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Northstar Engines and System Technical Discussion Discussion, need a new motor! in Cadillac Engine Technical Discussion; I'm sure you know what a stud looks like so I won't bother. Insert...
  1. #16
    Ranger's Avatar
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    Re: need a new motor!

    I'm sure you know what a stud looks like so I won't bother.

    Insert


  2. #17
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    Submariner409 is offline If it won't run, chrome it
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    Re: need a new motor!

    Quote Originally Posted by cadillac00 View Post
    Is there a difference between studs and inserts?
    Obviously you never opened the links in Post #11.

  3. #18
    cadillac00 is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    I'm going with studs sounds like a better fix. here's a kit I found on Ebay is it a good deal?

    http://item.mobileweb.ebay.com/viewi...id=15097228588

    And how much will labor run me for the studs and HG repair?

  4. #19
    Manic Mechanic is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: need a new motor!

    You're doing it wrong.

    Vernon

  5. #20
    cadillac00 is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Manic Mechanic
    You're doing it wrong.

    Vernon
    How so?

  6. #21
    beebop01 is offline Banned
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    Re: need a new motor!

    I was at a local Cadillac dealer located in Indianapolis and they received 2 bad used motors from LKQ (headgaskets.) I have been using bolts and inserts since
    1993 and have had no issues, its all on how the block is prepped and inserts are installed

  7. #22
    V-swagon's Avatar
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    I rebuilt my N* in my 02 DTS almost 2 years ago and I time serted my block and used ARP studs and haven't had a problem with the head gaskets. I also decked the block and heads to make sure they were flat. I also studded the bottom end with ARP studs. Eagle rod, forged pistons, and ported heads. My only issue I had was the secondary chain tensioner failed twice due to aftermarket defect.

  8. #23
    Ranger's Avatar
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    Re: need a new motor!

    Quote Originally Posted by cadillac00 View Post
    And how much will labor run me for the studs and HG repair?
    Depends on where you are and who does it. Anywhere from $2000 - $4000.

  9. #24
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    Re: need a new motor!

    Quote Originally Posted by cadillac00 View Post
    And how much will labor run me for the studs and HG repair?
    Depends on where you are and who does it. Anywhere from $2000 - $4000.

  10. #25
    Manic Mechanic is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: need a new motor!

    Quote Originally Posted by cadillac00 View Post
    How so?
    This:
    Quote Originally Posted by V-swagon View Post
    I time serted my block and used ARP studs and haven't had a problem with the head gaskets.
    If you use the ARP studs you found which have the same size threads as the factory head bolts on a damaged thread block (or a still good one that you do not want to strip in the future) you have to install the inserts first, then stud it with the smaller ARP kit. Double cost and work to accomplish the same end result.

    If you use the stud kit from Carrol Custom Cadillac that Sub linked to in post #11 or if you can get Jake at N* performance to ship you his then you only have to rethread the block and install the studs directly to it. Those come with oversized base threads that fit a drilled and tapped block hole like the inserts do. Kill's two birds with one stone.

    Vernon

    ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by V-swagon View Post
    My only issue I had was the secondary chain tensioner failed twice due to aftermarket defect.
    V-swagon, could you name the brand(s) of chain tensioner you had problems with? I'm about to replace mine with an aftermarket kit. Mines DNJ, AKA Rock Products. And was your failure the hydraulic part or one of the shoes/guides?

    Vernon

  11. #26
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    Re: need a new motor!

    Quote Originally Posted by Manic Mechanic View Post
    If you use the ARP studs you found which have the same size threads as the factory head bolts on a damaged thread block (or a still good one that you do not want to strip in the future) you have to install the inserts first, then stud it with the smaller ARP kit. Double cost and work to accomplish the same end result.
    Inserts AND studs makes no sense to me.

  12. #27
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    Re: need a new motor!

    Maybe I'm biased because I've done 2 HG replacements with inserts, but based on the track record of inserts, especially Norm's, I really see no reason to stud a stock engine for everyday use. I cannot argue that studs are not better, but most of these cars with failing HG's are 10+ years old, how good is good enough?

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Manic Mechanic

    This:

    If you use the ARP studs you found which have the same size threads as the factory head bolts on a damaged thread block (or a still good one that you do not want to strip in the future) you have to install the inserts first, then stud it with the smaller ARP kit. Double cost and work to accomplish the same end result.

    If you use the stud kit from Carrol Custom Cadillac that Sub linked to in post #11 or if you can get Jake at N* performance to ship you his then you only have to rethread the block and install the studs directly to it. Those come with oversized base threads that fit a drilled and tapped block hole like the inserts do. Kill's two birds with one stone.

    Vernon

    ----------



    V-swagon, could you name the brand(s) of chain tensioner you had problems with? I'm about to replace mine with an aftermarket kit. Mines DNJ, AKA Rock Products. And was your failure the hydraulic part or one of the shoes/guides?

    Vernon
    Since I did all my own machine work, I was just out time and cost of ARP studs. I did time sert the block back to the factory size threads. I only had one hole that was kind of bad but wasn't the root cause of my head gasket failure. I had a breach at the fire ring of the gasket which began to leak. I had pistons replaced at 70k miles at the dealership due to oil consumption and I think that might have lead to the it.

    As far as the timing chain parts, I bought Cloyes parts. I had about 2k miles on the rebuild and I had the secondary chain jump. When I took it apart, the rollers on that chain were smaller than the primary chain. It was sloppy on the gears, wiped out the chain guide shoe and over extended the tensioner. Got new parts, drove it a day, and the tensioner collapsed on the same side. Replaced with stock parts, no problems. I talked to Cadillac Hot Rod Fabrication in California, and he just uses factory tensioners, chains, and guides when he builds his engines.

  14. #29
    stoveguyy is online now Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: need a new motor!

    v-swagon. did the dealer insert the block when they pulled heads to replace pistons?

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by stoveguyy
    v-swagon. did the dealer insert the block when they pulled heads to replace pistons?
    I don't think they did the time serts when they replaced the pistons. I don't recall seeing any in the block when I did them.

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