NEWBIE...anyone in Illinois help???

[ben.gators]

Originally Posted by GailyBedight

here's a link to dealer's listing

http://continentaltoyota.com/Vehicle.aspx?v=2674019

Hum, seams to be a good and well kept car, I am neither an expert in Caddi nor able to judge from internet, but the only thing that I may say now the listed price is too much, start to negotiate from half of it, and try not to go higher than 5K!

[dakrri]

I offererd $7,000.00 they will do $7400.00. I think thats a fair price. They did stick some money/parts in it.

That's why i wish someone could check it out for us. I'm 140 miles north in Wisconsin.

Our local Mech said to check the Head Gasket, Transmission cooling lines and the Transmissin itself. Any truth to that??

Thanks

Dale

[Ranger]

The 4T80E is a pretty strong and reliable transmission.

The '97 - '99 engines where the most likely to have head gasket problems. Head bolts where lengthened in 2000 and they are no where near as much of a problem as they where, though that is not a guarantee.

[kdcing]

Dale and Kris,

I took a look at and test drove the 2000 Eldorado this evening. Overall, it appears to be a good looking vehicle...Most of the issues indicated below were not immediately obvious and I had to look hard to find them.....they are listed in no particular order:

1. Tires: Michelen HydroEdge on all 4 wheels. No dry rot. Alot of meat (probably 65%-75% tread remaining). Very good condition. From the name (HydroEdge), I'd assume that they would be good in the rain. From looking at the block type of tread pattern, they appear to be a tire designed for handling and I'd question their performance in Wisconsin snow. I do NOT have experience or know much about HydroEdge tires, so I could be way off on their performance in the snow.

2. Wheels: Very good condition. No corrosion.

3. There is NO warranty provided by the dealer (see HG information down below).

4. If you look at the driver's side and focus in on the gap between the top of the front/rear bumpers and the fender line above the bumpers, the gap looked larger than normal to me. The gap is smaller than my finger tip (I could not fit my finger tip into the gap, so the gap is probably 1/8" - 1/4"), but the gaps above the driver's side front/rear bumpers are definitely larger than the gaps on the passenger side. If you look at the Images 2 and 7 of 22 from the dealer's ad (attached in a post up above), you may be able to see the difference in the gap. The gaps on the passenger side is tight and looks normal. The gap issue initially was not obvious to me and required a detailed look to find it.

5. There is a sticker on the engine cover which indicates that Recall 00033 has been completed. Does anyone know what Recall 00033 fixed?

6. I shook the passenger-side rear tire/wheel side-to-side to feel for clicking and or movement. I did feel a slight movement....on my '93 Eldorado, the side-to-side movement indicates wear on the rear control arm bushing. I would NOT classify the movement as very bad (using my Eldo's very bad bushings as a comparison), however, the movement indicates that there is some wear. The correct repair on a '93 is expensive ($400-$500 per side?). I assume the 2000 Eldorado's have the same rear bushing issue (can anyone confirm the '00 Eldorado's are suseptible to rear control arm bushing wearout?) and suspect that the correct repair would be similar to my '93. I forgot to check the rear driver's side.

7. Steering Wheel and Gear Shifter: I do not recall any wear and definitely NO gummy leathery feel. They seemed to be in better-than-expected condition for a 9 year old car.

8. In the picture from the dealer's ad, the picture of the driver's seat shows what appears to be a crack in the side plastic.....the crack propogates directly upward from the rearmost of the 3 seat controls. I did not see the crack during the test drive...I just saw it now when looking at the dealer's pictures.

9. I checked the oil stick and the oil level was full (the information you provided earlier indicated that the dealer may have put in only 6 quarts during their oil change).

10. Six Codes showed before and after my test drive. All six codes were History:
P0327 (Knock Sensor Circuit Low Voltage)
B1552 (Keep Alive Memory Error) Disconnected Battery??
U1301 (Class 2 Short to Battery) Anyone???
U1000 (Class 2 Communication) I assume this is related to the Bus communication cable...Anyone? If it is the bus cable, and if it goes bad, this 1 would be a concern for me.
B2144 / B2146 (Left Front Mirror Vertical/Horizontal Circuit Low) Initially, the mirror did not respond to my control inputs (I had thought that it was due to my inexperience w/ the 2000 Eldo's controls, but now I question if it was my inexperience or if there actually was a problem w/ the driver's side mirror controls). After fumbling w/ the controls for 15-30 seconds, the mirror worked fine.

