Torque Converter Clutch (P 0741 TCC stuck off) - Page 2
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Northstar Engines and System Technical Discussion Discussion, Torque Converter Clutch (P 0741 TCC stuck off) in Cadillac Engine Technical Discussion; Originally Posted by Ranger Then what is the purpose of clearing the DTC and driving in 3rd for several days ...
  1. #16
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    Re: Torque Converter Clutch (p0741 tcc stuck off)

    Quote Originally Posted by Ranger View Post
    Then what is the purpose of clearing the DTC and driving in 3rd for several days to pass an emissions test when you get that DTC?
    Beats me. Both of my cars will lock the TCC with the PRNDL selector in 3 vs. D, so I don't understand that scheme either. I confirmed this last night on the ride home from work in the '01, and I know it does it on the '97 as well. Just from the ride yesterday, in the '01, the TCC will lock with the selector in 3 at about 37 mph, which is also about the speed it'll upshift into 4th gear, if the selector is in D.

    Below that speed (again, with the selector in 3), it seems to stay unlocked, but it WILL lock above that speed, and stay locked. If I slip the transmission selector into D, the transmission will shift to 4th gear, and the TCC will lock back up if vehicle speed is over about 45 mph.

    Windrider, if you put your transmission selector in 3 and run, say, 50 mph, you don't get TCC lockup?

    This may be a secondary programming scheme in the transmission...sort of a "failsafe" if you will. If there's a problem with the TCC or with a sensor, perhaps the TCC lock schedules are changed to preclude lockup in 3rd gear? I don't know.

  2. #17
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    Re: Torque Converter Clutch (p0741 tcc stuck off)

    I verified this on the way home from work (again, in the '01 STS). With the gear selector in 3, the TCC will lock at speeds above 38 mph. It will stay locked at speeds higher than 38 mph. It will also stay locked as speeds fall below 38 mph, but will unlock itself, without brake application, when the digital speed readout falls to 35 mph.

    Your speeds may vary, STS-to-SLS, because of final drive ratio differences, but I believe the TCC lock schedules should be similar. They are on my '97 SLS (which, admittedly, is an older generation). I don't remember the exact mph figures I quoted above, for the '97, but I do know that the TCC will lock with the gear selector in 3.

  3. #18
    Windrider is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: Torque Converter Clutch (p0741 tcc stuck off)

    Code:
     
    Windrider, if you put your transmission selector in 3 and run, say, 50 mph, you don't get TCC lockup? :confused:
    Jacock:

    Thats right I ran the test at 60mph and did it several times - no lock up.

    I will do it again tonight and confirm.

    thanks

    Windrider

  4. #19
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    Re: Torque Converter Clutch (p0741 tcc stuck off)

    It's not supposed to lock up in 3rd. It is supposed to lock in D only, because thats overdrive. It locks up and it help with gas consumption. Windrider, if your tach moves up about 200 rpm or so, then you sensor is bad, not the clutch. If you have to take to emissions, drive the car in 3rd only for 2 weeks. Don't put it into D. Driving in 3rd will trick the sensor into no throwing a code because the TCC can't lock in 3rd.

  5. #20
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    Re: Torque Converter Clutch (p0741 tcc stuck off)

    It IS supposed to lock in 3rd.

    From my '97 service manual, this is found on page 7-46:

    The Torque Converter Clutch (TCC/VCC) should apply in Third or Fourth gear. Note when the TCC/VCC applies. If you do not notice the apply by an RPM drop, refer to Torque Converter Clutch Evaluation and Diagnosis.

    I will concede that that information is from the '97 manual, but I believe it to be current through today...there's no reason GM would change that, and my '01 acts just like my '97.

  6. #21
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    Re: Torque Converter Clutch (p0741 tcc stuck off)

    intresting.... I think we just confused windrider to death.

  7. #22
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    Re: Torque Converter Clutch (p0741 tcc stuck off)

    Yeah, and me too. It seems that most folks' cars involved with this problem have no TCC lock in 3rd gear. I'm wondering why...if that's related to the code or not (it probably is I would say). Does your car's TCC lock in manual 3, and do you have the P0741 code?

    The service manual listed some things the PCM does when that code is set, and disabling the TCC in 3rd gear was not one of them. Locking out OD was, but only when the trans is in an overheat mode. So I remain curious why putting the gear selector in manual 3 works for folks with this code, and why the code doesn't set. The service manual was clear that one of the conditions for the code setting was transmission being in 2nd, 3rd, or 4th gear, which makes it seem like the TCC functionality is even available in 2nd (but the service manual doesn't confirm that anywhere else in the text). I don't remember there being a vehicle speed range for this code to set...but there were a number of other factors, like throttle position, etc. I can post the whole section when I get home tonight after work.

    Does anyone here have a service manual from the 2000-2004 timeframe, who can verify whether this information in my '97 manual is current to the more recent era of cars?

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    Re: Torque Converter Clutch (p0741 tcc stuck off)

    Quote Originally Posted by jadcock View Post
    TCCs are there for a reason, and the cooling systems and transmission lubrication systems are designed as such. We all know these cars' systems are so integrated, we really shouldn't question THAT...

    Having no TCC operation will cause the transmission to run hotter. There's no doubt about it. The difference will be sustained slippage on long trips. In the city, the TCC usually isn't engaged anyway, depending on your speed. But it will have an effect on transmission durability and fluid life.
    Action Taken By PCM when P0741 is set is it Inhibits 4th gear if the transaxle is in hot mode.

  9. #24
    Madmikeee is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: Torque Converter Clutch (p0741 tcc stuck off)

    My 2000 deville is now throwing this code (This sucks) Can someone give me a ballpark figure/most likely scenario on the repair for this so I can make sure to not get totally azz raped.

    Thanks.

  10. #25
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    Re: Torque Converter Clutch (p0741 tcc stuck off)

    What "sensor" causes the "sensor problem" you guys are referring to? I thought I read in the FSM that the code is set when the PCM detects more than a tiny amount of slippage based on engine RPM vs. input shaft RPM

  11. #26
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    Re: Torque Converter Clutch (p0741 tcc stuck off)

    I think it is the TCC solenoid that fails and causes this problem.

  12. #27
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  13. #28
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    Re: Does This Help?

    yes it does a little thanks.

    My thing is trying to determine the cost of the repair, which of course is a VERY loaded question to be asking. It could be a simple relatively inexpensive fix if it's a solenoid or alot more if it is the converter itself

  14. #29
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    Re: Torque Converter Clutch (p0741 tcc stuck off)

    It won't be a cheap fix either way. The TCC solenoid is in the transmission side cover. To gain access, the trans (drivetrain) has to be removed or at least the cradle lowered a little to get the side cover off.

  15. #30
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    Re: Torque Converter Clutch (p0741 tcc stuck off)

    Ranger is right - a lot of $ - either live with it or consider rebuilding the trans while it is out. I lived with it for a year or so and when the HG went on my first engine, I had a used engine and trans installed. If the TCC goes on this trans, i will live with it again until the trans needs to come out again - if ever

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