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Community Lounge, Introductions and General Discussion Discussion, The EPA, cars, and E15 in General Discussion; Originally Posted by SDCaddyLacky Free Market Capitalism crushed our economy, if it wasn't for all the bailouts, TOO BIG TO ...
  1. #31
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    Re: The EPA, cars, and E15

    Quote Originally Posted by SDCaddyLacky View Post
    Free Market Capitalism crushed our economy, if it wasn't for all the bailouts, TOO BIG TO FAIL CORP being saved from going under, this nation would be in a real depression at the moment under Capitalistic rules. I think people have forgotten about this.
    I totally agree with this, 2008 was a repeat of 1929 IMO. Except that the U.S. government and the International Monetary Fund intervened and prevented more than 15 critical bank collapses, along with bailing out the U.S. auto industry.

    If there had been no bailouts, I'm convinced over 30% of the U.S. banking industry would've closed doors, and the ENTIRE U.S. automobile industry would've declared bankruptcy and been shut down. With that signifciant shock to industry, it would not have suprised me if we lost 50% of our manufacturing jobs in this country if we didn't bail out the auto industry.

  2. #32
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    Re: The EPA, cars, and E15

    Quote Originally Posted by SDCaddyLacky View Post
    Free Market Capitalism crushed our economy,
    No.

    The regulatory environment that was supposed to protect us was manipulated by big players to allow them to dabble in risky investments (to play in a bubble created by government) while giving the public the false impression of a well-regulated, protected system.

    In this situation, a heavily regulated environment was far worse for the public, as it created a false safety net that caught everyone off guard and encouraged home ownership at high interest rates.

    This is typical of most regulations -- the big players make all the rules and manipulate legislators and so-called regulators while squeezing out smaller competitors. Likewise, the bailouts favored the largest and most corrupt banking institutions while several smaller local and regional banks continue to go out of business, hundreds each year! No one talks about them because the media doesn't care.


    As for 1929, you're revising history.


    The role of an economic slump is to correct inefficiencies and eliminate poorly run firms to allow for a more rapid and lasting recovery. By bailing out poorly run and corrupt firms, we've only perpetuated the original problem.

    Trade barriers and high interest rates set by the federal reserve were major contributors. This meant that American goods lacked export markets which would have allowed firms to recover (a stupid move intended to save American jobs only ended up killing them), and the money supply was unusually low due to foolishly high interest rates. Of course, these same monetary policies can also create bubbles like those seen in housing, which, once they burst, can leave massive holes and bring other industries down with it (like the auto sector).

    Our current fiscal policy is also dangerous, but we can debate Keyensian theory after I've walked the dog.

  3. #33
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    Re: The EPA, cars, and E15

    Quote Originally Posted by Jesda View Post
    No.

    The regulatory environment that was supposed to protect us was manipulated by big players to allow them to dabble in risky investments (to play in a bubble created by government) while giving the public the false impression of a well-regulated, protected system.

    In this situation, a heavily regulated environment was far worse for the public, as it created a false safety net that caught everyone off guard and encouraged home ownership at high interest rates.

    This is typical of most regulations -- the big players make all the rules and manipulate legislators and so-called regulators while squeezing out smaller competitors. Likewise, the bailouts favored the largest and most corrupt banking institutions while several smaller local and regional banks continue to go out of business, hundreds each year! No one talks about them because the media doesn't care.


    As for 1929, you're revising history.


    The role of an economic slump is to correct inefficiencies and eliminate poorly run firms to allow for a more rapid and lasting recovery. By bailing out poorly run and corrupt firms, we've only perpetuated the original problem.

    Trade barriers and high interest rates set by the federal reserve were major contributors. This meant that American goods lacked export markets which would have allowed firms to recover (a stupid move intended to save American jobs only ended up killing them), and the money supply was unusually low due to foolishly high interest rates. Of course, these same monetary policies can also create bubbles like those seen in housing, which, once they burst, can leave massive holes and bring other industries down with it (like the auto sector).

    Our current fiscal policy is also dangerous, but we can debate Keyensian theory after I've walked the dog.
    I didn't realize that you did skateboard tricks.
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  4. #34
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    Re: The EPA, cars, and E15

    My worthless knees do not permit skateboarding of any kind.