11. The battery is in the engine compartment, so there is no issue w/ the vent lines. (Ranger, the bat is at the front passenger side corner...between the passenger headlight and the coolant overflow reservoir).

12. A small portion of a trim piece immediately below the passenger headlight sticks out just a bit and is not tucked in under the headlight as it is on the driver's side. The portion of the trim is immediately next to the grill.

13. The interior is in very good condition overall. The driver's seat has minor creases in the bottom seat cushion and in the side bolster nearest the door. The seat's condition is consistent (probably better-than-expected) for a 9 year old vehicle. There are no tears in the seats.

14. On the side of the driver's side front bumper, there is an amber light....I believe it is the side marker, but could be the turn signal. The bottom of the light is not attached and can be pushed in about an inch w/ one's finger. Also, there are some very minor cracks (alligatoring?) in the white paint that is on the bumper immediately around the opening in the bumper for the amber light. The minor cracks propogate about a 1/2". Both, the loose light and cracks in the paint were not immediately obvious and were found only after detailed close inspection.

15. Windshield: Excellent condition. No cracks.

16. VIN: From plate seen thru the windshield (1G6ET1298YU178969)

17. Trunk Lid: On the top, rear corners of the trunk lid (i.e. the areas located immediately next to the tops of the left and right tailights), the trunk lid sits about a 1/2"-1" lower than the tops of the tailights. (This issue is not evident in the pictures from the dealer's ad). It could be that the trunklid's pulldown motor needs to be adjusted, but it could be an indicator of previous damage and repair.

18. Trunk lid: At the bottom left and right corners, the gap between the trunklid's bottom edge and the bumper's trim piece (which is located just below the trunklid's bottom edge) is larger on the driver's side when compared to the passenger side. This can be seen in the dealers pictures (compare the gap just below the "32V Northstar" Emblem vs. the "ETC" emblem.....Images 3, 18, and 19 of 22). This could be a poorly adusted trunklid or it could be an indicator of previous damage and repair.

19. If you look at the front of the rear bumper on the driver's side (i.e. located at the back of the rear wheelwell on the driver's side), the bumper's top front corner is not inline w/ the fender's curve line in the wheelwell....the bumper's top front corner is about 1/2" to 1" forward of the fender's curveline. If you look closely, this is evident in Image 2 of 22 in the dealer's ad. Previous damage?

20. The front brake rotors look new.

21. The rear driver's side brake rotor has minor/small wear ridges in it. Is it a safety issue?....definitely not. It does indicate that the rear driver's side brake pads may have been replaced a bit late (or still need to be replaced). I may be exagerating this issue because the ridges are relatively minor, however, this could indicate that the front brakes were obviously worn at trade-in and may be an indicator of why the dealer took on the expense of replacing the front brake rotors. This raised my eyebrow regarding previous maintenance on the cooling system, etc....again, I may be exagerating the issue. The rear passenger side brake rotor was not new, but looked fine. I could not see any of the brake pads and cannot comment on their condition.

Overall, the vehicle does look great and drove fine. The power of the Northstar was obvious, I just wish we could have jumped on I-55 and opened her up. My test drive was limited to 45mph. The steering seemed light, solid and straight (i.e. no side pull). The minor movement that I felt in the passenger-side rear wheel was not obvious thru the steering wheel during the test drive.

The 2 main issues that I see are....Headgaskets and possible Previous Damage.

Some of the Northstar's are known to have headgasket problems (actually block porosity problems, that cause headgasket failures). I know the porosity issue is known on '98 and '99 Northstars, and if it exists on '00, then No, I would not buy the car. (Anyone??....do HG issues exist on '00 N*'s?....or do a search of "HG" or "Headgaskets"). HG and block repairs are in the $3k-$5k range.

The gap/alignment issues (i.e trunklid, front bumper, rear bumper) could be indicators of previous body damage. The car's paint appears to be original and is very good condition. Additionally, there were no obvious signs of a repaint (its my understanding that the pearl-colored paint is very difficult to match)....so, my best guess is that the car was NOT involved in a major collision and that the misalignment in the trunklid is due to a misadjusted trunk pulldown motor and the gaps on the front and rear bumpers are due to minor bumper bumps in Chicago's streetside parking. A look at the frame and bumper areas under the car may provide better evidence if a major collision occurred. If you do a test drive, you may want to bring someone more experienced in body work. Nonetheless, the gaps and misalignments are there, and you'll have to decide if you can live with them.

If the HG and Previous Damage issues are worked thru, then the final issue...pricing.

