2000 SLS No-Start
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Cadillac Seville / Cadillac Eldorado Forum Discussion, 2000 SLS No-Start in Past Cadillac Vehicle Discussion; The car was running pretty good and gradually slipped into this no-start situation. The DTC's included: P0300 - Random and ...
  1. #1
    Paul2020 is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    2000 SLS No-Start

    The car was running pretty good and gradually slipped into this no-start situation.

    The DTC's included:
    P0300 - Random and multiple cylinder misfire
    P0101 - MAF problem

    Some of the gradual symptoms included:

    When pushed accelerator to the floor, it started to rev up and then suddenly just lost all kinds of power, like maybe half of the cylinders were not firing.

    Then soon after it almost stranded me. It stalled and when trying to start it again, it would only run for a few seconds, and gradually ran longer as I kept pumping the gas pedal up and down.

    I suspected this may have been related to my trying to read error codes from the dashboard while driving it on that trip. Sitting there with it stalled, and after I thought about that, I cleared the PCM codes and it started, but ran very slowly, not over 14 MPH. I also noticed something strange. A digital speedometer speed appeared at the top middle of the dash, between the analog speedometer and the tach.

    After that, it would just not start! It fires somewhat but will not start. When I take the air resonator off the air duct going into the intake manifold, so it opens up that hole about three inch in diameter; and when I hold the accelerator to the floor while starting, it will start and run very slowly for a few seconds.

    I suspected possibly plugs, so I changed them. I have tested and swapped sensors including MAP, MAF, TPS. I am not positive that I have a good MAF sensor at this point however.

    Maybe it is the harness or connections to some of these sensors or maybe the connection to the PCM on the other end.

    There was an issue a month or so ago when I had a radiator hose break and soaked the PCM cover and some must have gotten into the PCM compartment. It ran very similar, losing a lot of power, as I recall until the coolant seemed to evaporate. It did run good after that however. I have recently put di-electric grease on both PCM connectors, but maybe there is still a bad connection somehow.

    Since it has stopped running I did try a different PCM also but it indicated that I needed a Scan Tool to make the crankshaft sensor relearn the data. It would not crank, it just gave an Error Code saying a new PCM had been put in and it required a re-learn. Since I didn't have a scan tool I went back to trying sensors. (A Cadillac expert told me that the re-learn procedure could not be done without a scan tool.)

    I suppose also, if one of the sensor connections is sloppy on the sensor that it may be causing a problem. I have tested power and ground to these sensors by removing the plug-in and probing to the pins.

    I am wondering if it might be a bad Ignition Control Module. I think that was one of the possibilities for the P0300 listed in the online shop manual. I did fix a non-starting van one time, in part by replacing the ICM.

    I'm leaning towards ignition or PCM at this point. Any input would be greatly appreciated!

    Thanks!

    Paul

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    curtc's Avatar
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    Re: 2000 Seville SLS No-Start

    You need an external scan tool to tell you EXACTLY which cylinders are misfiring, that will narrow down your search. If you've been messing around with the air intake make sure everything is sealed up tight and the MAF is clean.
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  4. #3
    MoistCabbage's Avatar
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    Loose ducting will trigger lean codes, not MAF codes. Check the connector.

    The reason a used PCM can't be installed without a TECH II has nothing to do with the CKPs. The PCM is programmed to the VIN of the vehicle it is first installed on. The VIN has to be rated before it will work in another vehicle.

  5. #4
    Paul2020 is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: 2000 Seville SLS No-Start

    Quote Originally Posted by curtc View Post
    You need an external scan tool to tell you EXACTLY which cylinders are misfiring, that will narrow down your search. If you've been messing around with the air intake make sure everything is sealed up tight and the MAF is clean.
    Thanks for the response!

    Actually, I have used an external as well as reading the PCM error codes from the dash. (Then I came across an article in this forum that explained how to use the buttons on the dash to do the same thing as an OBD II scan tool.) When I used the dash it gave me the same results as the external scan tool plus it gave ABS and many other systems diagnostics.

    I know what you are talking about. Error codes like P0303 for cylinder 3 misfire, for example. I've seen those before too. This P0300 though seems like a "different animal". The shop manual I used to study it gave many possible causes, including as I recall MAF, or ignition cassette.

    I checked for a good seal for the air intake and as far as I can tell, it has a good seal. The MAF is definitely clean. It is straight from the parts store.

    ----------

    Ok. I'll take another look at that connector.

    I could be wrong. I'm not an expert on this. Just from what I recall, it said it needed to re-learn data for the Crankshaft position sensor as well. I don't think it was saying that was the only thing it had to do. Maybe my source was bad, but I do recall it saying that there had to be a relearning process related to this sensor.

    What does it mean that the VIN has to be "rated"? Does it scan all systems for data for this new VIN # ?

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    Re: 2000 SLS No-Start

    Paul, You might consider this air intake duct modification to remove one leak source (the engine will NOT run correctly with ANY air leak at or after the MAF) as well as make your weekly underhood checks a lot easier.

    FWIW, Our engines have a rpm limiter in P or N - the engine will not rev over 4,000 rpm. Normal.

    A 2" PVC pipe cap from a hardware store, painted semi-gloss black and clamped into the resonator hole, makes things cleaner. Use a proper sized machine screw in place of the Torx rubber bolt that held the resonator ear.

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    Re: 2000 SLS No-Start


    When pushed accelerator to the floor, it started to rev up and then suddenly just lost all kinds of power, like maybe half of the cylinders were not firing.
    You bumped up against the rev limiter. GM programed it in to protect you from yourself.

    With a P0101 code, I'd replace the MAF sensor.

  8. #7
    Paul2020 is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: 2000 SLS No-Start

    Interesting.... This makes me wonder if there could be another possibility as to why it is not starting. Here is a list of the possibilities I am trying to narrow down currently.

    MAF Sensor - I have replaced it with no success, but I think, as indicated on my other post - MAF - that I must have gotten a bad one since the voltage is not changing.

    Air Leak - Will check further. Maybe go with the PVC butt plug. That looks like a great idea!

    Rev Limiter you mentioned - I wonder if this could be malfunctioning to the point that it just will not even start. When you say "in P or in N" - are you referring to DTC code prefixes (an also possibly "P" for PCM, "N" - ??).

    PCM pin connections

    MAP sensor connection - I have swapped out the MAP sensor and I have also noticed on another car that when I pulled off the MAP connector the engine would not start. (Not true with TPS and MAF). I wonder if I have a MAP bad wire, or bad connection either on sensor or possibly on PCM.

    Ignition - Possibly ICM or one of the cassete connections. Not sure if this would issue an error code or not.

  9. #8
    curtc's Avatar
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    Re: 2000 SLS No-Start

    The rev limiter will limit revs to about 4k in Park or Neutral, that's what the P and N are referring to.
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    Re: 2000 SLS No-Start

    So as to avoid a wild goose chase, have you verified your fuel pressure to rule out the fuel pump?

  11. #10
    Paul2020 is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: 2000 SLS No-Start

    Oh! Ok. No, I had a load on it out on the road when I pushed it to the floor.

    ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Ranger View Post
    So as to avoid a wild goose chase, have you verified your fuel pressure to rule out the fuel pump?
    Not yet. Mainly because I tried starter fluid straight into the intake manifold with the same results. (I was careful to try to keep it away from the MAF as much as possible). No significant firing.

    I have been hearing the fuel pump consistently.

    I guess I should probably double check with a gauge though.

  12. #11
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    Re: 2000 SLS No-Start

    I think if you tried starting fluid and got no response you can safely rule out the fuel pump.

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