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Northstar Engines and System Technical Discussion Discussion, STS 13:63, you ask how? in Cadillac Engine Technical Discussion; I am new to the board and have had a couple emails already asking questions on what I did to ...
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    Ultra Slow is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    STS 13:63, you ask how?

    I am new to the board and have had a couple emails already asking questions on what I did to my STS. Also thanks for the welcomes too! How did I make my car run like this? Well if you notice in the pictures it has a spoiler on it, thats the trick ... No wait, this is not a ricer forum scratch that.... Seriously this is what I did to the car over the years. I bought it in 98 because I just had to have one and searched long and hard for a z-rated car. I found this one I have, black/black and bought it from an individual at almost a year old. I learned my lesson on this STS as I have owned over 100 cars and the STS was the only car that inticed me to buy in less than a year old. Says alot for the car but I lost some serious cash on this STS as the car is essentially valueless now compared to what it costs. It is simply the biggest financial mistake I have made on any car. Since I got hurt so bad and was so proud of the car and loved it, I did want any car collector would do... I put it up. I have driven a total of about 12,000 miles since. It sits in my collection as a lesson of what never to do again as I had always bought and collected cars that the depreciation was gone on. I did some nice mods on the car over time, 17x8 wheels 255/50 17 tires, had my exhaust guy build an increadible exhaust that seriously should be packaged for resale, but we all know the cadillac performace crowd ;( did the airbox, lost the MAF screen and the basics. Since I do run ZR1's I did take the car to the track with my mods. The car knocked off a 14:30 at 101. I attribute it mainly to the larger tires giving the car a bit of take off and a combo of the exhaust, etc. The car sat for about 6 months and I decided to try and do some other stuff to it. I hated the "float" the self adjusting shocks gave when the car was crusing down the road. I knew that the ECM controlled this and started making calls. I fould a guy that I knew that was a friend of a friend type deal that happend to be the serice MGR of a cad dealer. So for the first one only time in my life, I took a car up to the dealer to see if I could do anything with this. He really had no clue as exepected but he allowed me to talk to the guys at Delphi where they hooked these and diag'd from. After I complained about the "float" they guy said he could turn it up to the max. I also asked him what else could they do. I mentioned the "one lap of america" sts and he just so happen to have worked on that and I got in the door to some mods. The only thing they can do was to disable the traction control... As you guys know, your STS locks out first gear when you turn off the TC. He got this out of mine and raised the timing/ fuel curve a bit at my request that they had done to the one lap STS, of which I have no idea of the specs. They also did the shock reprogramming and I cant really tell much there. The main thing these mods allowed was to launch the car with the big tires and not having that TC kick in. The timing, of which I now have to mix a little 100 octane in to keep form hitting the knock sensor, took a bit of that "bog" out of the car on take off. The combo of these two things seemd to do the trick as I ran the car a 13:63. Now I will have to admit that the 13:63 was at a track that is known for being "fast" but the car does get in the high 13's at 104-105 pretty much every time now, being consistantly quicker than my BMW 850 V12 6 speed. Try and tell this story on a BMW forum. As far as the dyno, I could not tell you a before and after with this car as I only did it once with the car the way it is now. My friends 98 STS, of which I did have my guy mak it a Zrated when I had the contact, did a 252 absolutly stock on the same dyno if that is a reference. I figured I got about 30 HP more from all the BS but the traction and large tires is what helped more than anything else. Anyway, if you are in dallas and race or are just into cads, email me.... Love to get the 80 cad 500 out. Thats the fun car!




