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Select one if you have had a problem with the headgasket the Northstar V8:

Northstar Headgasket/Cracked Block/Bolt Failure? Please let us know

294K views 546 replies 243 participants last post by  ihc70 
#1 ·
Here is the Definitive Northstar Headgasket Thread. Please choose your year of Cadillac and state if you have had a headgasket problem with your Seville or Eldorado and what mileage it occured at. If you have never had a problem please do not participate in the poll!
 
#377 ·
Since it can be a big job, have you at least pulled the spark plugs first? Sure, if it's hydraulic'ed, it's likely going to be coming out anyway, but at least you'll shoot the offending fluid out and see that all the other systems are functioning.
I suppose if it's in the garage, that could be messy. But at least you'd know for sure.

Good luck.

Paul
 
#378 ·
after i bought this caddy i found out what a piece of shit it really is i am a FORD man i will take my fords over this north star piece of shit any day. blown head gasket caddy need new engine threads pulled out of block. ford cast iron block that dont happen. caddy just looks good n driveway.
 
#380 ·
Drop a 4.6L DOHC Ford in, don't tell anyone....
 
#385 ·
Exactly. Ford isn't completely without it's flaws either.
Sorry you got a bum one though dwilly. I got lucky and found out about this before purchasing a pristine '99 (by checking the forum here first in fact), but have have since looked at various '04's and would not hesitate to buy one if I find the right one. Even though it's still just a bit close to those potentially bad years, I'm not worried. And still love Cadillacs (some of them) and other GM marques as well.

I had an older aluminum block Caddy (cast-iron heads though, oddly enough) with zero issues, and would purchase an '04 or later Northstar in a heartbeat still. Even with all the discussion here.
I put very little money into my old one in maintenance. Even parts you would expect to fail over the life of the car, didn't. The only engine parts I had to change in the over 200+ thousand miles on it were one engine mount, one alternator, and one serpentine pulley. Sold it and it's still running strong for the new owner.
By the same token, I've had fantastic luck with all my Fords, all my Buicks, my Chevy, and each of the imports I've owned over the years. However, I NEVER had one run and last like that Coupe DeVille!

If I sound like I'm defending the name, I guess I am. I think Cadillac got away with murder for 11 model years and didn't get called to the carpet for it. Just like Ford hasn't been the subject of a 60-Minutes or Nightline thing regarding the plugs. And from another angle, I think Ford got robbed on that whole TFI ignition module failure rate thing back in the early nineties, or whenever it was.

It just sounded like you were trashing the whole line because of your negative experience with one car, and were using logic (that whole "my old cast-iron Ford" thing) that didn't make sense to me.They're still excellent cars, and that from an aknowledged Ford guy too. Don't expect my 5.0 or my 400 to have head-bolt issues, but because they're older, they don't run like a Northstar either!
Have never been, and can't imagine ever being, "brand conscious" to the point of thinking my brand is better than your brand, even because of one fault. Not without empirical data anyway!

If I was, I'd hate Chevrolet because my Corvair was fitted with o-rings of an insufficient heat rating, and Ford because my '71 Bronco was rusted through in 8 different places on the body before it was 5 years old, because of a stupidly simplified design for manufacturing ease (I "assume") that captured water in all the wrong places.
I just changed o-ring material (that wonderful Viton) and fixed the sheet metal in such a way that it wouldn't do it again. Would I bad mouth, or even sell my old horse? Not a chance. Ok, well, I'd bad mouth Ford for the flaw, but wouldn't hesitate to buy another one.
Even with an all-aluminum engine!

I don't think, by listing your old "Ford cast-iron block" as the assumed cure for a stripped thread is using the old noggin though. If that was the case, then your beloved Fords are in trouble, as they're now all aluminum too. Just like I bet your '97 Nissan is.
Loved my '00 Maxima aluminum V6 by the way. Pretty decent car, but a great engine! If it was a material issue, you'd have to be worried too. They (Caddy) just screwed it up. Harder to screw up thread in cast-iron for sure, but that's not an argument against Cadillac, or aluminum. It just is.

