician
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    Re: PCM P0410 Secondary Air Injection System Malfunction

    Oh and if you do hear the air pump running (vacuum cleaner sound) then check the vacuum hoses going to the check valves, one of them might be off.

  5. #4
    codewize's Avatar
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    Re: PCM P0410 Secondary Air Injection System Malfunction

    Thanks for the great info

    Crap. You know I saw water dripping from there the other day but ignored it. I'll bet it's the pump. I did have the beauty cover off the day before this all started but I don't think I touched anything to do with that. I'll check.

    What the air pump going to cost me? Any idea?

    EDIT. I was just looking on ALLData and I see this thing is on the drivers side. I saw the water dripping from the passenger side so maybe it's not the pump. Well given the TSB maybe it is.

    I would say the fuse is not blown because I can drive for a day maybe 2 before the code comes back. I would suspect without the pump running the code would come back right away.
    Ownership:
    91 Brougham d'Elegance 350
    02 Deville DTS
    01 Deville DTS:
    Custom installed Volant CAI
    Custom PCM
    Body color engine components
    Cruiser Alloy wheels
    EBC brakes and rotors
    Eibach springs
    Corsa exhaust
    Sportwing Spoiler
    Semi-custom interior
    Custom quad Hi-Beams
    Future Plans: More interior work.


    Memberships:
    National and regional Cadillac & LaSalle Club
    Proud Volunteer - Northstar Tuning Project
    Guinness World Records - Largest Cadillac Parade

    ----------------------------

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    ewill3rd is offline Cadillac Technician
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    Re: PCM P0410 Secondary Air Injection System Malfunction

    Sometimes the enable criteria for the code to come back are not met in a drive cycle.
    Not all diagnostics run every time you drive, sometimes they don't run for weeks depending on how you drive.
    The AIR pump is turned on right after a cold start for about 30 seconds to a minute. If you don't hear that hoover sound then it's not coming on.

    The pump is mounted under the left side right behind the bumper cover and it's accessed from underneath. Not sure about the price of the parts.
    We have seen quite a few of those. It's the most common cause of a P0410 mainly because that code is for the whole system. There are codes for each bank of the AIR system but those check valves have seemed pretty reliable so far. If anyone has been working on it recently they might have left a vacuum line off, that can cause the code because the check valves won't open so the O2 sensors won't see the air pump run.
    So, no the code might not come back right away depending on how you drive it.

    Not sure about the price of the kit.

  7. #6
    turbojimmy's Avatar
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    Re: PCM P0410 Secondary Air Injection System Malfunction

    Like ewill3rd says, it's probably the air pump. Mine was bad when I got my car, but it was also under water. I used a replacement from a salvage yard and it's been fine for the past couple of years.

    Jim

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    codewize's Avatar
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    Re: PCM P0410 Secondary Air Injection System Malfunction

    Damn it. Well OK I'll have it checked out. I drive about 50 miles a day, when I drive.

    I don't ever remember hearing a hoover sound under the car. I've bee driving this thing for almost a year now. Maybe I just never paid attention?

    It look like the pump kit lists for around $200 and can be had for about half that. ALLData says .9 hrs labor flat rate. This is easily a $200 repair if I can't do it myself.

    Anyone know how difficult it is to get to / change?
    Ownership:
    91 Brougham d'Elegance 350
    02 Deville DTS
    01 Deville DTS:
    Custom installed Volant CAI
    Custom PCM
    Body color engine components
    Cruiser Alloy wheels
    EBC brakes and rotors
    Eibach springs
    Corsa exhaust
    Sportwing Spoiler
    Semi-custom interior
    Custom quad Hi-Beams
    Future Plans: More interior work.


    Memberships:
    National and regional Cadillac & LaSalle Club
    Proud Volunteer - Northstar Tuning Project
    Guinness World Records - Largest Cadillac Parade

    ----------------------------

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    ewill3rd is offline Cadillac Technician
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    Re: PCM P0410 Secondary Air Injection System Malfunction

    It's very easy to do yourself if you can get under the front of the car.
    The only real trick is putting in the redesigned air intake for the pump, snapping the cover on the pump so it doesn't suck up water and making sure the connector is not burnt up.

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    Re: PCM P0410 Secondary Air Injection System Malfunction

    Can't say as I have ever heard any vacuum cleaner sounds either. I'll have to pay closer attention.

