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The Classic Cadillac Forum Discussion, New Owner Red 1970 Deville Convertible in Past Cadillac Vehicle Discussion; I would guess it was put on later. Likely due to the fact that the hood ornament slides into it ...
  1. #16
    talismandave's Avatar
    talismandave is offline Cadillac Owners Master
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    Re: New Owner Red 1970 Cadillac Deville Convertible

    I would guess it was put on later. Likely due to the fact that the hood ornament slides into it and would look odd(er?) without it. In 1970 they would have had the opposite problem. The flying lady of that style was not available yet (It is a recreation of an old design, remade to fit the 71-76 Cadillacs.), and no Cadillac hood ornament would work slide into that style molding.

    I could be wrong, if I am one of the experts here will set me straight. The car looks great and thanks for the updated photos.

    I don't know how you feel about the ornament, sorry, if you love it?? I have had them on my later 70s cars and am not anti them per se but just looks out of place IMO on the early body style.

  2. #17
    P.Katson is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: New Owner Red 1970 Cadillac Deville Convertible

    Since it sounds like you are learning so you should start from scratch and static time the engine. This way there is no guess work. When you get to the part of the procedure when you you do the dynamic timing with a timing light, make sure to follow the proper procedure and disconnect the appropriate vacuum hoses to the distributor. If I remember right the 70 has a thermal vacuum switch for "TCS" (transmission controlled spark). Many have been by-passed or disconnected over the years so this may not apply. When a 70 is tuned right, it is a relatively fast car for its weight. Here is a link to a good explanation and procedure for static timing.

    http://auto.howstuffworks.com/how-to...ime-engine.htm

  3. #18
    CADforce69 is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: New Owner Red 1970 Cadillac Deville Convertible

    Quote Originally Posted by klinebau View Post
    Is it possible that someone put the harmonic balancer on wrong and that the notch doesn't line up to TDC for cylinder 1?
    I would bet that. If the bogging problem came from timing, it would be corrected by advancing or delaying some degrees timing. I think the key is in carb adjustment.

    Quote Originally Posted by klinebau View Post
    Finally, here a few more recent pictures. Obviously the hood ornament is not original, but I am think the chrome trim down the hood might have been a dealer installed option.
    Thanks for the pics. The car looks sweet

  4. #19
    klinebau is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: New Owner Red 1970 Cadillac Deville Convertible

    Quote Originally Posted by talismandave View Post
    I don't know how you feel about the ornament, sorry, if you love it?? I have had them on my later 70s cars and am not anti them per se but just looks out of place IMO on the early body style.
    When I purchased the car, my plan was to remove it when it got repainted. Now I am not so sure... My wife loves it and I have to keep her happy in order to allow me time to work on it. In any case, I am not looking to get it repainted until next winter at the earliest so I have time to think about it.

    Quote Originally Posted by P.Katson View Post
    Since it sounds like you are learning so you should start from scratch and static time the engine. This way there is no guess work. When you get to the part of the procedure when you you do the dynamic timing with a timing light, make sure to follow the proper procedure and disconnect the appropriate vacuum hoses to the distributor. If I remember right the 70 has a thermal vacuum switch for "TCS" (transmission controlled spark). Many have been by-passed or disconnected over the years so this may not apply. When a 70 is tuned right, it is a relatively fast car for its weight. Here is a link to a good explanation and procedure for static timing.

    http://auto.howstuffworks.com/how-to...ime-engine.htm
    Thanks for the link... I am learning this beast. I've done a lot of work on cars, but this is my first with carb/distributor. The connections for the TCS and thermal switch are all disconnected. Only have hose from carb to dist for vacuum advance. I may look into hooking up some of that stuff later, but need to get it running a little better first. I don't know about the TCS as that seems a bit hokey.
    talismandave and talismandave like this.

  5. #20
    CADforce69 is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: New Owner Red 1970 Cadillac Deville Convertible

    Double post

  6. #21
    CADforce69 is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: New Owner Red 1970 Cadillac Deville Convertible

    Quote Originally Posted by klinebau View Post
    When I purchased the car, my plan was to remove it when it got repainted. Now I am not so sure... My wife loves it and I have to keep her happy in order to allow me time to work on it. In any case, I am not looking to get it repainted until next winter at the earliest so I have time to think about it.
    In that case, my advice is: Keep it; happy wife, happy life


    Quote Originally Posted by klinebau View Post
    The connections for the TCS and thermal switch are all disconnected. Only have hose from carb to dist for vacuum advance. I may look into hooking up some of that stuff later, but need to get it running a little better first.
    On most of these caddies this happens the same (mine too) but they run Ok. Maybe with them connected they run even better

  7. #22
    smelvis is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Hey Klinbeau,


    Congrats on your caddy! I'm loving my 70dv.

    2 things

    1 on my car idk how the rear glass is still hanging on. It's delaminated on top and bottom but you should be fine putting top up and down. The real danger is anything from the trunk getting in the well where the top is stowed.

    2 I don't think you can mis align the harmonic balancer. I believe it only fits on one way when you put it back on.

    Good luck!

  8. #23
    klinebau is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: New Owner Red 1970 Cadillac Deville Convertible

    I tried unsuccessfully to get the car started this evening. All I got was a loud backfire out the carb.

