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Northstar Engines and System Technical Discussion Discussion, Quick and Dirty 97 Deville HG Job in Cadillac Engine Technical Discussion; A 4-point lift can make the job a bit quicker though lol....a bit...
  1. #46
    vincentm's Avatar
    vincentm is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    A 4-point lift can make the job a bit quicker though lol....a bit

  2. #47
    trbolvr is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: Quick and Dirty 97 Deville HG Job

    This is how I primed my pump. The "Topsider" is made for marine applications but I've found it to be a great tool in the garage. It basically gives you a vacuum in the can when the handle is pumped. Also works great for cleaning out heater cores.

    small.jpg

  3. #48
    maeng9981's Avatar
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    Re: Quick and Dirty 97 Deville HG Job

    I don't know if you'd like this procedure or not - but what I did when I was doing mine was that I pulled the fuse for fuel pump and then cranked the engine for 15 seconds, twice. After that, no complaints from the engine or the pressure sensor.

  4. #49
    stoveguyy is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: Quick and Dirty 97 Deville HG Job

    Took several minutes of idling for my motor to quiet down. I have only done 1 head gasket job. You could ask someone who has done many jobs. Is it common to get lifter rattle when oil pump is not touched?

  5. #50
    MRneatfreak- is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: Quick and Dirty 97 Deville HG Job

    Quote Originally Posted by Submariner409 View Post
    Not to rub salt into an open wound, but this job turned out to be anything BUT "Quick" and it certainly is "Dirty".

    When you get back into the front of the engine, make sure the oil pump drive sleeve is correctly installed and that the balancer bolt torque sequence is correct. Maybe you have time to find a real GM service manual ??? ........ or www.alldatadiy.com
    If it hadn't been for the oil pump, it would have been quick (for me). Usually takes me a couple weeks to R&R engines let alone tear one apart and redo the head studs. Usually have too many hobbies to focus on one all the time. I don't have all the time, experience and money that you seem to have o'le timer. That's what this forum is for. Like I said in my other post I've used alldata along the way.

    Well on top of the hurricane had a death in the family and made a 1200 mile one way drive, TWICE in 4 days with a family of 5. When I got back today my friend took a peek at the problem, and realized the spacer/ring/bushing that goes between the pump and the harmonic balancer is missing. So gonna pull the timing cover tomorrow, and see if I installed it between the pump and the engine itself. That would explain alot. If its missing completely then I'm making a trip to the junk yard to pull one. I swept the floor last week, so if its not installed chances are that it got swept up.

  6. #51
    MRneatfreak- is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: Quick and Dirty 97 Deville HG Job

    Quote Originally Posted by trbolvr View Post
    This is how I primed my pump. The "Topsider" is made for marine applications but I've found it to be a great tool in the garage. It basically gives you a vacuum in the can when the handle is pumped. Also works great for cleaning out heater cores.

    Attachment 96659
    Had no idea where to hook up to a suction port. Great idea, I don't have a Topsider, but I do have a rochester suction gun. Same principle, just on a smaller scale.

  7. #52
    MRneatfreak- is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: Quick and Dirty 97 Deville HG Job

    Quote Originally Posted by vincentm View Post
    A 4-point lift can make the job a bit quicker though lol....a bit
    Yeah I personally wouldn't want to do one without a lift. I was blessed to have good neighbors this time.

    I am 6 foot 8 inches tall and 300 pounds. I wouldn't do this job with the car on jack stands. Especially with my cracked driveway the way it is.

  8. #53
    MRneatfreak- is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: Quick and Dirty 97 Deville HG Job

    Quote Originally Posted by stoveguyy View Post
    Took several minutes of idling for my motor to quiet down. I have only done 1 head gasket job. You could ask someone who has done many jobs. Is it common to get lifter rattle when oil pump is not touched?
    It may have taken you several minutes to quiet down the lifters but I bet you didn't have an oil pressure light on or a low oil pressure warning? Did you?

  9. #54
    MRneatfreak- is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: Quick and Dirty 97 Deville HG Job

    Quote Originally Posted by maeng9981 View Post
    I don't know if you'd like this procedure or not - but what I did when I was doing mine was that I pulled the fuse for fuel pump and then cranked the engine for 15 seconds, twice. After that, no complaints from the engine or the pressure sensor.
    Yeah this seems like a good idea as well. Except I was trying to think of how to disable the spark and the only thing I was coming up with was to disconnect the 4 power connectors that go to the coil base plate. Aside from priming the system with a vacuum source.