Every new Ford V8 since the early to mid-nineties (for cars, and '97 for trucks) has been aluminum also. With the exception of a few leftover 5.8 Windsors in the trucks for a year or two, and the 5.0's in the Explorer up to about '01, of course, Ford has used aluminum in all their V8 blocks and heads. And for the first several year models, owners have been dealing with the aforementioned plug issue. Either seized to the head, ruining the threads, or blowing out, ruining not only the plugs and heads, but sometimes a lot more, when the center electrode and insulators went bounding around inside the combustion chamber. I bet if that had happened to you, you'd be calling Fords all kinds of cuss words too.

There are now even special tool kits you can buy in any auto parts store to help recover, restore and replace your buggered up threads and plugs once your old plug has either seized up or blown out. When they're fixable that is. No matter what way it goes though, it's leaving you with a very expensive "tune-up" for your Ford. So sure, the Northstar had a seriously nasty issue that caused you to have to replace threads. And it probably cost more than the Ford fix to boot, but not all Caddy's are going to be a problem. And not all Northstars have the problem either, as the poll above shows.

Sorry again that you got a buggered one. If you got it used, I'd be more upset at the guy that sold it to you. If you bought it new though, you did pay a lot for something that wasn't just a simple driveway fix away from being perfect. And that's upsetting for sure.

In fact, I've said it many times, I'm shocked that Cadillac got away with this flaw for so long without a big brouhaha being brought up by the media, the owners, and their lawyers. In all the time (roughly 11 model years!) that this problem existed, not much has been written about it that I've seen. Except here.

So what are you planning for the Caddy then bwilly? Sell it? Or did you have it fixed already? If so, drive the heck out of it and get your money's worth.
And watch out for your next Ford purchase. Make sure it's not one of the 4.6 or 5.4 Mod motors that's got the plug issue.

Sorry if it sounds like I'm jumping all over you. I think it does sound that way in fact, but it's meant in a very friendly/competitive/conversational combative way.


Paul
 
#386 ·
oh man we talking about ford engines now ok we got to talk about the 4.6 Intech's 32v
those have to be one of the best motored cars i have ever had
the 95 closed in on 170k i think before i lost compresion in a 3 cylendors and that was only cause the dealer that did the plug change screwed up
they put a used engine in at there cost got one that had 32k on it drove the car to 260k sold it to a friend who then drove it till it was just shy of 400k tranny went out parked it and hasnt moved it since but engine will still start up from what he says

i road in a town car limo about 2 years ago it was a 99 damm thing had close to 500k on it and the owner said its original
 
#389 ·
My otherwise perfect 1997 Deville D'elegance had a perfectly sealed coolant system until exactly 150,000, when I first noticed that the level in the expansion tank was dropping and that when opened the cap, there was a noticeable sucking sound. That was in October of 2010. Since then I've lived with an inch or two drop every 250 miles, more if I put the engine under any strain. I'm at 165,000 or so now and while the car is fine tooling around in open traffic on level ground, it'll go screaming up towards 230 (and beyond if I let it) driving on a freeway up any sort of grade. What a shame.
 
#391 ·
I have a 1996 Deville VIN Y....No problems yet. Going to be changing my coolant here soon.

I'm going to get hell for this :duck: :peeking: but I'll stick to my guns :gungrin:

The Northstar is a FANTASTIC Engine overall. GM screwed up on the head gaskets big time. With decent head bolts these cars have few if any problems. As for Mr. Ford on the forums, I wonder how they got the moniker Found On Road Dead? How about Fix Or Repair Daily? :sneaky: Get off your soap box bro. All manufactuers goof. GM did with the Northstar's HGs. Ford obviously did at some point *cough* Edsel *cough* Pinto *cough*. The Northstars are insane powerplants. 275/300 HP, up to 28 mpg for a 2 ton car? That's nuts!! Yeah, there's a need for HGs likely at some point, but once those are fixed these cars will go for a LONG time. one dude has 515,000 on A DeVille over in the High mileage thread. A 98 to boot. So put that in your pipe and smoke it.
 
#392 ·
I have had my 97 ETC since December 2011. Currently 127,040 miles. A few electrical problems and a little violent shake the other day but that it is. How would I go about checking my engine to keep it from having a HG problem? How would I maintain it to keep it from "bowing up" so to speak?
 
#393 ·
Put this back in the Northstar performance threads - this is for those who have had a failed engine. Normal owner's manual maintenance and coolant exchanges every 3 years are your best insurance - just as with any engine.
 
