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Cadillac Seville / Cadillac Eldorado Forum Discussion, Help me out guys - Looking at 1998 Eldorado in Past Cadillac Vehicle Discussion; Originally Posted by MoistCabbage This is a block test: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vgkMC-5Mtz8 You can "borrow" the test kit through the loan a ...
  1. #16
    Dillontheman is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: Help me out guys - Looking at 1998 Eldorado

    Quote Originally Posted by MoistCabbage View Post
    This is a block test:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vgkMC-5Mtz8

    You can "borrow" the test kit through the loan a tool program at most parts stores. All you actually have to purchase is the test fluid, ~$10.

    The test is best performed after a hard drive, or after an overheat.

    ANY change in fluid color indicates an HG issue.
    Seems simple enough.

  2. #17
    Submariner409's Avatar
    Submariner409 is offline If it won't run, chrome it
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    Re: Help me out guys - Looking at 1998 Eldorado

    Quote Originally Posted by Dillontheman View Post
    What temperature should the vehicle be around at idle, cruising, and highway speeds, respectively?
    The Northstar uses a thermostat set to begin at 188 and fully open at 206. There are two cooling fans controlled by several situations and sensors. With no A/C function set the fans go to SLOW at 224 and FAST at 236. With an A/C or DEFROST function set the fans run in SLOW all the time. Fans will never run above about 40 mph or so - they aren't needed.

    So a "normal" temperature at idle can be anything from a dead cold startup to 224 degrees. On the highway temp will sit at about 12 o'clock on the gauge (which is highly damped) so you'll have temps of 190 - 210. In heavy traffic, summer, no A/C on the temp will crawl to 224, fans go to SLOW, the engine cools to 213 and it starts all over again. With A/C or DEFROST on fans run all the time so temps will sit around 12 o'clock.

    The Eldorado never got the updated 180 degree sweep gauge after 2000 - it still used the obsolete 135 degree sweep and still had the "Premium fuel" note on the gas gauge (that's incorrect for 2000 and later). In my albums there is an annotated temp gauge - the tick marks still correspond to the Eldorado temp gauge ticks. Click my username, open the profile. Left column - 2 albums, 6 pages of Northstar and 2000+ parts and diagrams.

    FWIW, the ETC uses the VIN 9 300 hp engine and a 3.71:1 performance final drive. The ESC uses a VIN Y 275 hp engine with a 3.11:1 economy final drive. A VIN 9 car will give up 2 - 4 mpg to the VIN Y on the highway. In the city they're close - 12 to 16 city, 16 to 20 suburban, on the open interstate - 28 or so for the Y and 25 for the 9 in perfect tune and driven well. Speed vs. rpm tables (TCC engaged) in my albums.

  3. #18
    N*Caddy's Avatar
    N*Caddy is offline Cadillac Owners Master
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    Re: Help me out guys - Looking at 1998 Eldorado

    ETC vs ESC

    ETC is the more expensive full options (luxury and performance) model.
    ESC is the base model

    ESC most of the time has passive suspension, less wood grain, less options and the grille colored in silver plus the engine is 275hp, 300·ft w/3.11:1 final drive.
    ETC has always the active suspension, full stability system, full wood trim, is prone to have more options, the grille is colored in the car body color and the engine is 230hp, 295 lb·ft w/3.71:1 final drive.