  10. #55
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    Re: Quick and Dirty 97 Deville HG Job

    Quote Originally Posted by MRneatfreak- View Post
    Yeah I personally wouldn't want to do one without a lift. I was blessed to have good neighbors this time.

    I am 6 foot 8 inches tall and 300 pounds. I wouldn't do this job with the car on jack stands. Especially with my cracked driveway the way it is.
    Holy crap you area big dude! Do you fit ok?

    Good luck on gettin' her finnished up. Almost there!

  11. #56
    MRneatfreak- is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: Quick and Dirty 97 Deville HG Job

    Quote Originally Posted by CadillacLuke24 View Post
    Holy crap you area big dude! Do you fit ok?

    Good luck on gettin' her finnished up. Almost there!
    Thats why I like these deville's plenty of room for my knees to stradle the wheel without hitting the console, bench seats, column shifter etc..

  12. #57
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    Re: Quick and Dirty 97 Deville HG Job

    Well I went to the bone yard and pulled the balancer off to see if I was missing any parts on my car, and I didn't see any difference to what is on my car. So that leads me to believe that everything is there that needs to be there, just have to figure out why its not getting any oil pressure?

    Currently lettting the battery charge after I cranked for about 15 seconds with no fuel pump relay installed. Battery is getting old. Will have to address that soon if I ever get this oil problem resolved.
    If after cranking another 15 seconds doesn't do the trick. Then I'm going to try removing the pump and packing with petroleum jelly. I was thinking of trying this other pump I pulled from the bone yard and packing it instead??

    I want to try to prime the system with a suction gun but I don't think there is enough clearance to horse around much behind that front motor mount bracket.


    *Edit* One more thought: if the oil pressure sensor was messed up or the connector wasn't fully seated what would be the symptom? Would the oil light always be on? I do remember having problems getting that connector on, but I think it was seated.

  13. #58
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    Re: Quick and Dirty 97 Deville HG Job

    You should have essentially little or NO valve lifter or mechanical noise at startup after complete overhaul proper assembly. None. Your posted valve clatter and indications of low/no oil pressure says something is drastically wrong. Drastically. Oil pressure light be damned.

    Every - and I mean every engine I build/rebuild gets dropped in, checked over, started, and as soon as ( ?? 3 seconds ??) oil pressure starts to climb the engine goes to 1,800 rpm for 15 minutes to begin the cam and ring break-in. If you trust your build instincts, all is well: The absolute worst thing you can do to a rebuilt or top overhauled engine is to idle it at initial start. BUT you have to guarantee that the engine will lubricate itself from the get-go.......... and that takes service manuals, experience, and gearhead instinct. (Yes, I have made a couple of very expensive mistakes due to being in a hurry.)

    Tell me that you dribbled assembly lube all over all 32 cam lobes and lifters..............

  14. #59
    MRneatfreak- is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: Quick and Dirty 97 Deville HG Job

    Yep drizzled oil on the lobes when we were rotating the crank by hand for about 15 minutes when we set the timing chains, just to make sure nothing was going to mash together.

    After having removed the fuel pump relay and putting it back in, now I can't get it to start? It will turn over with the starter but will not take off on its own. Checked codes get a p0118 for the coolant ckt, irrelevant. But also get a p0322 which is:
    - Ignition/Distributor engine speed sensor harness circuit is open or shorted
    - Ignition/Distributor engine speed sensor poor electrical connection
    - Faulty Ignition/Distributor engine speed sensor
    - Faulty Crankshaft Position sensor
    - Low battery charge
    - Faulty Engine Control Module (ECM

    May just be the battery will have to disconnect and erase the memory. Thats the only thing I can think. Cause it wanted to start before I removed the fuel pump relay but I wouldn't let it. And I'm gettting fuel at the rail when I push the schrader valve in. Yes I turned the key on and off several times to pressurize the system

  15. #60
    MRneatfreak- is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: Quick and Dirty 97 Deville HG Job

    Well got it to finally fire on its own, had to use a porta power, starter was spinning fast but something about this battery that the car don't like. Still have the same noise and the oil light remains on. Tearing back into the timing cover and oil pump to see what I can see.

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