$7,900 seems high......my gut (and a quick search of '00 Eldo's on CraigsList) tells me that $6k-$6.5k feels right for this car, however, I will bet that the dealer will hold out for (and will get) $7,400 for it.

[finerwoodworking]

Nice write up on the car.
It seems a little high to me as well. I got an 03 sts with 48k around this time last year for $7900. It came out of TX so there was no rust. I have had a few small things go wrong with it, but over all I have been happy. Not sure if those deals are still out there. I started shopping craigs list and ebay. I wanted as new of a car as I could get to get away from the HG issues. There was a dealership in Houston TX that bought a lot of Cadillacs, Fincher Motors. They were nice to work with and had good prices. I don't work or know these people either

[Ranger]

A head gasket issue is always a possibility, but the bolts where lengthened in 2000 and we have not seen anywhere near as many as previous years. I would not be concerned about a 2000+.

[dakrri]

Originally Posted by kdcing

Dale and Kris,

I took a look at and test drove the 2000 Eldorado this evening. Overall, it appears to be a good looking vehicle...Most of the issues indicated below were not immediately obvious and I had to look hard to find them.....they are listed in no particular order:

1. Tires: Michelen HydroEdge on all 4 wheels. No dry rot. Alot of meat (probably 65%-75% tread remaining). Very good condition. From the name (HydroEdge), I'd assume that they would be good in the rain. From looking at the block type of tread pattern, they appear to be a tire designed for handling and I'd question their performance in Wisconsin snow. I do NOT have experience or know much about HydroEdge tires, so I could be way off on their performance in the snow.

2. Wheels: Very good condition. No corrosion.

3. There is NO warranty provided by the dealer (see HG information down below).

4. If you look at the driver's side and focus in on the gap between the top of the front/rear bumpers and the fender line above the bumpers, the gap looked larger than normal to me. The gap is smaller than my finger tip (I could not fit my finger tip into the gap, so the gap is probably 1/8" - 1/4"), but the gaps above the driver's side front/rear bumpers are definitely larger than the gaps on the passenger side. If you look at the Images 2 and 7 of 22 from the dealer's ad (attached in a post up above), you may be able to see the difference in the gap. The gaps on the passenger side is tight and looks normal. The gap issue initially was not obvious to me and required a detailed look to find it.

5. There is a sticker on the engine cover which indicates that Recall 00033 has been completed. Does anyone know what Recall 00033 fixed?

6. I shook the passenger-side rear tire/wheel side-to-side to feel for clicking and or movement. I did feel a slight movement....on my '93 Eldorado, the side-to-side movement indicates wear on the rear control arm bushing. I would NOT classify the movement as very bad (using my Eldo's very bad bushings as a comparison), however, the movement indicates that there is some wear. The correct repair on a '93 is expensive ($400-$500 per side?). I assume the 2000 Eldorado's have the same rear bushing issue (can anyone confirm the '00 Eldorado's are suseptible to rear control arm bushing wearout?) and suspect that the correct repair would be similar to my '93. I forgot to check the rear driver's side.

7. Steering Wheel and Gear Shifter: I do not recall any wear and definitely NO gummy leathery feel. They seemed to be in better-than-expected condition for a 9 year old car.

8. In the picture from the dealer's ad, the picture of the driver's seat shows what appears to be a crack in the side plastic.....the crack propogates directly upward from the rearmost of the 3 seat controls. I did not see the crack during the test drive...I just saw it now when looking at the dealer's pictures.

9. I checked the oil stick and the oil level was full (the information you provided earlier indicated that the dealer may have put in only 6 quarts during their oil change).

10. Six Codes showed before and after my test drive. All six codes were History:
P0327 (Knock Sensor Circuit Low Voltage)
B1552 (Keep Alive Memory Error) Disconnected Battery??
U1301 (Class 2 Short to Battery) Anyone???
U1000 (Class 2 Communication) I assume this is related to the Bus communication cable...Anyone? If it is the bus cable, and if it goes bad, this 1 would be a concern for me.
B2144 / B2146 (Left Front Mirror Vertical/Horizontal Circuit Low) Initially, the mirror did not respond to my control inputs (I had thought that it was due to my inexperience w/ the 2000 Eldo's controls, but now I question if it was my inexperience or if there actually was a problem w/ the driver's side mirror controls). After fumbling w/ the controls for 15-30 seconds, the mirror worked fine.

11. The battery is in the engine compartment, so there is no issue w/ the vent lines. (Ranger, the bat is at the front passenger side corner...between the passenger headlight and the coolant overflow reservoir).

