4.9 performance upgrades ?
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HT4100 4.1, 4.5, 4.9 Discussion, 4.9 performance upgrades ? in Cadillac Engine Technical Discussion; I have a '95 4.9 that I will be installing in a '95 Monte Z34 (3450 Lbs.). I have a ...
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    4.9 performance upgrades ?

    I have a '95 4.9 that I will be installing in a '95 Monte Z34 (3450 Lbs.). I have a few questions and those of you who were on the Cad forums at the now defunct GM Forums might recognize them. At that time the plan was to swap it into a Lumina Z34 but the Monte came along so the plan changed.

    Since the throttle body has a 5" air cleaner ring I would like to run a standard 14" diameter open element air cleaner with plans of building a functional cowl induction system later. Since I don't see any signs of sensors, etc. in the stock 4.9 airbox and associated plumbing I assume this can be done. Is this a safe assumption ?

    After buying my engine I noticed the exhaust manifolds were much more streamlined than earlier 4.9's I looked at but then I noticed a 4.1 with tubular exhaust manifolds. Although they looked EXTREMELY restrictive the idea crossed my mind that they could be a good starting point for a set of custom made small tube headers. Anybody tried this ? Or would I be better off sticking with the '95 iron manifolds.

    I was going to use the Cad 4T60E but I want to install 3.33 gears from a 3.1 powered car. This requires a complete trans tear down so I will have the Monte trans rebuilt instead. What mods do I have to make to have the speedo register correctly with the lower gears ? ECM reprogram, etc. ?

    The 4.1 with the tubular manifolds also has valve covers with straight fins on the top and no writing of any kind. These should fit the 4.9 shouldn't they ? They appear to be aluminum, think they would polish up halfway decent ?

    Thanks.......

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    Re: 4.9 performance upgrades ?

    Very cool project man! About the headers, If you have the cash, find someone that can make you a set of custom headers. Stock manifolds are always restrictive. And the valve covers, wouldnt it be cooler to open the hood and see 4.9 on the cover? Oh and the air cleaner, i cant think of a problem with that aside from heat, and the cowl hood would fix. Oh and what made you pick a cad engine?

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    Re: 4.9 performance upgrades ?

    Quote Originally Posted by DeVillish
    Very cool project man! About the headers, If you have the cash, find someone that can make you a set of custom headers. Stock manifolds are always restrictive. And the valve covers, wouldnt it be cooler to open the hood and see 4.9 on the cover? Oh and the air cleaner, i cant think of a problem with that aside from heat, and the cowl hood would fix. Oh and what made you pick a cad engine?
    I had read about the swap several years ago in Hot Rod and then saw it pop up again while searching a FWD board for info on my wife's LeSabre, it's practically a "bolt in". I had just sold my '62 Impala and was needing a new toy but wanted something "unique" and with a few more creature comforts. I like the styling of the GM W-bodies but just can't get into the sound of a V-6 no matter how hard it runs, my new toy HAD to be a bent 8. I was out in the local salvage yard looking for different wheels for the LeSabre to make it look like less of a "Blue Hair Special" when I spotted a super clean Deville that had been in what appeared to be a sideswipe type collision. Under the hood was a 4.9 you could literally eat off of. The 4.9/W-Body swap immmediately came to mind. I went in the office and asked about it and they told me it was a '95 with 50K on the clock, they shot me a decent price for the entire drivetrain and ECM and I bought it on the spot. I then started looking for something to put it in. I found the Z34 up by Chicago a couple months later, it runs but, as the seller put it, "it sounds like a coffee can half full of marbles", valves kissing pistons.

    As for the valve covers, I rather open the hood and have them see nothing that tells them what it is except 8 plug wires, I like to keep 'em guessing. I'm looking forward to the expression on people's faces when a FWD Monte Carlo rolls by with the unmistakeable rumble of a V-8 coming out of the back.

    There's a guy by the name of Tyre Daniely in Atlanta that has a 4.9 in a Citation X-11 and a Lumina Z-34 with the ASG 5.0 version of the 4.9 in it. He has been a huge help to me with most of the swap details.

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    Re: 4.9 performance upgrades ?

    I like your idea for the intake... caddy guys, is there a prob with that idea?? would that fit under the hood of say a 91 seville, or why haven't we seen something like this? if this doesn't work, then what could be done in the way of nonrestrictive custom intake from the throttle body back?

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    Re: 4.9 performance upgrades ?

    Quote Originally Posted by LacSeville
    I like your idea for the intake... caddy guys, is there a prob with that idea?? would that fit under the hood of say a 91 seville, or why haven't we seen something like this? if this doesn't work, then what could be done in the way of nonrestrictive custom intake from the throttle body back?
    Hood clearance is the main issue, because of the low position of the TB relative to valve covers and all the engine plumbing an air cleaner spacer similar to the one used on '70-'72 Chevelle's with Big Blocks and Cowl Induction would probably be needed for the air cleaner base to clear and you would need a minimum of a 3" tall filter element to get adequate airflow. That combined with the fact that unlike a longitudinal V-8 the center of the TB is about 6" to the passenger side of the vehicle centerline makes a fairly wide cowl induction hood scoop of some sort mandatory. Otherwise your best is a cold air intake with a K&N cone filter mounted somehwere it can pick up cooler air. A smaller diameter air cleaner would possibly fit without the spacer but they normally are not as efficient. I would think a Caddy would have a bit more clearance but I don't know how much.