    The ONLY difference between the 2 engines is the headers (exhaust valves) and in the transmission the final drive gear. Other than that powertrain wise the cars are identical.
    These cars did not had many options, most have everything with little extras to choose. Among these is the BOSE sound system with InDash CD slot (for '98 and up), 4 speakers with individual amplifier for each and a RIM (the module that does most of the sound processing). Base cars had the classic layout sound system (no InDash CD slot), where everything is in the HU (what most people call the stereo) and conventional speakers.
    Either one of the 2 sound system can be extended with a 12 Disk CD changer (same unit for both). The ESC being the economy model, most people ordering a ETC were on a budget thus not opting for very expensive extras (like the sound system) as a result BOSE sound system is not very common in ESC cars.
    The other bigger scope option was the Moonroof.
    There was a choice of rims and tires. The rims choice was brushed aluminum (standard) or chrome (same exact rims but chrome finish - as option). For tires there was the S of H speed rating tires (for ESC) and H or Z for ETC. Based on the tire choice the car top speed was limited to the tire rating. For the cars equipped with Z rated tires there is no speed limiter.
    The memory package (mirrors, seat) was optional (but very common) for the ESC and standard for the ETC.
    The other option was the Cell Phone package, not very popular with either of the ETC or ESC. This was option could be used as OnStar (analog). In ’00 the OnStar as stand alone system became an option (not too common).
    Home Link garage door opener was optional in both cars.
    At some point the compass/self-dimming mirror was an option, by ’98 I believe it became standard even in ESC.
    The Rainsense wipers were optional for ESC (but pretty popular).
    For the ’99 production year exclusively there was a very rare option available, massage seats. Only about 750 cars were ever made with this option.
    Still with seats, I believe for the southern cars the heated seats (at least in ESC) were optional. I have never seen northern cars (especially ETC) w/o Heated seats.
    Again about seats, the difference between ETC and ESC is the ETC had perforated leather inserts while ESC did not. Other than that the seats are identical.
    Wood wise, the ETC had wood inserts on the door panels while ETC did not, also ETC has wood trim around the shifter panel whereas ESC does not.
    For the older cars (prior to ’97) some of the standards were options or none at all. Generally ’95 (’96 to some extent) and older cars were quite different although look the same on the outside.

    That is pretty much it.

  4. #19
    Submariner409's Avatar
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    Re: Help me out guys - Looking at 1998 Eldorado

    Exhaust cams ...............

  5. #20
    98eldo32v's Avatar
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    Re: Help me out guys - Looking at 1998 Eldorado

    WOW,

    From what N*Caddy stated, my 650 ESC was well spent. The only thing I don't have is moonroof, rainsense, "9" motor, heated seats, on-star and cell phone package.

    I'm adding the wood steering wheel, wood shifter plate, wood ashtray, (TL4 painted grille). On the fence whether or not to go to the painted rear liscense lamp pocket.
    Tankboy40 and Tankboy40 like this.

  6. #21
    Lifer's Avatar
    Lifer is online now Cadillac Owners Enthusiast
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    Re: Help me out guys - Looking at 1998 Eldorado

    Quote Originally Posted by N*Caddy View Post
    ETC vs ESC

    ETC is the more expensive full options (luxury and performance) model.
    ESC is the base model

    ESC most of the time has passive suspension, less wood grain, less options and the grille colored in silver plus the engine is 275hp, 300·ft w/3.11:1 final drive.
    ETC has always the active suspension, full stability system, full wood trim, is prone to have more options, the grille is colored in the car body color and the engine is 230hp, 295 lb·ft w/3.71:1 final drive.