12. A small portion of a trim piece immediately below the passenger headlight sticks out just a bit and is not tucked in under the headlight as it is on the driver's side. The portion of the trim is immediately next to the grill.

13. The interior is in very good condition overall. The driver's seat has minor creases in the bottom seat cushion and in the side bolster nearest the door. The seat's condition is consistent (probably better-than-expected) for a 9 year old vehicle. There are no tears in the seats.

14. On the side of the driver's side front bumper, there is an amber light....I believe it is the side marker, but could be the turn signal. The bottom of the light is not attached and can be pushed in about an inch w/ one's finger. Also, there are some very minor cracks (alligatoring?) in the white paint that is on the bumper immediately around the opening in the bumper for the amber light. The minor cracks propogate about a 1/2". Both, the loose light and cracks in the paint were not immediately obvious and were found only after detailed close inspection.

15. Windshield: Excellent condition. No cracks.

16. VIN: From plate seen thru the windshield (1G6ET1298YU178969)

17. Trunk Lid: On the top, rear corners of the trunk lid (i.e. the areas located immediately next to the tops of the left and right tailights), the trunk lid sits about a 1/2"-1" lower than the tops of the tailights. (This issue is not evident in the pictures from the dealer's ad). It could be that the trunklid's pulldown motor needs to be adjusted, but it could be an indicator of previous damage and repair.

18. Trunk lid: At the bottom left and right corners, the gap between the trunklid's bottom edge and the bumper's trim piece (which is located just below the trunklid's bottom edge) is larger on the driver's side when compared to the passenger side. This can be seen in the dealers pictures (compare the gap just below the "32V Northstar" Emblem vs. the "ETC" emblem.....Images 3, 18, and 19 of 22). This could be a poorly adusted trunklid or it could be an indicator of previous damage and repair.

19. If you look at the front of the rear bumper on the driver's side (i.e. located at the back of the rear wheelwell on the driver's side), the bumper's top front corner is not inline w/ the fender's curve line in the wheelwell....the bumper's top front corner is about 1/2" to 1" forward of the fender's curveline. If you look closely, this is evident in Image 2 of 22 in the dealer's ad. Previous damage?

20. The front brake rotors look new.

21. The rear driver's side brake rotor has minor/small wear ridges in it. Is it a safety issue?....definitely not. It does indicate that the rear driver's side brake pads may have been replaced a bit late (or still need to be replaced). I may be exagerating this issue because the ridges are relatively minor, however, this could indicate that the front brakes were obviously worn at trade-in and may be an indicator of why the dealer took on the expense of replacing the front brake rotors. This raised my eyebrow regarding previous maintenance on the cooling system, etc....again, I may be exagerating the issue. The rear passenger side brake rotor was not new, but looked fine. I could not see any of the brake pads and cannot comment on their condition.

Overall, the vehicle does look great and drove fine. The power of the Northstar was obvious, I just wish we could have jumped on I-55 and opened her up. My test drive was limited to 45mph. The steering seemed light, solid and straight (i.e. no side pull). The minor movement that I felt in the passenger-side rear wheel was not obvious thru the steering wheel during the test drive.

The 2 main issues that I see are....Headgaskets and possible Previous Damage.

Some of the Northstar's are known to have headgasket problems (actually block porosity problems, that cause headgasket failures). I know the porosity issue is known on '98 and '99 Northstars, and if it exists on '00, then No, I would not buy the car. (Anyone??....do HG issues exist on '00 N*'s?....or do a search of "HG" or "Headgaskets"). HG and block repairs are in the $3k-$5k range.

The gap/alignment issues (i.e trunklid, front bumper, rear bumper) could be indicators of previous body damage. The car's paint appears to be original and is very good condition. Additionally, there were no obvious signs of a repaint (its my understanding that the pearl-colored paint is very difficult to match)....so, my best guess is that the car was NOT involved in a major collision and that the misalignment in the trunklid is due to a misadjusted trunk pulldown motor and the gaps on the front and rear bumpers are due to minor bumper bumps in Chicago's streetside parking. A look at the frame and bumper areas under the car may provide better evidence if a major collision occurred. If you do a test drive, you may want to bring someone more experienced in body work. Nonetheless, the gaps and misalignments are there, and you'll have to decide if you can live with them.

If the HG and Previous Damage issues are worked thru, then the final issue...pricing.

