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Cadillac XTS Forum Discussion, The Cadillac XTS is NOT a DTS or STS replacement in Current Cadillac Vehicle Discussion; Originally Posted by thebigjimsho And if they went bankrupt with garbage instead of quality cars rolling out, they'd be where ...
  1. #46
    DG2's Avatar
    DG2
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    Quote Originally Posted by thebigjimsho

    And if they went bankrupt with garbage instead of quality cars rolling out, they'd be where they are now?

    GM went bankrupt because of decisions and cars of 15 years ago and you know it.
    GM got in their mess for many different reasons but the biggest was legacy costs if their outstanding pensions. Remember , there are more retired GM workers then active. Absolutely nothing wrong with taking care of your retired workers as promised. The problem also stems from a horrible in fair playing field where through the last 35-40 years American car companies had to compete and price with cars coming from countries with National healthcare and amazing retire benefits paid by those governments - Germany, Japan China. The US Govt should have enacted stricter trade laws decades ago to protect the American workers. They still don't and both parties at fault

    With that said GM also let the accountants not the designers and engineers steer the company in terms of what was coming out of Detroit. Thankfully that us fixed big time.
    Marco, Marco, texmaster and 1 others like this.

  2. #47
    texmaster is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: The Cadillac XTS is NOT a DTS or STS replacement

    Quote Originally Posted by hueterm View Post
    If my math is right while adding in my head while on an elliptical machine:

    DTS sold appx. 200000 units over its run.

    All 3 Escalades sold appx. 237K during those years.

    I'd say it was significant. And completely unrelated to how many CTS were sold -- considering how small they are.
    There you go using logic and facts again.

  3. #48
    texmaster is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: The Cadillac XTS is NOT a DTS or STS replacement

    Quote Originally Posted by thebigjimsho View Post
    And if they went bankrupt with garbage instead of quality cars rolling out, they'd be where they are now?

    GM went bankrupt because of decisions and cars of 15 years ago and you know it.
    Where is your evidence of this? Do you have any or should we treat this like your bs comment about the value of the DTS line to Cadillac over the past 10 years?

  4. #49
    texmaster is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: The Cadillac XTS is NOT a DTS or STS replacement

    Quote Originally Posted by DG2 View Post
    GM got in their mess for many different reasons but the biggest was legacy costs if their outstanding pensions. Remember , there are more retired GM workers then active. Absolutely nothing wrong with taking care of your retired workers as promised. The problem also stems from a horrible in fair playing field where through the last 35-40 years American car companies had to compete and price with cars coming from countries with National healthcare and amazing retire benefits paid by those governments - Germany, Japan China. The US Govt should have enacted stricter trade laws decades ago to protect the American workers. They still don't and both parties at fault

    With that said GM also let the accountants not the designers and engineers steer the company in terms of what was coming out of Detroit. Thankfully that us fixed big time.
    That's exactly right. Well said.

  5. #50
    ogbuehi is offline Cadillac Owners Enthusiast
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    I remember when I returned from Hawaii last year and I had to get a rental car while I waited for my Deville to get shipped back to the mainland. I was given a 2011 Buick lacrosse. This car had the interior of the new style CTS' they have now. Updated navigation display, heads up display, push button start etc... The exterior however was not that impressive. With this in mind, I was expecting the DTS I was about to purchase to blow me away with all the electronic toys inside. I guess I was wrong to assume that since Cadillac was supposed to be GM's flagship luxury line and the DTS was supposed to be the flagship of Cadillac, that my 2011 DTS would have at least what the lacrosse had interior wise. What I got with the DTS was a car that looked very beautiful and exuded a type of "power" when you saw it drive by but still required a physical key and had a dated gps system among many other things that were missing from a car of this caliber.

    What I came to realize is that GM cannot produce a Cadillac that has the beauty and design of the latest generation of Cadillacs (2011 CTS, DTS etc.) with the modern interior of the new generation CTS and Lacrosse and a powerful engine like the northstar or supercharged V6, as large as the DTS, all in a package that's in the price range of those in the looking to buy one (around $60k or less). If you want to buy a full sized luxury sedan Cadillac, you're going to have to sacrifice something.