    Bill,
    Briefly, how does this system work? Pumps cool air into the manifolds or pre CAT somewhere? I suspect manifolds as I see two valves. On all the time?

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    Re: PCM P0410 Secondary Air Injection System Malfunction

    AIR systems are a carryover from the 80's, thankfully now they are electric motors instead of belt driven pumps.

    Basically here is what is going on. When an engine is cold the fuel air mixture must be richer in order to burn. The main purpose of the t-stat and other systems is to get the engine to an operating temperature where fuel can be efficiently controlled. That is not the case on a cold engine.
    Richer fuel mixtures means more hydrocarbons per oxygen molecule passing into the combustion chamber. More HC and less O2 means they can't combine properly in the cylinder during combustion so you have flaming hot gasses coming out of the cylinder with excessive HC molecules. The AIR system simply gives that volatile mixture some O2 in order to burn off the extra HC. All the necessary things are already there except the oxygen.
    Once the engine and combustion temps come up the AIR system is no longer needed because closed loop fuel control and O2 sensors start doing there thing so the AIR pump is shut off.
    The check valves are just that, they keep the exhaust gasses from getting back into the pump and burning it up.
    The old mechanical pumps and vacuum switched systems really sucked.
    The only problem with some of the electric systems is they usually put them in places where they can suck water up from the roadway.
    Water and electric air pumps are not a good mixture.

    You can tell if your car has AIR by looking accross the top of the emissions decal. It will say things like HO2S, TWC, EGR, AIR (or SAI) and some others.
    That identifies critical emissions control components.
    If your late model Deville, Seville has AIR, you'll usually hear that vacuum cleaner sound on cold start ups but you might not notice it otherwise.

    Man I don't feel so good... I gotta run.
    Talk to you guys tomorrow.
    Let me know if you need more info.

    Only two nuts hold that air pump on, you need to partially remove the inner fender to install the new air pipe that connects to the air box.

  12. #11
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    Re: PCM P0410 Secondary Air Injection System Malfunction

    In addition to ewill's description, another reason the Secondary Air Injection system is to quickly bring the catalyst up to operating temperature. The cat is not very efficient until its hot, so getting it hot quicker will help reduce tail pipe emissions, especially with a cold engine that is running richer than a warmed up engine and is polluting more than a warmed up engine.
    Frank

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    Re: PCM P0410 Secondary Air Injection System Malfunction

    Yeah, I remember those old AIR (smog) pumps from the 70's, but I thought they went away after some time. Can't recall one on my '92 or '97 Deville, my daughters previous '99 SLS or my wifes '96 Bonneville. Thanks for the clarification.

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    Re: PCM P0410 Secondary Air Injection System Malfunction

    Oh! That is the whining sound I hear in our SLS! Sounds just like a vacuum too!

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    codewize's Avatar
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    Re: PCM P0410 Secondary Air Injection System Malfunction

    DP I was just going to post that. I started my car this morning and heard the sound we've been discussing in the other thread.
    http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums...out-noise.html


    It's most noticeable by sticking my head in front of the left front tire. Then the noise appears to be coming from just inside the inner fender. Exactly where the pump is located.

    So I guess the pump is working.

    Now what to look for.
    Ownership:
    91 Brougham d'Elegance 350
    02 Deville DTS
    01 Deville DTS:
    Custom installed Volant CAI
    Custom PCM
    Body color engine components
    Cruiser Alloy wheels
    EBC brakes and rotors
    Eibach springs
    Corsa exhaust
    Sportwing Spoiler
    Semi-custom interior
    Custom quad Hi-Beams
    Future Plans: More interior work.


    Memberships:
    National and regional Cadillac & LaSalle Club
    Proud Volunteer - Northstar Tuning Project
    Guinness World Records - Largest Cadillac Parade

    ----------------------------

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    ewill3rd is offline Cadillac Technician
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    Re: PCM P0410 Secondary Air Injection System Malfunction

    Code, has any one been working on the water pump lately?

    Usually there is a big check valve mounted over the water pump cover and another on the rear cam cover. Under the engine cover in the back center of the top of the engine there is a solenoid with a vacuum line that splits and goes to both check valves. If that hose is disconnected on either end or broken, or if the solenoid is disconnected it will set a P0410.

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