AGHHH! my Seville just got rear ended! - Page 2
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Cadillac Seville / Cadillac Eldorado Forum Discussion, AGHHH! my Seville just got rear ended! in Past Cadillac Vehicle Discussion; The quarter panel cannot be "adjusted". It's part of the entire body side/roof stamping, and welded to every stamping around ...
  1. #16
    MoistCabbage's Avatar
    MoistCabbage is offline Cadillac Owners 10000+ Posts
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    The quarter panel cannot be "adjusted". It's part of the entire body side/roof stamping, and welded to every stamping around it (floor pan, trunk floor, rear bulkheads...). The only way it can move, is if everything else moves with it. IF no panels have to be replaced, repair is a tedious and expensive process.

    If your description of the damage is accurate, and the body shop is treating it as if it's an easy fix, the car WILL NOT be fixed correctly when done.

  2. #17
    basscatt's Avatar
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    Re: AGHHH! my seville just got rear ended!

    Quote Originally Posted by MoistCabbage View Post
    The quarter panel cannot be "adjusted". It's part of the entire body side/roof stamping, and welded to every stamping around it (floor pan, trunk floor, rear bulkheads...). The only way it can move, is if everything else moves with it. IF no panels have to be replaced, repair is a tedious and expensive process.

    I your description of the damage is accurate, and the body shop is treating it as if it's an easy fix, the car WILL NOT be fixed correctly when done.
    ------------------------

    and if it was my car - I would have hoped it WAS totaled - it will NEVER be the same -
    Tankboy40 likes this.

  3. #18
    the recluse is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: AGHHH! my seville just got rear ended!

    Quote Originally Posted by MoistCabbage View Post
    If your description of the damage is accurate, and the body shop is treating it as if it's an easy fix, the car WILL NOT be fixed correctly when done.
    Agreed, but it goes WAY beyond just not being fixed correctly. There are approximately 13 computers and umpteen million sensors in the car...all of these WILL start to fall apart/break down in the next few months after you get it and sign off on the damage being repaired.

    My '91 Eldorado was rear-ended like that...I talked the car insurance company out of totaling it...wished I hadn't...for the next 6 months to year after that I was chasing down one sensor after another just breaking and failing. It wasn't because of age either, I bought the car with 38,000 original miles, LOVED IT..had it 45 days when it got hit...HATED the car forever after that...

    If it has a topper it gets worse. I told my wife when I was getting it repainted to remove the top and ditch it...she said no...fast forward a few years and this Monday the car goes to the junkyard...why...because the roof line at the top of the A pillar had a split below the topper that couldn't be seen...now the entire roof over the passengers side is rotted to the point that water POURS in in a rainstorm...

    And here's what the car looks like:




  4. #19
    Jim964 is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: AGHHH! my seville just got rear ended!

    Take it for a second and third opinion/estimate at minimum three other shops, Do Not except a shoddy repair. Contact your insurance company and say you think the shop you have been sent to by other insurance is not repairing the issues to your satisfaction, ask them if (your insurance company) you can see one of their adjusters. Assume that they are trying to do as cheap a job as they can get away with, remember you are the victim, rear ended due to the negligence of one of there insurance policy holders. They can only get away with a shoddy workmanship if you allow it. The better business bureau is your friend in these situations as is your insurance company .

  5. #20
    MoistCabbage's Avatar
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    Considering the value of the car, it's either going to be a half a$$ job (maybe 3/4 a$$), or totaled.

  6. #21
    joshua2001STS is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: AGHHH! my seville just got rear ended!

    does anyone know what the tolerance for the unibody is, I have read that it is 4mm +/- 1mm, anything beyond this threshold would be considered out of tolerance. I cant seem to find any reference to these tolerances in my repair manuals, other than the trunk and hood gaps from back to front and side to side at 3mm +/- 1mm around entire perimeter of trunk lid or hood. the auto body shop doesn't seem even think putting the car on a measurement system is needed, but unless I am positive that the unibody is within tolerance there is no way I will sign off on the repair, the car now wobbles and make a thumping noise so I am very concerned that the unibody is damaged. thanks for all the good advise and sympathy for this beautiful car.

  7. #22
    basscatt's Avatar
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    Re: AGHHH! my seville just got rear ended!