    With the case of the XTS, it looks like exterior and engine suffered in order to get all the tech goodies inside I've always thought would be standard in every Cadillac. I'm definitely on the fence about whether I should trade my DTS for a new XTS. I definitely enjoy the commanding presence my DTS has, the bench seating, and the powerful northstar that can move those 2 tons of metal with ease. But every time I leave a rented CTS or SRX to get back into my DTS, I feel like I'm getting into a dinosaur. Lack of Bluetooth audio, HDD, and rear view backup camera among the above mentioned is kind of depressing when I thought I was getting the top of the line Cadillac has to offer. But it is what it is. I look forward to demoing the XTS to see how great the interior and CUE system are to see if it's worth the trade or if I will just wait another 12 years or so before I purchase another Cadillac. I'm content either way.

  6. #51
    Ormond is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: The Cadillac XTS is NOT a DTS or STS replacement

    Twelve years is a long wait. I drove by my Caddy dealership today (closed), and could not find a XTS. I walked the entire lot and peered into the showroom. Hopefully, soon.

  7. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by texmaster

    There you go using logic and facts again.
    It's a character flaw that I'm working on.
    NOW
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  8. #53
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    Re: The Cadillac XTS is NOT a DTS or STS replacement

    Quote Originally Posted by texmaster View Post
    Where is your evidence of this? Do you have any or should we treat this like your bs comment about the value of the DTS line to Cadillac over the past 10 years?
    Oh, I'm sorry. I must've hurt your feelings with the DTS comment. It's a nice dinosaur. Fortunately, Cadillac actually makes quality products like the SRX and CTS that allow the DTS to continue to be made. Oh, wait...

  9. #54
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    I think all the DTS owners will really like the new XTS. Just do not be intimated by the technology

    Once you learn in it will be a piece if cake to master.

  10. #55
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    Re: The Cadillac XTS is NOT a DTS or STS replacement

    Quote Originally Posted by thebigjimsho View Post
    And if they went bankrupt with garbage instead of quality cars rolling out, they'd be where they are now?

    GM went bankrupt because of decisions and cars of 15 years ago and you know it.

    An unexpected recession interrupted a rather clever turnaround plan developed by Rick Wagoner and the board. The plan, which required the cooperation fo the UAW to reduce long-term healthcare and pension costs, needed until 2010 to take effect.


    GM had impressively revamped its product portfolio for the new century, but it was burdened by legacy costs from the previous century.

  11. #56
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    Re: The Cadillac XTS is NOT a DTS or STS replacement

    Quote Originally Posted by thebigjimsho View Post
    Oh, I'm sorry. I must've hurt your feelings with the DTS comment. It's a nice dinosaur. Fortunately, Cadillac actually makes quality products like the SRX and CTS that allow the DTS to continue to be made. Oh, wait...
    If a FWD luxury cruiser wasn't essential to Cadillac's sales volume, the XTS would not have been developed.

    Think about it.

  12. #57
    ogbuehi is offline Cadillac Owners Enthusiast
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ormond View Post
    Twelve years is a long wait. I drove by my Caddy dealership today (closed), and could not find a XTS. I walked the entire lot and peered into the showroom. Hopefully, soon.
    It's how long I waited between my purchase of my Deville and my DTS. And I still use the Deville as a daily driver.

  13. #58
    jock82 is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: The Cadillac XTS is NOT a DTS or STS replacement

    Quote Originally Posted by ogbuehi View Post
    It's how long I waited between my purchase of my Deville and my DTS. And I still use the Deville as a daily driver.
    I waited 17 years between purchases. I have a 1994 Concours and I bought a DTS 2 years ago. Neither of them are a daily driver. I have an old pickup for that. I am not really enthused about this XTS at all. It is a
    cheap looking car. I hate that ugly roofline that melts into the trunk. All of those hump back cars (to me) are ugly. i would guess that most of that crap on it would be non-functional by the time I got ready to get another one. After 41 years I see this DTS as probably my last Cadillac. They seem to be going for the younger crow. I don't know what they are going to do when they get old and want a good riding comfortable care. You won't be young forever.

  14. #59
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    RippyPartsDept is offline Hi, I'm Chris - Please Read My Signature
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    Re: The Cadillac XTS is NOT a DTS or STS replacement

    are you saying that the XTS is not a "good riding comfortable car"?
    Chris Heath (RippyPartsDept) is an ASE Certified GM Parts Consultant at Rippy Automotive
    Rippy is a Cadillac, Hummer, Saturn & Saab dealership - family owned and operated in Wilmington, NC since 1946
    We offer all forum members discounts on parts and freight - e: parts@rippyautomotive.com ph: 800-RIPPY-22
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    Re: The Cadillac XTS is NOT a DTS or STS replacement

    Quote Originally Posted by RippyPartsDept View Post
    are you saying that the XTS is not a "good riding comfortable car"?
    Yeah, didn't you read the part where he test drove it?

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