  5. #35
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    Re: The EPA, cars, and E15

    Quote Originally Posted by SDCaddyLacky View Post
    Free Market Capitalism crushed our economy, if it wasn't for all the bailouts, TOO BIG TO FAIL CORP being saved from going under, this nation would be in a real depression at the moment under Capitalistic rules. I think people have forgotten about this.
    .
    Free market Capitalism did not crush the economy, IT WAS THE HOUSING BUBBLE created by the Clinton administration in the early 90's freeing regulations enabling risky lending practices & allowing the grouping & mixing of good & bad loans to be sold traded as a hot potato with with a deceptive credit rating. 20 yrs. of the Washington sticking their heads in the sand to allow anyone with a heartbeat to over borrow.

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    Re: The EPA, cars, and E15

    Erm... pardon me sir, how could the Clinton Administration do ANYTHING in the 80's?

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    Re: The EPA, cars, and E15

    Quote Originally Posted by Stingroo View Post
    Erm... pardon me sir, how could the Clinton Administration do ANYTHING in the 80's?
    90's

  8. #38
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    Re: The EPA, cars, and E15

    Just checking, 'cause you typed that out and I was like "Wait, what?"

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    Re: The EPA, cars, and E15

    Well, I don't think its fair to only blame President Clinton for the housing bubble. It was a combination of policies set in the 70s, policies set in the 90s, a lack of concern in the 2000s, interest rates that remained stupidly low even during times of aggressive growth and prosperity, and blind greed on the part of the private sector.

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    Re: The EPA, cars, and E15

    Quote Originally Posted by Jesda View Post
    Well, I don't think its fair to only blame President Clinton for the housing bubble. It was a combination of policies set in the 70s, policies set in the 90s, a lack of concern in the 2000s, interest rates that remained stupidly low even during times of aggressive growth and prosperity, and blind greed on the part of the private sector.
    the roots of the recent financial disaster, as Jesda says, go back to beginning of deregulation of the financial industry, which compounded the problem with each decade. Despite fair warning as to the problems these policies allowed (saving and loan debacle being the first real warning), Congress continued to repeal regulation and under fund the enforcement of existing regulation, and the unscrupulous got more and aggressive in their greed. Regulators fell asleep at the wheel and didn't motivate and support what Little staff they had. The greedy used the ignorant or just plain stupid to rake in the fee from lending to the unqualified and the "ivy league" educated manning the wheels of Wall Street abandoned their fiduciary roles and stuck it to unknowing, but greed driven institutional investors and their clients. A perfect storm of greed and corruption ensued and the American middle class will never again see the standard of living that their parents knew.

  11. #41
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    Re: The EPA, cars, and E15

    i have confidence that in the next year or 2 we will be getting ridden of these corn shit fuels
    im not sure why but i think next president will understand and now that the republicans are getting back in office at least it seems that way lately and i know the Ohio Governor has already mentioned that he is going to make it his best efforts to allow us to drill for oil in Ohio

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    Re: The EPA, cars, and E15

    Well, the corn lobby transcends party lines. President Bush was an advocate of ethanol as well.

    Ethanol can work if its sold without subsidies to local consumers, but once you start shipping it to the coasts by truck (it cannot be transported with pipes), it becomes quite silly.

  13. #43
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    Re: The EPA, cars, and E15

    I think bush was only intrested in it at first because the enviormentalist got off his ass when he showed intrest in it from what i could remember but i dont think another office will let it stay in just my apinion
    also come on ppl are starving in some areas and no they cant even aford corn

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    Re: The EPA, cars, and E15

    On top of that, we put high tariffs on sugar while subsidizing corn. Sugar-based ethanol yields more energy and requires less energy per acre to grow.

    And coca cola hasn't been the same without real sugar.

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    Re: The EPA, cars, and E15

    My '93 Roadmaster ran fine on most E10. There is a chain called QwikTrip around here and their gas caused that old 5.7 pushrod V8 to sound like a popcorn popper under nearly any but the lightest throttle.

    I can't remember any other car having that reaction (other than an old Rambler). I think it's normal sound was a ping!

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