2.55" pulley installed, dyno results inside - Page 2
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Cadillac STS-V Series Forum Discussion, 2.55" pulley installed, dyno results inside in Cadillac V-Series Forums; Originally Posted by TimmyC The 2.55 pulley is a 9.8% overdrive, almost exactly the same as the 10% overdrive you ...
  1. #16
    YoungBlood_STSV is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: 2.55" pulley installed, dyno results inside

    Quote Originally Posted by TimmyC View Post
    The 2.55 pulley is a 9.8% overdrive, almost exactly the same as the 10% overdrive you get from the D3 crank pulley. This equates to +1.5psi on a car with stock exhaust. Sounds good at first, right? The problem is the extra heat that the overdrive generates. The intercoolers built into these blowers is terrible. With the stock pulley IAT2s would go from 85-115 degrees during a pull. With the overdrive IAT2s go from 85-140 during a pull. The result is a big torque increase at the peak that fades to near zero by the end of the run. HP gain is similar; a gain that fades as the temps go up.
    Do you, or does anyone else know how these temperature jumps compare to a setup using D3's crank pulley? I am thinking of swapping out the pulley, but I do not want to deal with high heat issues or compromise daily drive-ability in any way. Second part to this is would the extra reservoir D3 offers help keeps things cool, or it is more an issue of actually moving coolant, not a lack of it?

  2. #17
    GoofyGuy is offline Awaiting Email Confirmation
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    Re: 2.55" pulley installed, dyno results inside

    Quote Originally Posted by NHRATA01 View Post
    Perhaps rig up a CO2 spraybar setup to cool the fins. Or do what some of the high hp racer do and design an enclosure one could pack with ice to chill the coolant. Unfortunately neither is real practical for daily driving use.

    Alternatively some port work on the heads could free up some flow and lower the boost pressure for a given flow rate. Of course then you've already dove into pulling apart the motor and probably could just throw on another blower.
    These would be very costly on a air/water setup. An Air/Air would be fine with a CO2 setup but it takes a huge amount of energy to cool a liquid intercooler with co2. As for the ice tank, once again on a highway that ice goes away fast.

    Now if the car is a drag only car, these would be great but a daily driver this would be more weight than they are worth to an already 2 ton car.

  3. #18
    jedhead is offline Cadillac Owners Enthusiast
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    Re: 2.55" pulley installed, dyno results inside

    I thought someone was looking into using the AC compressor and freon to further cool the fluid going into the intercooler. My friend has a supercharger tank that you can easily add ice. The ice goes away very fast. Usually he has ice on the supercharger and ice in the tank before he starts the car for a run on the strip. All the ice is gone and the water is hot at the end of the run.

    Bob

  4. #19
    nefarious35 is offline Awaiting Email Confirmation
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    Re: 2.55" pulley installed, dyno results inside

    Quote Originally Posted by YoungBlood_STSV View Post
    Do you, or does anyone else know how these temperature jumps compare to a setup using D3's crank pulley? I am thinking of swapping out the pulley, but I do not want to deal with high heat issues or compromise daily drive-ability in any way. Second part to this is would the extra reservoir D3 offers help keeps things cool, or it is more an issue of actually moving coolant, not a lack of it?
    any info on this? I know Jesse is working on one. Is this why the gains are limited to 30ish?

  5. #20
    TimmyC is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: 2.55" pulley installed, dyno results inside

    Quote Originally Posted by YoungBlood_STSV View Post
    Do you, or does anyone else know how these temperature jumps compare to a setup using D3's crank pulley? I am thinking of swapping out the pulley, but I do not want to deal with high heat issues or compromise daily drive-ability in any way. Second part to this is would the extra reservoir D3 offers help keeps things cool, or it is more an issue of actually moving coolant, not a lack of it?
    The D3 pulley exactly the same overdrive so the blower is going to spin exactly the same speed as mine. Heat generation will be the same.

    I don't have vendor status at this point but I'd be happy to get it and sell hubs and pullies for anyone who wants one. It'd be WAY cheaper than what is currently available. Easier to install too.