    The ONLY difference between the 2 engines is the headers (exhaust valves) and in the transmission the final drive gear. Other than that powertrain wise the cars are identical.
    These cars did not had many options, most have everything with little extras to choose. Among these is the BOSE sound system with InDash CD slot (for '98 and up), 4 speakers with individual amplifier for each and a RIM (the module that does most of the sound processing). Base cars had the classic layout sound system (no InDash CD slot), where everything is in the HU (what most people call the stereo) and conventional speakers.
    Either one of the 2 sound system can be extended with a 12 Disk CD changer (same unit for both). The ESC being the economy model, most people ordering a ETC were on a budget thus not opting for very expensive extras (like the sound system) as a result BOSE sound system is not very common in ESC cars.
    The other bigger scope option was the Moonroof.
    There was a choice of rims and tires. The rims choice was brushed aluminum (standard) or chrome (same exact rims but chrome finish - as option). For tires there was the S of H speed rating tires (for ESC) and H or Z for ETC. Based on the tire choice the car top speed was limited to the tire rating. For the cars equipped with Z rated tires there is no speed limiter.
    The memory package (mirrors, seat) was optional (but very common) for the ESC and standard for the ETC.
    The other option was the Cell Phone package, not very popular with either of the ETC or ESC. This was option could be used as OnStar (analog). In ’00 the OnStar as stand alone system became an option (not too common).
    Home Link garage door opener was optional in both cars.
    At some point the compass/self-dimming mirror was an option, by ’98 I believe it became standard even in ESC.
    The Rainsense wipers were optional for ESC (but pretty popular).
    For the ’99 production year exclusively there was a very rare option available, massage seats. Only about 750 cars were ever made with this option.
    Still with seats, I believe for the southern cars the heated seats (at least in ESC) were optional. I have never seen northern cars (especially ETC) w/o Heated seats.
    Again about seats, the difference between ETC and ESC is the ETC had perforated leather inserts while ESC did not. Other than that the seats are identical.
    Wood wise, the ETC had wood inserts on the door panels while ETC did not, also ETC has wood trim around the shifter panel whereas ESC does not.
    For the older cars (prior to ’97) some of the standards were options or none at all. Generally ’95 (’96 to some extent) and older cars were quite different although look the same on the outside.

    That is pretty much it.
    To start with,m the ETC has a 300 HP, 295 Ft lb torque. The big diff are the cams and the final drive ratio that is 3.71:1 The shocks are standard CRSSV ($$$) and the steering wheel is leather and wood. The ETC has a monochromatic (one color) paint sche,me where as the ESC has chrome (plastic) pieces on bumpers, side molding, and trunk and grill inserts. Otherwise it is the same car as far as specs.

  7. #22
    MoistCabbage's Avatar
    MoistCabbage is offline Cadillac Owners 10000+ Posts
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    Uh, I think N*Caddy pretty much covered it.

    The leather and wood steering wheel, BTW, was not standard on the ETC, it was a rare option.
    Tankboy40 and Tankboy40 like this.

  8. #23
    N*Caddy's Avatar
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    Re: Help me out guys - Looking at 1998 Eldorado

    Sorry did I said valves... I meant cams.

    Woodgrain steering was an ETC only option (at cost) available only after '02. This means, not many are available as the production numbers were drooping towards the end of the run.

    Eldorado are so rare these days in my area that this morning is the first time in quite some while when I saw one in traffic.

  9. #24
    vincentm's Avatar
    vincentm is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: Help me out guys - Looking at 1998 Eldorado

    Quote Originally Posted by N*Caddy View Post

    Eldorado are so rare these days in my area that this morning is the first time in quite some while when I saw one in traffic.

    There's quite a few near me, i know of at least 6 in a 10 mile radius here

  10. #25
    N*Caddy's Avatar
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    Re: Help me out guys - Looking at 1998 Eldorado

    I only know of 2 Eldorado locally (friends) and that's about it.
    If I see one every 2 months is unusual. In 7 years I have only seen 2 in wrecking yards.

  11. #26
    98eldo32v's Avatar
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    Re: Help me out guys - Looking at 1998 Eldorado

    LOL,

    I just looked in my beloved Eldo.......I HAVE heated seats........lol.

    Whoever orginially ordered this car , wanted everything but an ETC set up...........

  12. #27
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    Re: Help me out guys

    [QUOTE=Submariner409;3206212]The car is sitting there, idling. With the A/C off: The cooling fans don't come on until 224 degrees. The gauge will go almost to 5/8 when that happens. Normal.

    Dillontheman, The 1998 engine year is statistically one of the two worst for head gasket failure due to the head bolt threads in the cylinder block failing - and that's an extensive expensive repair.

    Whats the "other" year in which N* was statistically one of the 2 worst?

  13. #28
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    '99 was the worst, according to the unscientific poll on this site.

  14. #29
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    Re: Help me out guys - Looking at 1998 Eldorado

    Two words and im out: MONEY PIT
    Faded Crest and Faded Crest like this.

  15. #30
    Yaemish is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    I'm suspicious of the milage. That shifter looks too warn to have what is claimed.

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