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  3. #2
    jonrodman is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Thumbs up Re: STS 13:63, you ask how?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ultra Slow
    I am new to the board and have had a couple emails already asking questions on what I did to my STS. Also thanks for the welcomes too! How did I make my car run like this? Well if you notice in the pictures it has a spoiler on it, thats the trick ... No wait, this is not a ricer forum scratch that.... Seriously this is what I did to the car over the years. I bought it in 98 because I just had to have one and searched long and hard for a z-rated car. I found this one I have, black/black and bought it from an individual at almost a year old. I learned my lesson on this STS as I have owned over 100 cars and the STS was the only car that inticed me to buy in less than a year old. Says alot for the car but I lost some serious cash on this STS as the car is essentially valueless now compared to what it costs. It is simply the biggest financial mistake I have made on any car. Since I got hurt so bad and was so proud of the car and loved it, I did want any car collector would do... I put it up. I have driven a total of about 12,000 miles since. It sits in my collection as a lesson of what never to do again as I had always bought and collected cars that the depreciation was gone on. I did some nice mods on the car over time, 17x8 wheels 255/50 17 tires, had my exhaust guy build an increadible exhaust that seriously should be packaged for resale, but we all know the cadillac performace crowd ;( did the airbox, lost the MAF screen and the basics. Since I do run ZR1's I did take the car to the track with my mods. The car knocked off a 14:30 at 101. I attribute it mainly to the larger tires giving the car a bit of take off and a combo of the exhaust, etc. The car sat for about 6 months and I decided to try and do some other stuff to it. I hated the "float" the self adjusting shocks gave when the car was crusing down the road. I knew that the ECM controlled this and started making calls. I fould a guy that I knew that was a friend of a friend type deal that happend to be the serice MGR of a cad dealer. So for the first one only time in my life, I took a car up to the dealer to see if I could do anything with this. He really had no clue as exepected but he allowed me to talk to the guys at Delphi where they hooked these and diag'd from. After I complained about the "float" they guy said he could turn it up to the max. I also asked him what else could they do. I mentioned the "one lap of america" sts and he just so happen to have worked on that and I got in the door to some mods. The only thing they can do was to disable the traction control... As you guys know, your STS locks out first gear when you turn off the TC. He got this out of mine and raised the timing/ fuel curve a bit at my request that they had done to the one lap STS, of which I have no idea of the specs. They also did the shock reprogramming and I cant really tell much there. The main thing these mods allowed was to launch the car with the big tires and not having that TC kick in. The timing, of which I now have to mix a little 100 octane in to keep form hitting the knock sensor, took a bit of that "bog" out of the car on take off. The combo of these two things seemd to do the trick as I ran the car a 13:63. Now I will have to admit that the 13:63 was at a track that is known for being "fast" but the car does get in the high 13's at 104-105 pretty much every time now, being consistantly quicker than my BMW 850 V12 6 speed. Try and tell this story on a BMW forum. As far as the dyno, I could not tell you a before and after with this car as I only did it once with the car the way it is now. My friends 98 STS, of which I did have my guy mak it a Zrated when I had the contact, did a 252 absolutly stock on the same dyno if that is a reference. I figured I got about 30 HP more from all the BS but the traction and large tires is what helped more than anything else. Anyway, if you are in dallas and race or are just into cads, email me.... Love to get the 80 cad 500 out. Thats the fun car!




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    Hi,
    Nice car, nice post. Are you familiar with any type of unit that can be used to reprogram the STS computer? I have a 96 STS which is "H" rated. I would love to "Z" rate it and maybe bump up the power even more. It appears to be all stock.

    I noticed a Trans-Am behind the Seville. I also have an 82 Trans-AM. The Trans-Am is in the middle of an overhaul.

    You have a fleet of really nice cars.
    Jon

  4. #3
    ShadowLvr400's Avatar
    ShadowLvr400 is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    You've reprogrammed the fuel mapping? You tell us how you managed that, you can have my soul man. Been trying to get my limiter removed, and tune my fuel out some for nearly 2 years. Trapped at 112 speedo with Z rated tires on the car.

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    Ultra Slow is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: STS 13:63, you ask how?

    Hi thanks!

    No, I have no clue what to use to reprogram the STS ECM. As I stated, I kind of ran into a deal where I had a guy at GM do it when I was trying to reprogram my self adjusting shock program. It had to be hooked up at the dealer and they did it remotely. I did have a few friends that got to take advantage of this too for their devilles and concourses, but unfortunatly that contact when away when the dealeship was closed about a year ago here in Dallas. If I had any control of the ECM, I probably could do more with the car, but I dont. If there were more people into performance STS's, I am sure a company like hypertech would make a programmer for the cars, but unfortunatly there are not and the companies do not see a profitable market for it. Keep calling and asking for it, we may get lucky one day! Hopfully the XLR will bring about more Northstar mods, but I doubt that either unless cadillac captures a different market. I am dealing with the same issues on my 96 LT1 Brougham. Even though the car is 99.9% a caprice, the damn computer is different and the programmers for the impala,caprice,roadmaster dont work on it. It has a top speed limiter like your H rated car but at 108MPH... Talk about hiting it fast! Its the worst thin in the world. ."PC" cars.

    Yes, that is an 83 Daytona TA. It was the pace car.. The actual one. Has about 15000 miles on it. It has a 406/ROD 6 speed dana 44 in it. Its always undergoing an overhaul... Its a chevy! but the fault is always on the aftermarket parts like "crane, edlebrock, dart, MSD, etc" the aftermarket world is terrible in the reliability issues. That TA is not a hobby.. Its a liftime commitment. I call it my "69 camaro" as it parallels a certain crowd I have run into over the years...you might know the type. Its a certain guy that comes up to you when you at a track, out racing in a fast car. This guy usually has no car and only has his Nike's to drive. He comes up and says.... " Nice car dude but my brothers, dogs, cousin's, uncle's wifes best friend has a 69 camaro in his garage and when he gets it running, he's going to come out here and kick all your arses"



    Quote Originally Posted by jonrodman
    Hi,
    Nice car, nice post. Are you familiar with any type of unit that can be used to reprogram the STS computer? I have a 96 STS which is "H" rated. I would love to "Z" rate it and maybe bump up the power even more. It appears to be all stock.