    I went through the procedure to static time the engine. I took out #1 spark plug and put my thumb over hole and bumped the starter a few times until I could tell it was on the compression stroke. I then turned the crank by hand and aligned the notch to 7.5 degrees BTDC. Using a test light, I rotated the dist until it just started to light up. I even backed up the crank about 45 degrees and turned it forward again to make sure the light comes on at 7.5 degrees BTDC.

    Quote Originally Posted by smelvis View Post
    I don't think you can mis align the harmonic balancer. I believe it only fits on one way when you put it back on.
    I looked through the service manual and it seems like the balancer can only go on one way. I can't be that far off on timing to be giving me a backfire, though. It just doesn't seem like the notch on the balancer is TDC for #1. Keep in mind that I wasn't able to see the notch using my timing light when the engine was running either. In retrospect, I should have tried the pickup on a different spark plug wire, but I am past that now.

    Not sure what my next move should be. Should I remove the harmonic balancer and see if it is installed correctly or damaged? This is frustrating... checking timing was supposed to be the easy part.

  9. #24
    smelvis is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    I would think if things were misaligned that badly

  10. #25
    smelvis is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    To continue my previous thought. But if things are off that much I would think there would be more severe indicators than a backfire. I'm no mechanic just my opinion though.

    When I was bringing daisy back to life after replacing some lifter rods and valve seals I tried to start her and didn't realize that the dist hold down was loose. Not sure why but it was. To get it started I had to do the old crank the engine while I moved the dist back and forth. I tried using the light prior to doing this but couldn't find the notch either. Eventually got her going by ear. Might be worth a shot.

    Before I had made repairs and adjustments in the carb, fuel and vac systems she ran best @ about 15btdc which is past the markings on the engine and twice factory specs. I never left it there but that's where she sounded good at first.

  11. #26
    klinebau is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: New Owner Red 1970 Cadillac Deville Convertible

    I checked a few things out at lunch. It looks like the mark on the balancer is 180 degrees off on the crank. I put a rod in the spark plug hole when the mark was at 0 degrees on the balancer and then rotated the crank manually about a half a turn. The rod came up and the approximate measurement from bottom to top is about 4". My measurements were far from precise, but that is pretty close to the stroke.

    Tonight, I will try to set the timing using either cylinder 6 or 7. I hope the balancer is off exactly 180 degrees as I will still be able to use the timing light.

  12. #27
    klinebau is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: New Owner Red 1970 Cadillac Deville Convertible

    Success! I finally got the vehicle started again this evening. I re-ordered the plugs based on my theory and it started right up. I was able to finally get the base timing set using plug #6. I still have the previous bogging issues, but I can now move on to checking the carburetor. As much as this issue was an amateur mistake, I needed to through this to prove that I can rely on the balancer for timing.

    I have two bogs that I am working on: one for off idle, the other when the speed hits 35 or 40 mph. At first I thought they were related, but now I suspect a fuel flow problem might be the cause of bog at higher speeds. It looks like the former owner kinked the fuel line (fuel pump to carb) pretty good when replacing the fuel pump. Do you think this kink would cause the car to cut out above 35mph? Can I cut and splice in a new section or should I get whole new line?

    I am still suspecting an accelerator pump problem or an idle mixture issue that is causing the off idle bog. I looked down in the carb while activating the throttle and can see fuel coming out of the pump ports, but I don't if its enough because I don't have a frame of reference. I think replacing all of the vacuum lines should probably be done also.

  13. #28
    Thygo is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: New Owner Red 1970 Cadillac Deville Convertible

    There is nothing like that feeling of accomplishment. My advice is that you are going down the right road. MY auto mechanics teacher in high school which was in 1970 was very firm about making sure the electrical side of the ignition system and timing had to be perfect prior to any other diagnosis. He always claimed that bad parts of the ignition systems could always mimick a mechanical problem. Good Luck!

  14. #29
    klinebau is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: New Owner Red 1970 Cadillac Deville Convertible

    I had some fairly large vacuum leaks and replaced a few hoses going into the carb and manifold. The car is running a lot better and I was able to get it up to speed and actually drive it for a few miles. I still have a bog off idle, but its not as bad as before. There are still some hoses I need to replace and I wasn't really able to tighten the brake booster line enough. The brake booster nipple out of the carb is 3/16" and the fitting on the check valve is 1/4". The former owner had a 3/8" hose and put a hose clamp on the carb end, but obviously that is not correct. I was able to order a 1/4" to 3/16" reducer for the carb and will be able to fix that problem when it arrives. I am also going to run all new vacuum hoses and hook them up the thermal vacuum solenoid (the thingy with three ports).

    There is a vacuum storage tank on the passenger wheel well that is not currently connected anywhere. I "think" this is supposed to be connected to the vacuum break on the carb, but my vacuum break unit only has one port on the carburetor. How important is this storage tank and what kind of problem could this cause?

    Once I get all of the vacuum lines fixed, I can finish all the carb adjustments and hopefully have a well running engine. It sure was a lot of fun driving the car over the weekend even though she probably doesn't have full power yet. I am going to have to address the steering and suspension soon as she is a little unstable at speed. My daughter named her Rosie and that is what she will be called from now on.

  15. #30
    P.Katson is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: New Owner Red 1970 Cadillac Deville Convertible

    Glad you got it running. You may want to check for timing chain stretch or if it jumped a tooth. If it is original, it needs replacement.

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