’97 STS Catalytic converter

[N*Caddy]

Since almost one year I was kind of looking for a GM Cat. Well in the last weeks I find out that I really need one in the next 2-3 months or so. The honey cone inside is just starting to rattle, it might have been accelerated by the small section of pipe between the Cat and Silencer job I had done recently but eh…, I am not that upset since I was expecting it to come up at some point.
So here is the problem, it should have failed 6 months earlier because in January GM discontinued the part. The part I am looking for is 25314806, and suppose to be an OEM Catalytic converter for ’97 STS. All my local parts sources are exhausted and I only have one chance, my GM connection that got me the struts last year (I am waiting for a reply) The GM dealers I asked told me the same thing: part discontinued and is in no warehouse in Canada (not sure about states) – not to mention the price if it would have been available.
So I have the following question:
Is there ANY difference between the Catalytic converter from a ’97 STS and the one from a ’99 Eldorado?
I know in ’00 the heads were updated so maybe the ’00 and newer Cats are slightly different. Theoretically GM should still make the ‘99 parts until December.
Rockauto.com has only aftermarket (Walker and Eastern Catalytic) and I see that up to ‘99 Eldorado the parts are the same (at least the aftermarket ones). Also the Eastern Catalytic one is common between ‘97 and ‘98 Sevilles (not the Walker though).
Could it be that the Catalytic converter is the same between ‘97 and ‘98-’99 Sevilles?
Any other matched Deville (although I don’t think so), or even …I don’t know Aurora?

I should have started with this, I don’t even consider going aftermarket, I rather install a used Cat form another STS than going aftermarket.
Anybody has one brand new for sale or knows a place where I can get one in the following months?

[ewill3rd]

The problem you may run into for Seville is that usually to get the cat you have to buy the complete exhaust.
Devilles usually have a service part but for some reason all the Sevilles I have seen in recent history have been complete with the mufflers and everything.
That puts you in a pretty crummy place, especially with the parts disco.

I usually have good luck with Walker exhaust parts, not sure what they offer for a cat.
In the US it is a violation of EPA regulations (technically) to remove a cat from one car and put it on another. You essentially have to replace it with a certified aftermarket part or OE.
Not sure about Toronto.

[N*Caddy]

I would not mind getting the full exhaust system if that is what it takes, any way I am looking for mufflers too (in the next year or so).
I am not sure about the legal stuff but I would like to stay which in the limits though. But considering that some exhaust shop in here suggested me to use some tiny aftermarket Cat, in fact because is "such a large car" they suggested using 2 they would weld them together for me. Of course I left the shop laughing...
I really don't see what’s the difference between the Eldorado and Seville is (other than maybe the clamping).
But again I am looking for an OEM Cat if it comes attached with mufflers and all the plumbing I don't mind at all.
I sent a request for a Cat on Lindsay.
I relay don't want to monkey around with the exhaust, is perfect just the way it is.

[ewill3rd]

If there is one to be found Luke can find it.
PM him directly at Lindsay Cadillac Parts.

I think the primary difference between Seville and Eldo would be the length of the body.
The two-door should have a shorter wheel base, if it is a complete exhaust you'd certainly have an issue. If it is a service cat then it shouldn't matter.
I know in the US EPA says it has to be designed to work on the car it is to be installed on, again not sure on Canada law.
Putting two cats in is the most retarded thing I have heard today.. but it is early.


I know what you mean though, I would do the same thing.

[Caddyshack100]

Under Ontario Regulation 86/99 S 4 under the HTA of Ontario, A cat just has to be present and functioning in the manner that GM intended. Therefore as long as it is there and it does what it is supposed to, it does not matter where you get it from used or not.. So rest easy on that one.

[derone]

Forget all of the aftermarket cats but these....http://www.car-sound.com/02product/u...alCARB/460.asp
I'm using the 46006 now for 15k miles with no issues on my '00 STS.

[N*Caddy]

Oh yeah I been offered that one as the expensive top notch Cat (“but will cost you around $150”). Well I am not looking for a $150 Cat the car deserves better. I have no doubt in my mind this is a good part but I am pretty anal about putting aftermarket parts on the car (46006? I was under the impression is a 3’’ pipe, oh well…).
The car might be an ’97 but is a ‘97 that I spent last year alone over $13500, I want this car to be as GM as possible, I have changed lots of perfectly functional parts just because were getting old and I managed to find good deals on the replacements (I am always interested in new OEM parts as long as the price is right).
Earlier today I find out the same thing about the legal matter, yup! as long as I have one and it passes emissions test I am legal. So yeah I could have the Cat swapped for ~ $200 and I would be legal, but not in my books, I REALLY want a GM part on the car.
So the Cadillac dealership near my work place recently changed owner and apparently things are much different now. While 2-3 years ago I remember waiting for 15 minutes for the counter guy to finish a phone conversation only to be pretty rood with me, this time the person was very willing to help me. This is how things should be in a Cadillac dealership!
So he checked and yes, the ‘97-’98 Cat from an Eldorado is the same as the one from a ’97 STS. In ’99 is a new part number but the part is IDENTICAL (size wise) according to the diagram. I would assume the Cat was changed internally along with the heads and ignition. But surely I would trust a ’99 – ’02 GM Cat more than whatever aftermarket in this world.
So good news this one is still in production, or at least he manage to find 3 available in North America, one in Quebec, one in New York and one in California.
I am waiting for a reply from my GM connection and if no luck I guess I would have to go with one of these 3 available. The price is unbelievable, what ever comes to your mind first just double up and you are getting closer, but…I have few more months to go until I really gonna need one so still time to shop around a bit, at least I have an alternative now.
Ah did I mention I have a 10% discount to that GM dealership because of my work place?
I also have a good relation with a paint shop so I can buy parts on their behalf (different dealership) and I can also get their discount. At least I am saving close to $90.