    I noticed a Trans-Am behind the Seville. I also have an 82 Trans-AM. The Trans-Am is in the middle of an overhaul.

    You have a fleet of really nice cars.
    Jon

  6. #5
    jonrodman is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: STS 13:63, you ask how?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ultra Slow
    Hi thanks!

    No, I have no clue what to use to reprogram the STS ECM. As I stated, I kind of ran into a deal where I had a guy at GM do it when I was trying to reprogram my self adjusting shock program. It had to be hooked up at the dealer and they did it remotely. I did have a few friends that got to take advantage of this too for their devilles and concourses, but unfortunatly that contact when away when the dealeship was closed about a year ago here in Dallas. If I had any control of the ECM, I probably could do more with the car, but I dont. If there were more people into performance STS's, I am sure a company like hypertech would make a programmer for the cars, but unfortunatly there are not and the companies do not see a profitable market for it. Keep calling and asking for it, we may get lucky one day! Hopfully the XLR will bring about more Northstar mods, but I doubt that either unless cadillac captures a different market. I am dealing with the same issues on my 96 LT1 Brougham. Even though the car is 99.9% a caprice, the damn computer is different and the programmers for the impala,caprice,roadmaster dont work on it. It has a top speed limiter like your H rated car but at 108MPH... Talk about hiting it fast! Its the worst thin in the world. ."PC" cars.

    Yes, that is an 83 Daytona TA. It was the pace car.. The actual one. Has about 15000 miles on it. It has a 406/ROD 6 speed dana 44 in it. Its always undergoing an overhaul... Its a chevy! but the fault is always on the aftermarket parts like "crane, edlebrock, dart, MSD, etc" the aftermarket world is terrible in the reliability issues. That TA is not a hobby.. Its a liftime commitment. I call it my "69 camaro" as it parallels a certain crowd I have run into over the years...you might know the type. Its a certain guy that comes up to you when you at a track, out racing in a fast car. This guy usually has no car and only has his Nike's to drive. He comes up and says.... " Nice car dude but my brothers, dogs, cousin's, uncle's wifes best friend has a 69 camaro in his garage and when he gets it running, he's going to come out here and kick all your arses"
    It is interesting you should mention the lifetime project. I had a 406 SB put together over seven years ago, and it is still sitting in the garage wrapped in the plastic it came from the machine shop in - right next to the Trans-AM. I had a 4 bolt 400 bored .30 over, and the 5.7" rods under the hyperutectic pistons with AFR 220 Aluminum heads and a solid lifter cam. I also have an 86 700-R4 Trans which has been upgraded to handle some additional abuse, but neither has made the voyage into the engine bay yet.

    What did you use for Headders on your T/A?

    Jon

  7. #6
    Katshot's Avatar
    Katshot is offline Cadillac Owners Master
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    Re: STS 13:63, you ask how?

    Congratulations on the 13.6! I must admit I'd love to hear some more details on how 30hp got you to a 13.6. That's pretty damn good.

  8. #7
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    That's quite a story.

    What track were you running at? Do you have timeslips?

    Those are pretty impressive times...

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    Ultra Slow is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: STS 13:63, you ask how?

    On that TA, it currently runs hooker SC shorties and the have the HPC coating on them. The car is running and was a 470RWHP until the #3 cyl has lost a bit of pump. It still runs pretty darn good, but its ready for its... I lose count...20-25th engine pull and the car is still under 15,000 miles.... Thats what i mean by lifetime commitment. Understand why I mess with cadillacs! They may not be quite as fast as a modded SBC in a vette or sloppy f body, but I have learned over the years that it is better to be pretty fast all the time than real fast once and blow it up.

    As far as time slips... Well, how many do you want to see. I have ones that get in the 11's at 130+ on my turbo callaway, 12's on my ZR1 and I have ones that get in the 17's on my Jeep Wagonner, tow vehicle that I break out when my trailered car comes up with problems, 80 miles away at a track. Got to race! Posting any time spils would be just like taking picutes of a supermodel and claiming they were my wife as those slips dont really designate what car they are for as its usually test and tune and they dont fill them in! I dont race an STS profesionally!