  6. #21
    TimmyC is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: 2.55" pulley installed, dyno results inside

    Quote Originally Posted by GoofyGuy View Post
    A full turbo setup would be a great setup on this engine, already designed for big power, and the VVT makes it perfect for getting the cams to move the air for a turbo. I already know the twin charging on the Cobalts, I had a Redline I ditched the superchager and went turbo before I got rid of it. I would love to see what you have in mind for a manifold if you remove the superchager all together. This would add a whole new level to this game. A monster intercooler, and still alc/meth is my preference. I was one of the first to turbo a 2.2 S-10 back in the day. That 125hp engine was a mean machine when you toss 12psi at it.

    Please keep us all in the loop, I for one once I figure out why this car cant maintain a Long Term Fuel Trim will dig in deeper and deeper. I like to only have 1 issue at a time. When you start to tinker and there are issues in the back ground its just harder to test and tune that way.
    Ah, cool to see another member with mod experience. Seems like we have a few here.

    I have an NA intake for an STS that I will install for the turbo swap. These are pretty easy to get. The throttle bodies are the same on a V and standard STS but will require an adapter. The adapter will not be a problem.

    We've got air to air intercoolers at ZZP good enough to preclude the need for meth. We see temps near ambient on cars that make 600hp at the tires. I'm going to go without meth first and see how it goes.

    I disabled LTFTs on my car. I've never been a fan.

  7. #22
    TimmyC is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: 2.55" pulley installed, dyno results inside

    Sorry for all the posts but I wanted to split them up into subjects.

    I logged some data on the way home today and got some encouraging info. It's 40 degrees outside here in MI and my IAT2s were around 70 when cruising. On a run from 47-80mph IAT2s went from 73-108 degrees in 3.0 seconds. I then let off and the temps went back down to 73 in 1:08, down to 80 degrees in 35 seconds. Pretty decent recovery, at least in this weather. I'm not sure how it would work in higher ambient conditions.

    The temps were much slower to recover on the dyno due to the obvious airflow differences over the heat exchanger. Quicker to heat up too.

    I'm going to leave the pulley on there and enjoy the new torque(the tires broke loose at 50mph on the above mentioned run). A good exhaust will return the high rpm power that I've lost.

  8. #23
    PGA2B's Avatar
    PGA2B is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: 2.55" pulley installed, dyno results inside

    Tim- You guys rent pulley pullers too don't you?

  9. #24
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    Re: 2.55" pulley installed, dyno results inside

    While I am certainly no expert (unlike the other members chatting here), I was specifically advised against just adding more capacity to the system, like the D3 reservoir. The position and flow rate of our intercooler pump simply can not handle the extra flow. I was told (the guy I keep referring to has 20 years of experience in modding engines, and has an AWESOME fully blown 55 Chevy) that unless you put in a much higher flowing pump along with the reservoir and/or heat exchanger, you will see NO increase in performance, and as TimmyC has found, a drop in HP due to excessive IATs. Its the pump, man. Can't handle it. Of course all other suggestions (meth, etc.) are definitely going to help.

    As for air flow, it would be nice to always have 45F temps for your ambient air, but I seriously doubt that will be the case for most (if not all) of us. But they are fun to drive at that temp!!

    Bob

  10. #25
    GoofyGuy is offline Awaiting Email Confirmation
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    Re: 2.55" pulley installed, dyno results inside

    Bob I havent dug in but usually you are correct in this matter. Im curious to what pump they are using on the STS-v as if its the same they used on the Redline/Cobalt SS its going to move a ton of liquid without issues. The capacity of the stock system was far beyond the need.

    Its already tapping 90 degrees here in Florida and Im sure its not getting any cooler.

    Also for the pulley, is that a south Florida pulley company? The snout on the blower has to be machined if Im correct so this wont be a shade tree job, this takes work that 99% of us will not have access to. This is why the crank pulley is the obvious choice for many, not because its better, but its easier to do for us part time grease monkeys.