$7,900 seems high......my gut (and a quick search of '00 Eldo's on CraigsList) tells me that $6k-$6.5k feels right for this car, however, I will bet that the dealer will hold out for (and will get) $7,400 for it.

KDCING

First off…I just want to say “THANK YOU” so much from the both of us…and please pm me your address. When I went into the Cadillac Forum today, it was like opening a Christmas gift when I saw your appraisal of the car.

We will be buying the car Friday or Saturday this week and we are looking forward to “joining the Cadillac family”. The dealer did send us the CarFax and it is a one owner and the dealer believed it was never smoked in.

The salesman seemed (ha-hmm) honest enough and said he'd rate it an 8.5 all-around on a scale of 10. And being they are an established Toyota dealership, made us feel better too.

$7400.00 is fair to us, we are not rich$$, but we all need to make a living these days, and I imagine the overhead at a large dealership is high.

The car mechanics are a good group of guys/gals I want to keep them employeed and their families feed.

If anyone reads anything into the codes that KDCING found please share.

And if I can ever return the favor in the Wisconsin area, to any of you, please ask.

KDCING you are awesome….and thanks to Ranger too, and others, for your input

Dale and Kris

[Ranger]

Congrats on the upcoming new car.

[dakrri]

Originally Posted by Ranger

A head gasket issue is always a possibility, but the bolts where lengthened in 2000 and we have not seen anywhere near as many as previous years. I would not be concerned about a 2000+.

I spoke with our local mechanic and he too said that they reengineered the bolt length and he hasn’t seen any leakers.

We also have a 6.0 Ford Excursion Diesel and they have been known to have a leaky HC.

But if you flush the radiator system every two years, and keep up the service you should be good.

And even though it would be a $2500.00 repair on the Excursion, I love the truck and would fix it in a heartbeat. It’s cheaper than buying new….

Dale

[tateos]

Best of luck with the car!

[finerwoodworking]

Congrads on the new ride!!
The wife has a 01 Lexus LS 430 its a nice car, but I will always drive the Cadillac over it.

[dakrri]

Originally Posted by finerwoodworking

Congrads on the new ride!!
The wife has a 01 Lexus LS 430 its a nice car, but I will always drive the Cadillac over it.

That's too funny, we sold our Lexus 400GS because we wanted a front wheel drive for winter. A nice family from Kentuky bought it.

We both love cars and enjoy the weekends (summer) at Road America Race Track we live 6-7 miles away from it. I always like the body lines of the Eldo, and now we own one .....sa-weeeeeeeeeet.

I'll post some pics soon.

[kdcing]

Originally Posted by dakrri

We will be buying the car Friday or Saturday this week and we are looking forward to “joining the Cadillac family”. The dealer did send us the CarFax and it is a one owner and the dealer believed it was never smoked in.

.....And being they are an established Toyota dealership, made us feel better too.

About 5 years ago, I used to make monthly trips up to Green Bay......the weekday traffic in both Milwaukee and Chicago is insane...Saturday may provide a better travel day to pick up your new Eldo.

The dealership moved into a brand new building within the last 4-8 months. It is beautiful....a kids playroom, nice waiting area, flat screen TV, computer center. Hell, I wish my can (i.e. bathroom) was as nice as the one at the dealership. The dealership was at the old location forever...so it is established.

2 other things....it may be a good idea to get it up to higher speeds. Interstate I-55 is within a half mile of the dealership and could easily be included in the test drive. Also, I didn't touch any of the interior stuff (A/C, Stereo, heated seats, sunroof, power seats, etc.)........keep in mind, the car is without warranty.

Btw, you did me a favor....I've always wanted to drive a Northstar and this was a great opportunity to do so without the pressure of a salesperson ready to pounce. I have to admit, however, salesman "Bill" was doing a good job at trying to get me to buy it.

Enjoy the ride!

[dakrri]

The car looks great and drives well.....

HOWEVER, we got to Milwaukee, (Kris driving) filled the tank full of premium gas, got back on the interstate and the "Service Engine Soon" light came on!!

I'm not a happy camper right now...I called the dealership and of course they were closed, I left them a voicemail that I was putting a "Hold" on their check until we figure out how to fix this.

I did redo the gas cap hoping that would take care of the issue. It didn't.

Any ideas folks??

Thanks

D & K

[00 Deville]

Pull the codes per the sticky at the top of this forum called "How to pull codes" write down the codes and post them back on here. The code that turned the SES light on will start with the letter P then be followed by 4 numbers.

PS The 2000 N*'s will run fine on regular gas