[submariner409]

Is anything available on www.easterncatalytic.com ??

[N*Caddy]

Yeah they have a Eastern P#50282 is interestingly states is direct fit for:
1996-1999 Cadillac DeVille
1996-1999 Cadillac Eldorado
1996-2004 Cadillac Seville
I taught Deville was different (the front portion of the Cat pipe) but maybe I am wrong. Interesting is they state is good for ‘96-’04 Seville, can’t be right, ’98 is a different part number. The other one they have is a universal (“weld two in line” kind of a deal )
Any way my GM connection replied that the Catalytic converter I am looking for (that part number) does not exists in any GM warehouse listed in the database . So looks like the chances to get the exact GM Cat (new) are very slim to none (unless somebody has one siting in some forgotten corner - now is time to make some money).
Oh well, decision, decision:
1). ‘99-’02 OEM Eldorado (new)
2). ’97 STS OEM (used only if is absolutely pristine)
3. Direct fit aftermarket (Magnaflow I was recommended by GM including). Also will3rd recommended Walker so I have options. But God no that’s the very last option I would consider.

I do lean more towards no. 1) option, I know now the part has the same dimensions, so it will definitely fit. The problem is the compression rate was dropped in 2000, the ignition system was tweaked the heads (thus the valves) were changed slightly. So I am expecting to get a slightly different exhaust composition on the exhaust valves. So the big mystery is what was change to that Cat? I can’t see a dramatic change any way.
The more I thing the more I am leaning towards the OEM ‘99 and up.

[PontiacV8]

...hmm...what about "www.b u y g m partsworldwide.com" ( <--I can't get the right name or link in here...it is one word without spaces) or gmpartsdirect.com?


...I've done a search "Search by Part Number or Keyword" and "Select Make" with the GM# 25314806-number on the following link(s), and they show some results...

e.g.

http://www.gmpartsdirect.com/catalog/frameset.cfm

...maybe a chance to get the cat there...

(I know, it's not Canada...)

[ewill3rd]

Some of those places are GM dealers that took business to the web.
If there is no stock in any warehouse then they won't be able to get them either.

Slight mods to the engine really shouldn't effect converter efficiency unless you put a 8.0 liter in there.
The O2 sensors should keep it running properly for the cat to process the emissions.

[N*Caddy]

OK PontiacV8, thank you for the tip, I see my catalytic converter is posted with a price (almost reasonable I can say). I just sent them a message and now I am keeping my fingers crossed.
I sure hope so ewill3rd, because '99-'02 is the ONLY OEM Cat I can put my hands on.
This car deserves better…

[N*Caddy]

Today I received the mufflers, since the OEM ones are nowhere to be found (GM discontinued the parts) I had to go with the next best thing Walker direct fit. Since everybody tells me that Walker is the actual manufacturer for the OEM ones (hard to believe) well … I got them. They were dirty cheap at $71 a piece. The good news is they look EXACTLY like the OEM ones (tips and all except the stamped text is different and where GM is stamped on these is written QuiteFlow) the craftsmanship is little shabby, those welds are not very professional looking but other than that…is ok. The particular mufflers I got have few scratches and small dings here and there, they were pretty well packed but I guess before being packed are handled pretty careless (either the retailer or the factory). I am planing to give them 2-3 coats of heat resistant silver paint (just to put some more protection on that metal) and let’s see how they sound (sure hope not loud).
As for the catalytic converter well…I bough it yesterday, since the one for ’97 (Seville/Eldorado) was discontinued I went with the only OEM option available ’99 Eldorado. Well today they called me to inform me this part was also discontinued (GM seems to have something against me) but the good news they were able to locate another dealership that still has one (few weeks ago when I checked I found 3 available in North America, one in Canada and two in States). Looks like I am getting if not the last one of the last available.
The oxygen sensor arrived 2 days ago so…I am almost ready to rock at a cost … oh my gosh this catalytic converter was not cheap at all.
My catalytic converter is on its way out, I started the car few times while inside the shop last week (it was only started for 1 minute or so to be moved from one corner to another the whole week) and man that exhaust stinks! Actually I got a little scared because when I took the car from the shop Saturday night (battery was barely cranking since it was started so many times over the week for short periods) and the dreaded white(ish) thick smoke started to come out of the pipes…my heart stopped OH NO! I smelled that exhaust for minutes could not make up what smells like, it was not sweat but some how like boiling a very bad wine (like almost vinegar).
I pulled the purge line no bubbles just nice flow. So eventually I started another car available in the shop and I was like a dog smelling exhaust gases back and forth. Wells turned out that the other car had the same basic smell (just less- it was a small 4 cylinders so…). That smoke did not cleaned up until a good 2-3 miles of driving. Now is Ok, coolant level is the same but boy I got some shivers.

Oh by the way many thanks PontiacV8, I went with your tip!

[derone]

The eastern 'direct fit' catalytic will not work. Been there, done that. Sure it fits perfectly but its an example of a low efficiency core. It won't fix the 420 code. Luckly I can sell it and the original for scrap. The magnaflow CA ODB2 cat I use is one of the highest efficiency cats available. Period.

[N*Caddy]

Originally Posted by derone

The eastern 'direct fit' catalytic will not work. Been there, done that. Sure it fits perfectly but its an example of a low efficiency core. It won't fix the 420 code. Luckly I can sell it and the original for scrap. The magnaflow CA ODB2 cat I use is one of the highest efficiency cats available. Period.

Yeah, I was kind of leaning towards Magnaflow if the OEM was not available (I was very close though). I would have saved around $600 that way.