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Community Lounge, Introductions and General Discussion Discussion, What did you do to your car today? in General Discussion; Starting yesterday, I get the message Change Brake Pads on the DIC every time I start up Sabrina. I didn't ...
  1. #1681
    gdwriter's Avatar
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    Re: What did you do to your car today?

    Starting yesterday, I get the message Change Brake Pads on the DIC every time I start up Sabrina. I didn't know the Sevilles did that (how do they know?). Good thing she's going in for new pads and rotors tomorrow.

  2. #1682
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    Re: What did you do to your car today?

    Quote Originally Posted by gdwriter View Post
    Starting yesterday, I get the message Change Brake Pads on the DIC every time I start up Sabrina. I didn't know the Sevilles did that (how do they know?). Good thing she's going in for new pads and rotors tomorrow.
    I assume it uses the wear indicator. The LS430 illuminates a light. Unfortunately, once it reaches the point where the light comes on, you have to replace the sensor itself, or solder it back together, which adds a little to the cost of the brake job. I have no idea if they are reusable on the Seville or how exactly it works.

  3. #1683
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    Re: What did you do to your car today?

    Drove by where it is currently sitting, sighed, and shed a tear.

    I miss my wagon.

  4. #1684
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    Re: What did you do to your car today?

    It's a little wire loop (not really a "sensor") that mounts into the pad, and once the pad wears down to a certain point, the wire loop gets broken by the rotor, and the circuit opens, prompting the message. Once the message is activated the sensor must be replaced or repaired.

    AC Delco brake pads include new sensors, but others (like the Raybestos that I got) do not. I assume you could repair the sensor with some soldering, or you could just cut the connector off and solder the two ends together. The sensors are really just a last ditch warning effort anyways.

    It would probably be more complicated and expensive but an optical type sensor would probably be a better solution. At least you wouldn't have to replace it every time it goes off.

  5. #1685
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    Re: What did you do to your car today?

    Just curious, but didn't they perfect a non-electrical sensor on disc brake pads EONS ago? Its a little metal prong type of thing that mounts to the back of the pad. Once the pads wear down to a certain point, that metal prong contacts the brake rotor and makes a horrendous grinding/squealing sound.

    Little details like that brake pad sensor tend to turn me off from the newer model FWD Cadillacs. All of those little touches are a neat idea in concept, but IMO the lack of quality control combined with the cars coming through the R & D process rushed with lots of new technology(for their time) is so off putting to me. A big "luxury" is not having to send your car into the shop every month. Or having the car proclaim such things as "service ride control" "3 malfunctions indicated" or other such nonsense every time I start it.

  6. #1686
    ben.gators is online now Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: What did you do to your car today?

    ^
    Yes, basically it does the same thing! As far as I know Cadillac discontinued using those electrical wear sensors....

  7. #1687
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    Re: What did you do to your car today?

    Yup most manufacturers (Lexus, BMW) did. They're novel, but it's stupid that once they activate they're broken. I think once they invent a real sensor, that doesn't need to break to be activated, they'll have something good.

  8. #1688
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    Re: What did you do to your car today?

    The '04 to '06 LS430 still has the electric wear sensor that has to be replaced. Don't know about later on.

  9. #1689
    OffThaHorseCEO is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: What did you do to your car today?

    couldnt they make something that closes a circuit once the pads become too thin instead of opening a circuit?

    obviously the brake caliper travels more when the pads are too thin, so, you create something like a switch. once the pads become to thin, a solid part of the caliper pressed this switch and completes the circuit, which tells you you need to change your pads. Once the pads are changed you can release the switch to reset

    easy peasy (just make it out of tough material, or, if its made of cheap material, agree to a standard so it can be bought cheaply at autoparts stores)



    and thats the simple on or off version, you could add to that and make it more complex if you wanted to.

    you could have the caliper always make contact with that sensor, add a potentiometer, and based on how far the "switch" travels you could calculate pad life percentage for each wheel. this would also help you identify uneven wear.

  10. #1690
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    Re: What did you do to your car today?

    Quote Originally Posted by OffThaHorseCEO View Post
    obviously the brake caliper travels more when the pads are too thin,
    Not so. As pads wear down the caliper gradually 'compresses' to compensate for the wear: the caliper piston does NOT ever travel more than a few thousandths of an inch - it ever so gradually moves out in its caliper cylinder bore and automatically compensates for pad wear - pedal travel - which is why the pistons (pucks) must be compressed back into their cylinders at a pad change. The caliper piston is one-sided, part of a mechanical-hydraulic system, so pad tension is equally transmitted to both sides of the caliper (both pads) if the caliper is mechanically operating as designed.

    The pad wear sensor opens a series circuit which trips the message. A pad wear sensor is for Granny and those who do not regularly check their vehicle systems for proper level, wear, tension, and function. All things being equal, the wear spring fingers should begin to make horrible noises BEFORE the wear sensor breaks and trips the message.

    The new EBC Redstuff pads that I just put on the STS have the spring fingers as well as sensor cutouts. The original pads that came off at 56,000 miles were less than 50% worn and the sensors weren't the least bit worn - looked brand new.

  11. #1691
    OffThaHorseCEO is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: What did you do to your car today?

    well smack me around and call me stupid then

    in that case, couldnt a caliper be designed with a monitor on the piston to monitor beginning position, travel, and ending position? set a maximum recommended travel distance and when the piston reaches that distance it trips the warning

    the warning could be made to trip BEFORE the wear indicators on the pad go off.

    you cant always hear the brake pads squealin with the windows up. from what ive noticed people pay more attention to idiot lights or warnings than they do to weird noises comin from their car

  12. #1692
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    Re: What did you do to your car today?

    Darn trouble is, the rotors get thinner, too. A set of pads or two and a rotor skim cut and it will be thinner than DOT regulations allow for continued service, so you would need to factor that into the wear equation.

    Wearing out a sensor circuit to trip a message IS sort of primitive............

    Not arguing the different sensor tripping possibilities - but a switch or contacts is always susceptible to "bridging" or short circuit - those pads and semi-metallic brake pads throw off a very electrically conductive dust which would rapidly short circuit an open switch. That sort of precludes using the spring fingers for a contact point - the dust would short the metal finger to the pad backing plate in short order.

    Every driver uses brakes differently, so pure mileage won't work, either.

    You're dead right about people ignoring weird car noises..............If it doesn't sound like the day you drove it off the showroom floor, something's wrong.

  13. #1693
    gdwriter's Avatar
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    Re: What did you do to your car today?

    For the record, I knew the pads and rotors needed to be replaced; it was a matter of scheduling. I just found it interesting that I started seeing the notice two days before the service was scheduled.

  14. #1694
    OffThaHorseCEO is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: What did you do to your car today?

    i wasnt talkin about you, just justifying the idea of a sensor or method for warning the owner other than the squeal/screech

  15. #1695
    gdwriter's Avatar
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    Re: What did you do to your car today?

    Oh, I wasn't taking it personally. I just didn't want anybody to think I didn't pay attention to properly maintaining my car. One reason my cars have been reliable for the most part is that I do take care of them.

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