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Community Lounge, Introductions and General Discussion Discussion, What did you do to your car today? in General Discussion; Originally Posted by brandondeleo Yeah yeah yeah. At least it's something simple, as opposed to a multitude of far more ...
  1. #7711
    CadillacLuke24's Avatar
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    Re: What did you do to your car today?

    Quote Originally Posted by brandondeleo View Post
    Yeah yeah yeah.

    At least it's something simple, as opposed to a multitude of far more dire possibilities.

  2. #7712
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    Re: What did you do to your car today?

    junkstar problems .....i think id rather restore someones rusted corvair .....

  3. #7713
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stoneage_Caddy
    junkstar problems .....i think id rather restore someones rusted corvair .....
    Well, apparently dave has a CF carpool, so that won't be a problem. LOL

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    Re: What did you do to your car today?

    Junkstar my a..! For those of you willing to settle for forth or fifth rate, your sentiment is understandable. Settling for clumsy "old world" performance because of the rumor of possible expensive repairs is also understandable, but don't label a brilliant high performance engine "junk" because of your own inadequacies!

  5. #7715
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    Re: What did you do to your car today?

    Quote Originally Posted by orconn View Post
    For those of you willing to settle for forth or fifth rate
    They aren't, hence the nickname it was given.

    While the rest of the cars were impressive, the engine itself doesn't deserve the praise it gets here. The N* was impressive for a year or two, but was merely average for it's class shortly after it's debut. As time went on, it only maintained it's original level of performance while adding to it's list of weaknesses instead of subtracting from it.

    Hell, even FoMoCo had their own equivalent in 1993. 300hp 4.6, similar efficiency, without the laundry list of troubles. If the N* is a fantastic engine, Ford's equivalent must be a miracle!

    In the meantime, the competition was adding performance while improving quality.

    Junkstar it is, especially after the turn of the century.

  6. #7716
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    Re: What did you do to your car today?

    ^^^ Actually by those standards everything Detroit produced after the early 1950's on through to the era of the Northstar was junk! Detroit innovated only as as a result of outside regulation! The Europeans and Japanese were motivated by taxes ..... and the ability to get get more horsepower from less thirsty engines, eventually Detroit followed suit!

  7. #7717
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    Re: What did you do to your car today?

    Quote Originally Posted by orconn View Post
    Detroit innovated only as as a result of outside regulation!
    Don't look for any support on this from this board. A few years ago, I posted this exact claim, nearly word for word in some anti-CAFE thread, and I met resistance from pretty much everyone!

    Just wait till Hueterm reads your blasphemous post!

    That said, while I agree that major advancements and fresh designs are generally regulation-driven, most manufacterers willingly update and correct existing designs. It's in their best interest. The N* saw none significant. It's production ended still leaking fluids like a sieve and still pumping out the same amount of power. There were some changes made in 2000, but most of them fixed things that were never broken.

    Maybe things are different on your side of town, but where I live, people don't like paying $50k for a car, and leave embarrassing oil/coolant spots in their colleague's driveway, needing to pop the hood to add a quart of oil every 2k miles. That's so 1990's! GM kept putting this out 'till 2010, insisting it's all "normal"!

  8. #7718
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    Re: What did you do to your car today?

    The leaking of oil from aluminum and aluminum/other alloy engines has been a fact of life ever since these materials have been used to make engines. The trade off has been their relative lightness and their better ability to to shed heat.

    Detroit didn't begin to produced anything that could approach the efficiency and output of the North* engine until well into the new century. That fact that the Northstar engines have run up an enviable record (for a high performance engine) for both high mileage and reliable performance pretty much speaks for itself (at least to those who will accept the facts). The biggest flaw in the overall North star* design was the use of the engine in applications that required dropping the engine and its' cradle for what in other applications in luxury cars would be considered routine maintenance (Mercedes, BMW, Audi and Jaguar). The Northstar was never meant for use in truly mass market "transportation"cars but in cars whose initial cost put them out of reach of those who could afford merely low tech, low cost cars.

  9. #7719
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    Re: What did you do to your car today?

    Detroit didn't begin to produced anything that could approach the efficiency and output of the North* engine until well into the new century.

    Um... the LS1 comes to mind, good sir.

    Just saying.
    Aron9000, Aron9000, Lupin and 3 others like this.

  10. #7720
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    Re: What did you do to your car today?

