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Cadillac Seville / Cadillac Eldorado Forum Discussion, Car Will Not Start - 2001 STS in Past Cadillac Vehicle Discussion; So, at this point, what would be the best path to pursue knowing that there are no codes and the ...
  1. #31
    PDT14 is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    So, at this point, what would be the best path to pursue knowing that there are no codes and the car won't start? I would go and just replace the Camshaft and Crankshaft position sensors, but I have to watch spending. I don't have an oscilloscope as an option, so what would you guys suggest?

    I want to test the spark at this point, but I have the cassette coil on spark set up and testing plugs with that setup seems tricky. Thoughts?

  2. #32
    Aztec ETC ECS's Avatar
    Aztec ETC ECS is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: Car Will Not Start

    Did you try grounding the wires from post #13?

  3. #33
    PDT14 is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aztec ETC ECS
    Did you try grounding the wires from post #13?
    No. I tried to find the ground. I wasn't sure if what I was seeing was the ground for the coils or something else. Could I just attach alligator clips to the black and white wire to ground on each coil just to test?

  4. #34
    Aztec ETC ECS's Avatar
    Aztec ETC ECS is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: Car Will Not Start

    Quote Originally Posted by PDT14 View Post
    No. I tried to find the ground. I wasn't sure if what I was seeing was the ground for the coils or something else. Could I just attach alligator clips to the black and white wire to ground on each coil just to test?
    Yes.

  5. #35
    PDT14 is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Sorry for the long delay. Here's an update. I replaced all eight plugs and the car is starting again. The four plugs closest to the firewall were in bad shape. So now, I'm back to the car shutting down on me. When I first started the car and got it going, I let off the gas and it went right to about 650 rpm and stayed there. I thought I was home free until I turned it off and back on again and let off the gas and it went off. I purchased crankcase position sensors, but haven't installed them yet. My question is based on the symptoms listed throughout the thread, do you think installing the sensors will fix the problem?

  6. #36
    rodnok01's Avatar
    rodnok01 is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Still no codes present?

  7. #37
    98cadillac is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: Car Will Not Start

    You may have a dirty EGR valve which may be sticking open. This was the issue with my stalling problem in this thread: http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums...ermittent.html

    The EGR valve is very easy to remove and clean.

  8. #38
    PDT14 is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by rodnok01
    Still no codes present?
    Yes. Here are the current codes:

    ABS C1246 C Brake Lining Sensor Open Circuit
    PCM P0300 C Engine Misfire Detected
    RSS C0620 C Right Front Position Sensor Malfunction

    ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by basscatt
    just from my own personal observation -
    a misfire is most often caused by lack of spark -
    compared to lack of fuel -

    if that follows true in your case -
    you have been pumping raw gasoline into the cat converter -
    ever since you got that first P0300 code - "for quite some time"

    it is very possible - if not probable - that over time -
    the catalytic converter has clogged up -
    and THAT is causing the no-start condition -

    you can try unbolting the cat - and move it slightly out of the way -
    and see if it will start -
    Ok, so, I haven't unbolted the cat yet because I'm not thrilled about having to get under the car again. I did get the car to start by replacing all the plugs. Here is the question I have. I can get the car to start when it's cold. It starts a little rough and I have to give it some gas, but once I get it started it idles pretty good at around 650 rpm. I will let the car run until reaches operating temp, then I turn it off. When I turn it back on when it's warm, the car shuts down when I take my foot off the gas.

    So my question, now that the car starts, is do these symptoms point to the cat still, or the CKP sensors?

  9. #39
    Submariner409's Avatar
    Submariner409 is offline If it won't run, stick on fender vents
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    Re: Car Will Not Start

    I seriously doubt it's the CKP's. If you have had slowdown and idle stalls with no CKP codes - P 0385, P 0386, P 0335, P 0336 - then they should be OK. Also, you have not seen a CMP code - The CaMshaft Position sensor is the TDC reference to the PCM for ignition and injector trigger timing.

    Get into Northstar Performance (Engines) and Cadillac Tech Tips (Discussions) and find threads and How-to's on throttlebody and IAC cleaning. Same for EGR cleaning - but that would also set one or more codes.

