97 Seville Blown Head Gasket Under Dealer's Care

BSPECINC · #1 (**permalink**) 03-05-05, 06:29 PM

My 1997 Seville STS (with a NorthStar engine) has been at the dealer since Monday (5 days) initially brought in with a problem having to do with moisture under the driver's side floorboard. (I had been told by another dealer that the moisture may be caused by a bad Heater Core and explained this to the service technician.)

The service tech, told me the radiator needed flushing out, which they did, but while they were taking the car to the glass shop to further test the windshield/sunroof to see about the moisture leak, the add coolant light and check engine indicator came on. When the car got back to the dealer, it was found to have a blown head gasket. As the car was under the dealer's care during this entire time, and there is a chance that there may have been a mistake in the repair/service to the radiator (ie., not enough water/coolant mix put in the storage tank which caused the gasket to blow), am I responsible for the full repair and replacement of the head gasket and possible subsequent damage to the engine?

91TexasSeville · #2 (**permalink**) 03-06-05, 08:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BSPECINC

My 1997 Seville STS (with a NorthStar engine) has been at the dealer since Monday (5 days) initially brought in with a problem having to do with moisture under the driver's side floorboard. (I had been told by another dealer that the moisture may be caused by a bad Heater Core and explained this to the service technician.)

The service tech, told me the radiator needed flushing out, which they did, but while they were taking the car to the glass shop to further test the windshield/sunroof to see about the moisture leak, the add coolant light and check engine indicator came on. When the car got back to the dealer, it was found to have a blown head gasket. As the car was under the dealer's care during this entire time, and there is a chance that there may have been a mistake in the repair/service to the radiator (ie., not enough water/coolant mix put in the storage tank which caused the gasket to blow), am I responsible for the full repair and replacement of the head gasket and possible subsequent damage to the engine?

A reasonable and prudent owner does, or pays to perform, routine maintenance on his/her vehicle according to the factory recommended intervals. Since the problem is a direct result of improper maintenance, the cost for repair will likely go to the owner.

This does not mean that you (the owner) can not persuade the dealer to help with the cost of repair. It all depends on how flexible the dealer is willing to be.

BSPECINC · #3 (**permalink**) 03-06-05, 10:22 AM

I am on a service schedule with the dealer and they are the only dealer that services my car. The car had just been at the dealer a few months ago and I (and the dealer) have kept track of all the service records.

I also understand that the NorthStar engines retain enough coolant/water mix to travel 50 miles or so once the 'Add Coolant' light comes on. My theory is when they did the radiator flush, they neglected to add either the right mix or enough water/coolant.

91TexasSeville · #4 (**permalink**) 03-06-05, 11:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BSPECINC

I am on a service schedule with the dealer and they are the only dealer that services my car. The car had just been at the dealer a few months ago and I (and the dealer) have kept track of all the service records.

I also understand that the NorthStar engines retain enough coolant/water mix to travel 50 miles or so once the 'Add Coolant' light comes on. My theory is when they did the radiator flush, they neglected to add either the right mix or enough water/coolant.

As long as you have proof of proper maintenance. You are good. It seems the dealer did not get the mix right according to your post. OOPS for the dealer! Good for you!

Never mind the 50 miles, It will not help anyone at this point, if a head gasket is indeed bad.

Time for the dealer to provide you with a rental car if that is the case.

an01sts · #5 (**permalink**) 03-06-05, 08:18 PM

That's a tough piece of hide to chew on. You have to be able to prove that it was their negligence, and I don't think that you can. The head gasket could have blown on you; the only difference is that they had it when it blew. Let's say that a tire blew out while it was in their posession. No! They didn't run over anything; simply, the sidewall blew out, as can happen with tires. Could you hold them responsible for the tire blowing out? Same with the head gasket because I don't see how you can prove negligence on their part.

Trust me, I'm quite pro-consumer, so it's not like I'm siding with the dealer. Let's say that the failure was a direct result of their negilence. I don't think that there is anyway you can prove negligence on their part. Regardless to whether it was negligence or s/happens, you might luck out and the dealership is concerned enough about customer relations that they will eat it, but it's a pretty big chunk of meat to swallow in the name of customer relations.

91TexasSeville · #6 (**permalink**) 03-06-05, 08:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by an01sts

That's a tough piece of hide to chew on. You have to be able to prove that it was their negligence, and I don't think that you can. The head gasket could have blown on you; the only difference is that they had it when it blew. Let's say that a tire blew out while it was in their posession. No! They didn't run over anything; simply, the sidewall blew out, as can happen with tires. Could you hold them responsible for the tire blowing out? Same with the head gasket because I don't see how you can prove negligence on their part.

Trust me, I'm quite pro-consumer, so it's not like I'm siding with the dealer. Let's say that the failure was a direct result of their negilence. I don't think that there is anyway you can prove negligence on their part. Regardless to whether it was negligence or s/happens, you might luck out and the dealership is concerned enough about customer relations that they will eat it, but it's a pretty big chunk of meat to swallow in the name of customer relations.

I believe that BSPCINC already stated that the dealership found the coolant mix wrong. Since the owner stated that they (dealership) hold the service contract on the car, and are the exclusive provider of service, and the car had previous service just months prior, I don't find where the owner is negligent at all. Owner has done all that is reasonable and prudent.

This is a dealership insurance issue they need to deal with, the clause "while under the care of"

BSPECINC · #7 (**permalink**) 03-06-05, 09:32 PM

Thanks so much for your input...

I understand with the NorthStar engine, that even if all the coolant mix ran out of the reserve tank, there is enough coolant/water mix in each of the individual valves to run 50 miles or so, but if they don't have any water at all running through the system, the gaskets will blow and the engine will freeze up immediately, which is what I understood to have happened on Friday...

In my opinion, as they had just done the radiator flush, and there was a good chance that the water/coolant mix was insufficient (as the gasket blew and the engine froze up) I think the blown gasket was their fault and that will be my postion when I meet with the service manager at the dealership tomorrow.

Thanks again for your input...

iametarq · #8 (**permalink**) 03-07-05, 12:54 PM

I am definately going to be curious as to the outcome of this! please post back with the results!!

STS 310 · #9 (**permalink**) 03-07-05, 01:00 PM

The "Limp Home Mode" is just that. It doesnt mean that in this mode the engine is free from further engine problems ie. a blown HG. IT just means that it wont leave you stranded in the middle of no where.

With cell phone technology these days, who is really stranded in the middle 'no where" now a days.

**Ranger** · #10 (**permalink**) 03-08-05, 03:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BSPECINC

Thanks so much for your input...

I understand with the NorthStar engine, that even if all the coolant mix ran out of the reserve tank, there is enough coolant/water mix in each of the individual valves to run 50 miles or so, but if they don't have any water at all running through the system, the gaskets will blow and the engine will freeze up immediately, which is what I understood to have happened on Friday...

In my opinion, as they had just done the radiator flush, and there was a good chance that the water/coolant mix was insufficient (as the gasket blew and the engine froze up) I think the blown gasket was their fault and that will be my postion when I meet with the service manager at the dealership tomorrow.

Thanks again for your input...

You are misinterpreting the limp home mode. The engine is designed to go 50 miles with no coolant what so ever in the system. The gaskets may or may not be damaged (I have heard of both cases) but the engine will not freeze up immediately. An insufficient mix or even just plain water will take some time to have a detrimental effect on the head gaskets. Probably several years, less in the case of plain water.