    Quote Originally Posted by orconn View Post
    Junkstar my a..! For those of you willing to settle for forth or fifth rate, your sentiment is understandable. Settling for clumsy "old world" performance because of the rumor of possible expensive repairs is also understandable, but don't label a brilliant high performance engine "junk" because of your own inadequacies!
    I was a tech at a caddy dealer for a few years , trust me , junkstar it is ....my old 4.9 makes almost no power , but it doesnt leave spots on the driveway and if it does well i dont have to split the block to fix it, and i can remove the headbolts without timeserting the block , coarse i dont have to remove the bolts becuse my engine will actually hold onto a headgasket

  11. #7721
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    Re: What did you do to your car today?

    ^^^ spoken like a true Detroit maintainer of mediocrity! It is this same attitude that led to competition horse owneship for the daughters of Ferrari, Jaguar and even Mercedes mechanics!

  12. #7722
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    Re: What did you do to your car today?

    Ooooh, the vaunted Northstar debate! I haven't seen one of these in a while... I know were I stand on the (Intech) side of things!
    brandondeleo and brandondeleo like this.
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  13. #7723
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    Re: What did you do to your car today?

    .............. to the car today. Did a warmup 110 mile trip over to Suicide Bridge Restaurant (Google it), munched down a brew and bowl of oyster stew. Came home, broke out the PorterCable orbital, swirl remover (light cut) and a bunch of blue foam pads and microfiber thingys. Did the hood and front fenders. 2 coats of Pinnacle Souveran carnauba. Tired back & shoulders. 4 Doors/roof tomorrow.

    No engine leaks, drips, hiccups, farts, clunks, squeaks. Made it to 120+ on the old airport road. Added 8 oz. of oil a couple of days ago - first since early March.

    (I built a brand new '65 Chevelle Malibu SS 327/350 4-sp 3.31 posi from the black book that would eat my 2002.5 STS alive - in a straight. Road course would be no contest for the STS.)

    Some people have Northstar clunkers (mostly the quickie used car buyer: "I wanna Cadillac") - the majority of Northstar engines/cars happily plod up and down the highways 24/7/365 without a hiccup. Mom & Pop trade it in at 96,000 miles; someone buys it on the cheap and complains that stuff wears out/leaks/breaks - - and that goes for ANY brand/model of car on earth - used car business: "There's an ass for every seat".

  14. #7724
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    Re: What did you do to your car today?

    Quote Originally Posted by orconn View Post
    The leaking of oil from aluminum and aluminum/other alloy engines has been a fact of life ever since these materials have been used to make engines. The trade off has been their relative lightness and their better ability to to shed heat.
    I'd agree if I had heard this in 1982. 20 years later, most had this sorted out (N* and a few others are an exception, of course.) Those that didn't were at least undergoing revisions to remedy the problems.

    As much as I hate the 3800, it's a good example of how things are SUPPOSED to work. It was a piece of crap when it debuted and through many of it's early years. However, when it was finallly cancelled it was barely the same engine - and it was for the better. Constant revision that addressed real problems, and efficiency upgrades that helped it keep up with the times - and this wasn't even a high end engine, it was just a workhorse for low end cars for the masses.

    The N* may be a good design at the core, but it never got the attention it needed to truly be outstanding. It quickly fell behind, choking on the dust of it's competitors that are now basking in all of the well-deserved glory.

  15. #7725
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    Quote Originally Posted by orconn
    The leaking of oil from aluminum and aluminum/other alloy engines has been a fact of life ever since these materials have been used to make engines. The trade off has been their relative lightness and their better ability to to shed heat.

    Detroit didn't begin to produced anything that could approach the efficiency and output of the North* engine until well into the new century. That fact that the Northstar engines have run up an enviable record (for a high performance engine) for both high mileage and reliable performance pretty much speaks for itself (at least to those who will accept the facts). The biggest flaw in the overall North star* design was the use of the engine in applications that required dropping the engine and its' cradle for what in other applications in luxury cars would be considered routine maintenance (Mercedes, BMW, Audi and Jaguar). The Northstar was never meant for use in truly mass market "transportation"cars but in cars whose initial cost put them out of reach of those who could afford merely low tech, low cost cars.
    I almost hate to get in the middle of this...not all aluminum engines leak. My 4.4l sc N* does not. One of my del slows with a 1.5L with 456k miles does not leak either...mating dis-similar metals with a different growth coefficient will always lead to trouble.

    I am sure that no car manufacturer ever designs, builds & markets anything that will harm the name (well, other than faulty oil pump casting )...

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