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    Re: 4.9 performance upgrades ?

    a little OT but, i've been thinking of putting a built up 350 in my 90 Coupe deville, and a cowl hood would be a must because i'll be using a carb, iam sick of computers controling my engine. Only thing iam wondering about is the A/C, and i gota find a trany that a SBC will bolt up to. I'd like to have about 450-500hp when iam all done. Hehe yes in a FWD car, hey if the import guys can do it why cant i?

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    Re: 4.9 performance upgrades ?

    Quote Originally Posted by DeVillish
    a little OT but, i've been thinking of putting a built up 350 in my 90 Coupe deville, and a cowl hood would be a must because i'll be using a carb, iam sick of computers controling my engine. Only thing iam wondering about is the A/C, and i gota find a trany that a SBC will bolt up to. I'd like to have about 450-500hp when iam all done. Hehe yes in a FWD car, hey if the import guys can do it why cant i?
    It is FAR from easy but it has been done, there were pics floating around last year of a late 80's H-body (Bonneville, LeSabre, Olds 88) with a 350 Chevy mounted in it sideways. You'd almost have to use an adapter to hook it to a 4L60 and using a 4L60 there's no way you could ever use all the Chevy's HP without creating LOTS of shrapnel. An old V-8 Toronado TH425 ( FWD version of the TH400 ) could handle it and could be adapted to the Chevy pretty easy but making it work in a newer FWD could be a real bitch......... You'd for sure have to custom build a cradle for it.

    Check the Fiero sites, there are a few of those floatin' around with small block's in them and a lot of what they did will apply to a GM FWD. Good luck !

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    Re: 4.9 performance upgrades ?

    yeah i've been reading ALOT about the V8 feiros. R before D right? Some companies are making adapter kits to bolt 350s to FWD tranies, but getting it all bolted into my engine bay will be a bit of a pain. If it seems like way to much work and way to much cash iam thinking about turbo charging the 4.5 thats in my car now. That i have seen done before, but again in a feiro. You wouldnt happen to have those pics or a web site about that H-body would you?

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    Re: 4.9 performance upgrades ?

    Nice name :-)! Yeah you can use the air cleaner, with a 1" spacer under it, I do in mine. I'd go with a 160 thermostat, 19pph accel injectiors, 94 and 95 manifolds. Those valve covers you're talking about are for the 4.1 with TB injection, and I think they're different, something about the accessories. I remember having to use my old ones when I swapped a 4.9 into my old 4.1 87 deville. The 94 and 95 manifolds flow better than the older ones do. Check out domestic performance's website, they have KILLER trans' thatd work for you...

    Peace,
    D.

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    Re: 4.9 performance upgrades ?

    Thanks for the interest guys, most people look at me like I took my brains out and played with them when they hear what I'm doing.

    DeVillish, check out Citation Collection that's the guy that gave me most of the swap details. He's putting a Turbo on one of his 4.9's.

    HippieD9, I like your user name too, what's the significance of the "D9" ?

    My motor is a '95 so I'm good on the intake. Thanks for the other tips and the heads up on the covers. I may grab them anyway just to play with later on. My best friend owns a transmission shop and he and his head wrench are really into tweaking GM OD's and they have some good low-buck ideas they're itching to try on my 4T60E. The swap to 3.33's is a real pain because of having to have the tranny rebuilt when I have a perfectly good one still bolted to my motor BUT from past experience I know it's worth the trouble and expense. That will give me a bigger performance boost than any other single mod I have planned. This may not be the fastest FWD around but it should definitely be fun and that's why I'm doing it. I learned a long time ago "there is ALWAYS somebody faster" but I should still be able to surprise a lot of people.

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    Re: 4.9 performance upgrades ?

    Quote Originally Posted by DeVillish
    You wouldnt happen to have those pics or a web site about that H-body would you?
    I have 4 pics but no details and I don't remember what site I found them on, it may have been a link someone at W-Body.com posted. They range from 38 to 50 KB, I can e-mail them if you like.

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    Re: 4.9 performance upgrades ?

    Try www.photobucket.com for posting pictures. It is free and works great.

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    Re: 4.9 performance upgrades ?

    The manifolds on a '95 4.9 are better flowing then the ones on my '93 4.9?..... the power output was always the same.... but if this is the case, that could be something to check into.....

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    Re: 4.9 performance upgrades ?

    yeah, if i keep my 4.5 engine in my coupe thats somthing iam gona look into, either that or see how much some custom made headers would cost me. Turbo 4.xs have been done but i dont think that i could get the power of a 350 with a turbo 4.5. A new/rebuilt beefed up trany would be need either way basicly, and Domestic Performance makes LSD diffs for our tranies so thats really cool. But then, with turbo 4.5, i have to deal with the computers and fuel managment and stuff, with the 350 i just tune the carb. One day i'll make a list of Pros and cons for turbo VS 350. Oh and yeah send those pics, Devillish@hotmail.com

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    Re: 4.9 performance upgrades ?

    I personally would NOT do a 350.... too much work.....

    .... I would swap out the 4.5 and put a 4.9 in.... they fit, but you need alot of work to fuel/ECm stuff..... you will gain 20hp and 25 ft lbs of tourqe from that, as well as PFI.... plus it is a bigger engine... then I would see about turbo (which I want to look into as well) and custom headers.... I'd stick with the Cad engine and still, too much work for 350.....

    ....if ya really want to get creative, but stay with Cad, maybe see about a NorthStar.... now yer talkin

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