    Double check every duct and clamp at or after the MAF in the intake air piping. That kidney-shaped resonator stuck in the top of the flex duct is a source of idle stalls - ANY air leak in that intake system and you got problems.

    Also, check the integrity of the PCV dirty air line that runs from the right (rear) cam cover to the center of the intake manifold tunnel, front (passenger) end. That is a possible massive vacuum leak........... no mixture codes, though, so pretty small chance........

    The brake pad wear sensors are sacrificial, in a series circuit: One wears through (on any wheel) and the message shows. Sensor replacement or jumping the two connector pins is the only cure. Remove and jumper the sensor(s) and you're back to the good ol' method of brake wear checking: sight and feel. Not done much any more. Too many bells and whistles to bother doing it right.

    RF position sensor - put the front on jackstands. Remove the RF wheel and check the strut electrical connector, its wiring, the sensor pigtail-to-body harness connector.

    Catalytic converter - www.easterncatalytic.com

    Just as a thought - our diagnostic onboard program will not indicate just which cylinder is misfiring - take the car to a large parts store chain and ask them to do a scan. Their scanners will tell you which cylinder(s) are misfiring.

  10. #40
    98cadillac is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: Car Will Not Start

    Quote Originally Posted by Submariner409 View Post
    ...Same for EGR cleaning - but that would also set one or more codes....
    Mine didn't when I had an issue with it.

  11. #41
    PDT14 is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    So, here's the latest with my 2001 STS:

    The car starts cold with a little gas, and idles a rough. (I still have a misfire code after changing all the plugs, so I'm assuming one of the coil packs is bad. Not sure how to tell which one.)

    Once operating temperature is reached, the car will stay on as long as I leave it (idling).

    If I turn the car off, then back on to let it idle, it shuts off. I have to give it gas to keep it going.

    As I'm giving the car gas, it starts overheating.

    I've got lots of white smoke coming out of the tailpipe. (When I changed the plugs, there was oil everywhere, so I'm assuming the white smoke is from the oil that's burning.)

    I also have a loss of power.

    I have a misfire code P0300 and a code for my brakes and a code to serve the suspension system.

    With all that being said, what are your thoughts?

  12. #42
    kaceyseldo's Avatar
    kaceyseldo is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    It might be piston rings. It the overheating could be a couple thing. There's a thread around here somewhere about checking the small hose connected to the side of your coolant reservoir. Basically, that hose should have a constant stream of coolant returning to the tank. It often becomes clogged causing difficulty moving the coolant. Stick a bucket underneath it and unplug to see the flow. If no flow, stick a metal coat hanger (that's what I used) to unclog it. A lot of oil in the cylinders can mean o rings. The overheating could be the return line. Any coolant leaks?



    I'm unsure about the other codes.

  13. #43
    Submariner409's Avatar
    Submariner409 is offline If it won't run, stick on fender vents
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    Re: Car Will Not Start

    White "smoke" is either coolant burning or normal cold weather warmup vapor. Just like all the other cars in front of you at a stoplight.

    Blue smoke is lube oil burning.
    Black smoke is rich fuel mixtures.

    The O-rings mentioned weep over time and allow oil into the spark plug well(s) in the head, not into the cylinders. Fairly common in hemi and semi-hemi engines - with the spark plug in the center of the combustion chamber. Murder to change. Live with the oil weep every 100,000 mile plug change.

    Oil in cylinder(s) is either stuck piston (oil control) rings or excessively worn valve stem seals - one or all 32 of them. An unholy, murderous, stinking mess to replace unless the engine is out of the car.

  14. #44
    kaceyseldo's Avatar
    kaceyseldo is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Yeah, I saw the cold warm up vapors and freaked out then felt stupid once. Lol

  15. #45
    PDT14 is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    On the overheat issue, my upper radiator hose is suspect at one of the clamps. I wouldn't think it's leaking at the rate that I have to replace the coolant. I don't see any leaks on the ground either. I'll be looking into it more tomorrow. I'll let you know what I find out.

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