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'97 Eldo - riding high after shock / strut replacement

22K views 124 replies 17 participants last post by  Eldorado99ETC 
#1 ·
Hi all,

Yesterday, I had a local shop install new shocks / struts on my 97 Eldo (base model / ESC). My car has the FE1 soft ride suspension. It does NOT have F45.

I had them install the Monroe 90011 suspension conversion kit in the front, and Monroe 40046 shocks in the rear.

When I picked the car up, I noticed it was riding higher that it had before. There is now an extra inch to two inches (closer to two inches) clearance between the top of the tires and the bottom of the wheel wells. This is occurring both in the front and rear. It looks really weird now. Also, the suspension is now quite hard. There's no element of "float" like there was before, although I'm not sure how much of that should be attributed to the new shocks.

Below is a pic of my car BEFORE the new shocks. The height looks "normal", yes? I'm having a bit of an issue transferring a pic of what it now looks like from my camera phone to my computer, but maybe I can do that later. In the meantime, imagine the below pic, but jacked up a few inches and all weird looking.

I pulled the codes and am not getting any. Any ideas on what might be wrong?

 
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#4 ·
That picture - Post #1 - car is definitely low in the rear.

If you think the new work is somewhat high, the only way to return your peace of mind is have the shop get the service manual for that car and perform ride height suspension checks. It's a very dedicated set of measurements with the car normalized - weight, gas, load, ELC operational, tire pressure.
 
#5 ·
ALL the basic weight of the car should be supported by the springs -
and you didn't change them - so the car should sit the same -

EXCEPT for the ELC system in the rear -

I agree with MC and Sub -
the rear looks to be sitting low in the original pic -
the new rear shocks might have corrected that -
 
#6 ·
bass, Your '03 SLS - on a level parking lot - do you sense a tad of front rake or is the car "dead flat" ???

I just (an hour ago) pulled up alongside a 2003 STS - at AMJ Auto Repair here - and both cars seem to have a tad of "rake" - we both agreed on the observation.
 
#7 ·
Below are some "äfter" pics from today. I dunno. Maybe it's just me? The front especially looks awfully high though. There's 4 inches between the top of the tire and the bottom of the well in the front, and 3 inches for the same in the rear.

What do you guys think?

(car was on level ground, in both pics)


 
#11 ·
Ugh. So I should definitely get this addressed then?

I looked at the front springs. They definitely aren't new. I just brought this shop the aforementioned parts (new) and told them to install them, and that's it.
The sucky thing is that they are supposed to be reputable. My in-laws have been using them for decades without issue. But they're also a ways away so I had to take a day off work to get this done.

Can the front shocks be adjusted to make them sit right or would this be a tear down and re-install?
 
#12 ·
Been doing a bit of research.

Looks like this guy had the same issue with his Seville, but it was likely caused by wonky aftermarket struts and springs (I didn't replace my springs).

http://www.cadillacforums.com/forum.../258183-new-suncore-front-struts-sits-my.html

I was looking at the front strut assemblies and comparing them with a diagram, and it looks like everything has been installed correctly.

Could the problem be with the springs, in that the existing springs are too long for the new Monroe struts? TBH I don't know what struts / springs were on the car before. I thought they were OEM, but never checked.
 
#14 · (Edited)
I realize this is not an Eldorado, but would guess the visual appearance and ride height would be a similar part of the design of both cars - my STS has nowhere near 4" of tire/fender space in the front wheelwell.

Bob Ross needs a good ride height measurement job. The measurement points and height specs are in the GM manual or Alldata.

Springs control level ground normal weight ride height, not struts or shocks - and the passive Eldorado is a car that depends on the springs alone, not an active suspension system - except for rear ride height set by ELC in response to extra weight in the trunk or rear seat.

EDIT: Thought ....... Bob, park the car on a level surface - big parking lot - and walk 25 feet in front of the car. What is the attitude of the front wheels/tires ? Do they appear to be just about vertical, or do the tops of the tires seem to tilt out a tad ?? Same for the rear ............. camber may indicate excessive suspension height.
 
#20 ·
EDIT: Thought ....... Bob, park the car on a level surface - big parking lot - and walk 25 feet in front of the car. What is the attitude of the front wheels/tires ? Do they appear to be just about vertical, or do the tops of the tires seem to tilt out a tad ?? Same for the rear ............. camber may indicate excessive suspension height.
Done. Wheels appear vertical, front and rear.

Who made the replacement struts ? Old strut/new strut measurements ?
It's the Monroe 90011 kit. Plenty of people on here seem to have used that kit with success, so I don't think that's the issue.

Or you could go with taller wheels
:22s:
LOL. Could I also put a "22" emblem on the side? You know, so people know they are 22's? :cool:
 
#15 ·
you reused old springs. the spring mounting pad for front strut is fixed. or welded to strut body. the top/bottom of spring is almost flat. there really is no kink to it that would make spring sit any higher on strut. look at any pic of any front strut. for any car. its simple. strut, spring seat. shop sees car as is. replaces struts. its 3" higher now. hmm, looks ok to me. heck we used the old springs.
 
#16 ·
stoveguyy, You posted food for thought: "..... or welded to the strut body" - and if that's at the wrong height, so is the car's 'after' height.

Who made the replacement struts ? Old strut/new strut measurements ?
 