    Quote Originally Posted by joshua2001STS View Post
    does anyone know what the tolerance for the unibody is, I have read that it is 4mm +/- 1mm, anything beyond this threshold would be considered out of tolerance. I cant seem to find any reference to these tolerances in my repair manuals, other than the trunk and hood gaps from back to front and side to side at 3mm +/- 1mm around entire perimeter of trunk lid or hood. the auto body shop doesn't seem even think putting the car on a measurement system is needed, but unless I am positive that the unibody is within tolerance there is no way I will sign off on the repair, the car now wobbles and make a thumping noise so I am very concerned that the unibody is damaged. thanks for all the good advise and sympathy for this beautiful car.
    -----------------------------
    I am very concerned that the unibody is damaged
    well - of course the unibody is "damaged" -
    that's why there are big gaps around the doors -

    the unibody is the entire shell of the car - something got bent/moved -

    USUALLY - from a rear-end hit -
    either the sail panels buckle outwards -
    or the floor of the trunk - under the spare tire - buckle upwards -
    or both -

    yes - a good bodyshop - with special unibody racks -
    can pull - stretch - twist - heat-up - and hammer it back - CLOSE to where it was -
    close-enough to get the doors pretty-well lined up -
    and close-enough it can't "obviously" be seen - with an untrained eye -
    or "felt" by the untrained hand -

    can they make it PERFECT? - no-way -

    crinkle up a piece of aluminum foil - and straighten it back out -
    with your very BEST efforts - you might get it CLOSE to perfect -
    but it will never be the same -
    ------------

    at BEST - it will look GOOD - maybe even VERY GOOD -
    but you will get "wind-noise" at highway speeds -
    noise you never had before -

    as I said in #17 - you would be better off if they total it -
    Tankboy40 likes this.

  8. #23
    joshua2001STS is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: AGHHH! my seville just got rear ended!

    update on my Seville. so after leaving my car at Hoffmantown collision repair in Albuquerque for almost two weeks I finally got the call that "all the work has been completed" so I drove down in my rental car, happy to be getting my STS back, unfortunately I could see from 10 feet away that Most of the damage looked like it had not been touched, body panels are still out of alignment, the trunk lid still is shifted so far to the left that it actually touches the left quarter panel. Then to add insult to injury(literally) there seems to be MORE DAMAGE now then when I took the car to be repaired, and worst of all the geico insurance adjuster called me a liar in front of my son( I almost lost it at that point, but kept my composer). this has been the one of the most stress inducing events that I have had to deal with in the last decade! I ended up calling the adjusters supervisor and provided photo evidence to back up my claims and show that the adjuster was acting unprofessionally and his assertion that I "lied" was FAR from accurate,thank god I document things obsessively, I was able to show that the repairs were careless and lacking in quality to say the least, I also proved that there was in fact new damage after the so-called repairs that did not exist before. I am so frustrated now, I had to leave the car there to give the shop a chance to repair the damage they caused and also to actually address the damage they where supposed to diagnose and repair in the first place. the shop has the proper machinery, a car-o-liner system, but they don't seem to have used it( they did give me a copy of a report, but the report did not include any of the required identifying information to show that it was in fact my car that the report was generated for, that was conveniently left blank but they assure me I can trust them, yeah RIGHT!). it looks grim for my Seville, the unibody is obviously damaged and actually looks worse now then I remember it looking initially after the accident, the trunk is no longer the proper shape and the trunk lid sticks out past the left quarter panel, the left rear door no longer aligns with the rest of the car body when closed, I am pretty sure this was caused by the right quarter panel shifting up and out to the right, the force caused the unibody to twist and seems pretty obvious. I am disgusted at the way geico's adjuster tried to ignore the real damage and then had the gall to insinuate I was being untruthful. I assume the car is totaled, I hate to say so and I guess I was fooling myself to think otherwise after the accident. right now it looks like the car will serve as a parts car for my next Seville if I can find another 2000-2004 Seville STS in excellent condition, but I haven't been able to locate one so far. negligent drivers SUCK!

  9. #24
    MoistCabbage's Avatar
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    Like I said, it was either going to be totaled, or get a half a$$ repair.

    The good part is, if the body shop said they perform all the necessary repairs, and the car isn't fixed correctly, your insurance company doesn't have to pay out for them to fix their mistakes. So they can't turn around now and total the car because more work is needed.

    That said, a good shop that's actually willing to work on a car, can fix some pretty extensive unibody damage to within +/- 1 or 2MM, butI highly doubt this shop is both willing and able.