#394 ·
I am thinking the head gaskets are fine, but the real problem is high acid levels in the coolant. The cooling system is neglected by the introduction of long life coolants, and being almost no one checks the acid levels, it climbs and climbs and something has to give. Seals, gaskets and aluminum.

My mom and dad are case in point, they bought a 97 Deville new, and it got sold a couple years ago with the factory coolant in it. I told them time and time again to change it, but they didn't. Shops charge too much and being on fixed income, they couldn't afford it. And I wasn't anywhere near to do it for them.

I don't think Dexcool is the primary issue, but it doesn't react well to neglect and overheating, it compounds a problem. And when overheated it becomes very acidic. And if the shops don't flush the coolant out and put in fresh (you know, to save a buck), then you have acidic coolant still in the system. Setting up for the next failure....

Shame too, I think the Northstar is one of the best engines GM has designed in a long time, but plauged with issues.

I would love to meet someone with a blown head gasket who bought the car new and changed the coolant out every 2 years like old school coolant required.

I usually do every year if I can. No matter the "life" of it.

Everyone with a Northstar or any engine really (especially if on DexCool), should monitor PH acid levels with something like this: http://www.amazon.com/Cool-Trak-311519-Coolant-Testing-Strips/dp/B000MIUJMO
 
#395 ·
Re: Definitive Northstar Headgasket Thread

Rim1's question on mechanics on Long Island has been moved to a new thread down in the question/answer section of this Forum.

Deville VIN Y - Long Island...........
 
#398 ·
Read through multiple pages on this thread and wanted to see if someone could come up with more accurate numbers than this... however here is a small data capture. I decided to post this because I saw people referring to blown head-gaskets as a very "common" occurrence in the N* engine. I've also seen many people post on those threads indicating that the forum captures the problem cases, not the good cases.

These numbers are scaled down greatly as Seville's were not the only N* engine's produced during these years. As well, however, this forum is only capturing the audience of 141,000 people.

Code:
Wikipedia Link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cadillac_Seville

Model Year 	Sales Numbers
1998 	39,009
1999 	33,532
2000 	29,535
2001 	25,290
2002 	21,494
2003 	18,747
2004 	3,386
2005 	137

Head Gasket Failure Percentage (Real percentage based on a smaller datapool)
1998: 0.37% 
1999: 0.44%
2000: 0.20%
2001: 0.15%
2002: 0.13%
2003: 0.000640%
 
#399 · (Edited)
So you are dividing all Northstar failures reported by year on the forum's poll by the total number of Sevilles produced during that same year? How is this data useful? The reports of HG failures include all Northstar cars, not just Sevilles...

There is no way to know what percentage of cars these reported failures represent. The only real value of the poll is to compare one year to another for the number of failures reported by forum members who took part in the poll... Of course even that has limited value since not all cars are the same age and total production numbers of Northstar cars varied greatly from one year to the next before 1996.

I don't think there is any way that a accurate percentage could ever be figured... One can only guess based on anecdotal evidence.
 
#400 ·
Plus, there's no way to factor in the number of Cadillac, GM, and private shop numbers of engines with head gasket failure.

As we've always posted, this ^^^ is a very non-scientific (read: statistically flawed) poll. Especially when you look real hard and see that one or more members have posted failures in three or four year groups - thus skewing the results for those years..
 
#401 ·
02 Deville DTS 90000
 
#402 ·
So best I can see, change coolant every 2 years and immediately if the coolant gets low. Forget the idea of Dexcool or any other long life coolant intervals. If you want to know, get coolant test strips (ones that are for orange coolant if you have dex or simliar non green coolants) and measure every 6 months. If acid levels rise, change coolant....
 
#403 ·
96 STS

Started with slight coolant loss of quart every 2 weeks @ 138.5k with rough running when cold for approx time of 1 minute, normal in town temps @ 196 to 201, highway 188 to 192 @70mph Overheated in driveway at 140.8k, thermostat changed block flushed, new coolant added..

1 week later huge white cloud in am, very rough when cold start smoothing out @ 2 to 4 minutes and slight white smoke temps in town now @ 199 to 210 and higher if lights are long. highway 196 to 199 Block test color yellow. Game over engine to be studded and felpro gaskets used
 
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