    Most of the times I have gone to Ennis or Hallsville and run on the test and tune days where you can literally git in 20+ runs in a short amount of time. Hallsville is the "fast" track and it seems that everyone that goes there is about 2-3 tenths and a miles or two faster than Ennis. The only problem I have is the times I got bitched out for leaving water on the track becasue I would leave my AC on until I staged.

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    STS4me is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: STS 13:63, you ask how?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ultra Slow
    On that TA, it currently runs hooker SC shorties and the have the HPC coating on them. The car is running and was a 470RWHP until the #3 cyl has lost a bit of pump. It still runs pretty darn good, but its ready for its... I lose count...20-25th engine pull and the car is still under 15,000 miles.... Thats what i mean by lifetime commitment. Understand why I mess with cadillacs! They may not be quite as fast as a modded SBC in a vette or sloppy f body, but I have learned over the years that it is better to be pretty fast all the time than real fast once and blow it up.

    As far as time slips... Well, how many do you want to see. I have ones that get in the 11's at 130+ on my turbo callaway, 12's on my ZR1 and I have ones that get in the 17's on my Jeep Wagonner, tow vehicle that I break out when my trailered car comes up with problems, 80 miles away at a track. Got to race! Posting any time spils would be just like taking picutes of a supermodel and claiming they were my wife as those slips dont really designate what car they are for as its usually test and tune and they dont fill them in! I dont race an STS profesionally!

    Most of the times I have gone to Ennis or Hallsville and run on the test and tune days where you can literally git in 20+ runs in a short amount of time. Hallsville is the "fast" track and it seems that everyone that goes there is about 2-3 tenths and a miles or two faster than Ennis. The only problem I have is the times I got bitched out for leaving water on the track becasue I would leave my AC on until I staged.

    I live in Dallas also and have some similar vehicles, 82 Cherokee Chief restored /2000 caddy sts/s002 Durango r/t 82 T/a recaro edition pace car/ 1974 454 corvette. etc. etc.... Where is your shop? I would lovet to bring one of my rides by to show off too!

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    The STS is cool... cough 500 cough.

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    buickman69 is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    About the computer, I have a friend who's a service tech @ a local chevy dealer.He's a true dragracer/gear head like myself and wants to see the Caddy RUN. He is going to call the tech line and try to reprogram the computer with there help. The trick is it has to be a dealer calling with the dealer code before they'll talk to ya. I'll let ya'll know what we come up with.

    I hope to be reprogrammed, cat gutted (or replaced with a high-flow), and spray ready soon for the heavy weight shoot out in GA in November. http://www.sshs3.com

    Anybody else wanna go. I'm hoping to be in the 13.99 & quicker bracket.

    Anyone?? Anyone??

  13. #12
    Ultra Slow is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: STS 13:63, you ask how?

    STS4me, I tried to email you my phone # but you have your email blocked. Email me yours or unblock your email. I am in carrollton.

    Matt

    Quote Originally Posted by STS4me
    I live in Dallas also and have some similar vehicles, 82 Cherokee Chief restored /2000 caddy sts/s002 Durango r/t 82 T/a recaro edition pace car/ 1974 454 corvette. etc. etc.... Where is your shop? I would lovet to bring one of my rides by to show off too!

  14. #13
    epanightmare is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: STS 13:63, you ask how?

    [QUOTE=buickman69]About the computer, I have a friend who's a service tech @ a local chevy dealer.He's a true dragracer/gear head like myself and wants to see the Caddy RUN. He is going to call the tech line and try to reprogram the computer with there help. The trick is it has to be a dealer calling with the dealer code before they'll talk to ya. I'll let ya'll know what we come up with.

    I like to know if what you found out. I have a vetronics 5100 mastertech scaner with a GM SPS programing card so can flash most gm pcm's. so far only with stock or factory updated calibrations. so let me know if ther are programs that i can use to remove the speed limiter. also the control for the auto trans as i want to use 5speed in my project car.fwd

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    Re: STS 13:63, you ask how?

    Don't be surprised if you DON'T get a resolution on this point since the dealer CANNOT randomly customize the flash calibration as has been incinuated here. The Tech-line software only allows (as you pointed out) the downloading of preset flashes designed by GM to address "specific" customer driveability concerns. If you want to custom flash your car, you need an application such as LT1-Edit (which I use on my car).

  16. #15
    epanightmare is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: STS 13:63, you ask how?

    Quote Originally Posted by Katshot
    Don't be surprised if you DON'T get a resolution on this point since the dealer CANNOT randomly customize the flash calibration as has been incinuated here. The Tech-line software only allows (as you pointed out) the downloading of preset flashes designed by GM to address "specific" customer driveability concerns. If you want to custom flash your car, you need an application such as LT1-Edit (which I use on my car).
    do you know were i can find this application

    thanks

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