  11. #26
    550HP STSV is offline Banned
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    Re: 2.55" pulley installed, dyno results inside

    Yes - a company was going to create a SuperChiller for our STS-V. I was going to drive down to florida to let them use my car as a test subject, but nothing ever came of it.

    http://www.ls1gto.com/forums/showthread.php?t=351128

    Timmy, how much did you pay for the pulley and where did you get it? And how did you turn the snout down?

  12. #27
    PGA2B's Avatar
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    Re: 2.55" pulley installed, dyno results inside

    Quote Originally Posted by 550HP STSV View Post
    Timmy, how much did you pay for the pulley and where did you get it? And how did you turn the snout down?
    He sells it through his work.

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    550HP STSV is offline Banned
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    Re: 2.55" pulley installed, dyno results inside

    Tim, can you post your email on here?

  14. #29
    CMNTMXR57 is offline Cadillac Owners Enthusiast
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    Re: 2.55" pulley installed, dyno results inside

    Tim, I'd be interested in the pulley. I already have the aftermarket exhaust in conjuction with the intake now.

    I was also monitoring my IAT2's last night, and couldn't get over, on a 39* evening, even under just brisk acceleration (Not WOT), that those IAT's were going up as quickly as they were. I have considered a meth injection system myself. Heck, even a water injection if worse comes to worse. I won't do nitrous.

    My question is, is the internal intercooler on this supercharger removable? Or is it all one piece to the lid? I know there are coolant ducts/tubes in that that lid, just never have taken one apart. Now I know someone will say, "If your IAT2's went up with it, imagine what they would without it". My thought on removing it is then running the exchanger similar to the GTP's that you mentioned earlier. Yea, I know space is limited under the STB (also mentioned), but it's just another thought. You take away the stock limitation, put a radiator style exchanger sandwhiched between, so you don't lose as much pressure, and you can maintain temps.

  15. #30
    TimmyC is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: 2.55" pulley installed, dyno results inside

    Quote Originally Posted by 550HP STSV View Post


    Timmy, how much did you pay for the pulley and where did you get it? And how did you turn the snout down?
    Quote Originally Posted by PGA2B View Post
    He sells it through his work.
    I just paid for Vendor status so I think I can talk about this stuff now.

    The pulley setup and the heat exchanger I have are basically ZZP parts, but they are revised to fit the STS-V and they are not available through ZZP.

    There are a couple different ways to do the pulley. You guys can install it or I can.

    Getting the stock pulley off is nearly impossible with the blower installed on the car. It is pressed on and the blower shaft is about even with the core support, making it extremely difficult to get a puller in there. The same problem exists with the installer. The easiest option is to lift the blower. It doesn't have to be removed, just lifted for clearance. It is very easy to lift the blower up, 20 minutes with no special tools. At that point you could either swap pullies or unbolt the snout and send it to me for the swap.

    For people who want to do the swap themselves, you can rent the snout cutter from me for $25 ($100 deposit, $75 returned on return of tool). A power steering pump pulley puller/installer will work to install the pulley. They are $20 at Harbor freight or Autozone. I have one that I can rent out for $5 ($20 deposit, same deal as the cutter). I am not sure if the puller ZZP sells will work on the small pullies on these. I used a 3 jaw unit I own, but it damaged the pulley so I don't know if anyone wants to use that. It's probably because I used it in the 2 jaw config though. I didn't know the snout had to be machined at that time and I was doing this with the blower still bolted down. I think a three jaw puller would be ok. We'll have to come up with something there.

    Anyone that isn't comfortable with all that can unbolt the snout and send it to me. I'll remove the stock pulley, machine the snout, install the hub, and bolt the pulley on.

    Price for just the pulley and hub is $199 plus rentals if desired.

    Price for pulley with installation by me is $329, return shipping and new supercharger oil included.

    I've also gotten questions about my heat exchanger. I can do those for $329. I weld STS-V brackets on them and include fittings, hose clamps, and enough hose to connect to the factory hard lines under the radiator.

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