#21 ·
Is passive eldo strut same quality/ride as grand prix strut? Or impala? I assume the oem strut was typical GM parts bin stuff. But GM made 3 million. Rock auto sells 17 each yr. who makes the struts now? China, Korea? You say ride is stiff now. Too bad u can't find some nos delco struts. I assume dealers got rid of their stuff yrs ago
 
#24 ·
Below are a couple of recent side profile shots taken from slightly different perspectives. The gas tank is full and the trunk only has a full set of golf clubs loaded in it. The "rake" seems very slight to me but from different viewing angles (bottom pic) it does seem to be more apparent... :hmm:
Best,
Ron









----------

Here is the 96' with what I believe to be its original struts/shocks at 130K miles..




 
#27 ·
Thanks. I just saved a pic of your '02 to my phone so I can show the mechanic what it should look like when I take the car back in.

He sounded baffled when I called. Said the new struts that I brought were the correct ones and went in without issue and they did use the original springs. I've no idea either.

Is the front height adjustable at all, or is it fully dependent on the springs?
 
#30 ·
In the before picture the rear is definitely lower than it should be, looks like the car was riding on the springs alone with no ELC support at all.
The front looks about right (because the rear is a bit low you may be fooled to believe the front is high, but actually is normal).
In the after picture the rear is correct, but the front is definitely high.

Now think about it:
In the rear the shocks are next to the spring, so even if you have a slightly longer or shorter strut (think to a syringe) it will go in or out a bit to get to the height of the spring (the springs are the ONLY thing that dictate your reide height). Well the ETC assists the struts and assuming is operational and there are no leaks then the height sensor (you only have one) is the only thing that adjusts the height (but let’s not get there as your rear height is OK).
So considering the suspension geometry in the rear a slightly off dimension strut will work fine (sure if is longer or shorter will have the tendency to bottom out not being in the center of its travel in some extreme situations but that's about it).

Now the front struts on the other hand have a pocket welded on and that's where the spring sits on. So think about it, if the aftermarket strut spring pocket is welded in a different position in respect with the bottom mounting points of the strut, well then you have height issues.
Basically the height of the car (in the front) is still given by the spring, but the spring is now mounted on the strut and if the length of the strut from the spring pocket to the bottom mounting points is longer than on the original (OEM) strut then you just jacked up the front.
The shop has NO FAULT in this if they were not the ones purchasing (and recommending in the same time) the struts (there are no adjustments to be made). If they use the original springs in the original location then they are OK.
 
#33 · (Edited)
Now the front struts on the other hand have a pocket welded on and that's where the spring sits on. So think about it, if the aftermarket strut spring pocket is welded in a different position in respect with the bottom mounting points of the strut, well then you have height issues.
Basically the height of the car (in the front) is still given by the spring, but the spring is now mounted on the strut and if the length of the strut from the spring pocket to the bottom mounting points is longer than on the original (OEM) strut then you just jacked up the front.
The shop has NO FAULT in this if they were not the ones purchasing (and recommending in the same time) the struts (there are no adjustments to be made). If they use the original springs in the original location then they are OK.
Well, when I first contacted the shop, I asked the guy if I could bring the parts. He said I could, but they would not warrantee the parts and I'd have to deal with the manufacturer if anything went wrong with those. They would, however, warrantee the labor. So I guess it depends whether the front struts were installed incorrectly or not.

Like I said before, the front struts are the Monroe 90011 conversion kit. If they don't fit the car, that means Monroe's website is wrong, RockAuto is wrong, Amazon is wrong, pretty much every other auto parts shop is wrong, and a bunch of people on here are wrong. And if there is a spacing difference, then anyone who's used this strut kit before on a 97 Eldo (or any other car that the kit fits) as an OEM replacement and with original springs would have the same problem, yet I can't find any other complaint of this happening on here, or anywhere else on the web. I HAVE read a post where someone said their overall ride height was increased about 1'' after installing Monroes (F & R), and that would be fine for me, but the nose-high stance that my car currently finds itself in is unacceptable.

EDIT: I just got off the phone with the shop's head mechanic, and he said the new struts were fine. They compared with the old ones and were identical except the OEMs were gas charged while the Monroes were of a more basic (oil-filled ??) design (don't take that last part as gospel because I might be misquoting him).

Compare old strut with new. Side by side. How? Figure that out on your own
I would, but I don't have the old struts. The shop kept them. Don't know if they've still got them. I'll ask when I take the car in on monday.

EDIT: They don't have them anymore.
 
#31 ·
N*Caddy said:
The shop has NO FAULT in this if they were not the ones purchasing (and recommending in the same time) the struts (there are no adjustments to be made). If they use the original springs in the original location then they are OK.
Almost. If you service a vehicle, and something's not right when you're done, you figure out the problem, and contact the owner. Not just send it on its way.
 
#34 ·
I had a complete oem redo of the entire suspension on my ELDO 98 F1 system including springs and compressor. According to the Helms specs, the will be a downward slope(rake) to the front. With the new OEM springs installed, there is 2 1/2inches front and 2 3/4 inches rear gap between painted wheel well and top of tire. And that is not supposed to be adjustable. You can adjust the leveler in back to go up, but I think once you have the weight on the springs the height won't go down with out more weight and that will activate Leveler control
 
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