  10. #25
    joshua2001STS is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: AGHHH! my seville just got rear ended!

    thanks cabbage, your probably correct about the willingness of the shop, I am interested to hear more about the insurance companies liability considering that they called me to pick up the car and claimed all damage was repaired, the most significant , and serious damage wasn't even touched, I have been taking copious notes and photos so I've got pretty good documentation of the events, the agent suddenly claims that my cars age is the cause of most of the damage(total B.S.) and his supervisor stated " maybe some significant damage was missed during the initial inspection"(more B.S.) my car is almost identical to the car you have as your profile picture, the crimson pearl red paint alone is probably 75% of the blue book so I'm trying to get used to the idea of not having my STS anymore, its not going to be easy, I searched for over a year to locate this STS and had to wade thru some pretty pathetic Cadillac that were abused and manhandled to find the quality of car I wanted so I'm pretty bumbed. if you've got a line on quality Cadillac Seville STS 2001-2004 for sale I would sure appreciate the info. Thanks for the frank and honest responses to my posts about the car, not always what I want to hear but it sure is good to have reliable and honest advise.

  11. #26
    dou1t2 is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: AGHHH! my seville just got rear ended!

    I don't know anything about this but this one sounds OK or better..........
    http://seattle.craigslist.org/sno/cto/4029189229.html

  12. #27
    MoistCabbage's Avatar
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    Re: AGHHH! my seville just got rear ended!

    Ohhh craigslist ads...

    "Upgraded Audio System, JVC Head, Bose Premium Amp, Nine Speakers" - Sooo basically a stock audio system with an after market HU that looks out of place, has less featires (no cassette player, no RDS, no DSP, doesn't function with driver memory...) and doesn't change sound.

    "Tune" - Really? Must know something we don't.

    "K&N Air and Oil Filter" - Which do nothing, other than the air filter flowing more dirt

    "Like New Fuel Economy" - What does that mean?

    "this Powertrain is good for 500,000 miles" - So is every Powertrain in every car ever made, if you maintain/repair it that long.

  13. #28
    Jim964 is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: AGHHH! my seville just got rear ended!

    Sorry to hear about your troubles, personally I prefer the 4th gen Seville's over the 5th and yes I have owned both. Having said that try looking on auto trader with unlimited distance, you may have to travel a ways but at least your selection will be a lot higher. I suggest looking in warmer states that don't salt there roads in winter. Also you might try out an sls which some one ordered with the upgrades, they have quite a bit more acceleration due to the gearing on them and are a lot of fun to drive.(Just my opinion I'm sure a million sts lovers will all denounce this post as heresy.)

  14. #29
    joshua2001STS is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: AGHHH! my seville just got rear ended!

    Quote Originally Posted by dou1t2 View Post
    I don't know anything about this but this one sounds OK or better..........
    http://seattle.craigslist.org/sno/cto/4029189229.html
    Ehh! I spent more than a year tracking down my STS down precisely because so many out there have been "upgraded to the max..." I am a stickler about originality, everything on my STS has the original vin tag down to the spare tire cover. As a young man I maintained a classic car collection for a gent in new Mexico, he gave me an incredible learning opportunity and I was blessed to be able to put my hands (and left foot on the accelerator) on some awesome cars from the mid to late 60's, I learned how important originality is, original equipment is quality equipment. I also developed an appreciation for the historical value of little things like that original jacking instruction decal on the spare tire cover (under the truck lid on the classics) or the fluids decal under the hood, so I am prepared to devote my time and resources to find another STS in pristine to excellent condition. I was lucky and found my current STS here in Albuquerque, we have a very dry climate and rust is hardly ever an issue, however dry rot is common so I look for cars that have been well cared for, (seals annually treated with sil grease, complete service history...) and garaged all their life. I have started looking with intent since the accident,(I am always looking to see what is out there) but haven't had much luck, but I'll keep a-lookin, I have even started to consider an Eldorado, seems like I might have a better chance at finding an excellent ETC than an excellent STS, but honestly I prefer the sedan over the coupe. I have my fingers crossed.

  15. #30
    MoistCabbage's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim964
    Also you might try out an sls which some one ordered with the upgrades, they have quite a bit more acceleration due to the gearing on them and are a lot of fun to drive.
    An SLS has a taller final drive ratio (3.11), geared towards fuel economy. An STS has a shorter final drive ratio (3.71), geared towards acceleration. An SLS slightly more low end torque, and might be ahead of an STS until 25/30 MPH, but the STS is faster from there until the speed limiter kicks in.

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