Are V2 owners and enthusiast being realistic about V3 pricing?
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  1. #1
    youknooow is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Are V2 owners and enthusiast being realistic about V3 pricing?

    It seems that there is a general consensus that Cadillac is not being realistic in their pricing strategy, essentially saying Cadillacís are overpriced. I personally disagree; technology, quality, and innovation are not cheap.
    More specifically, when I ďhearĒ V2 owners state that the V Sport is overpriced and subsequently the V3 will, Iím like are they serious? The V2 in all of its awesomeness lacks certain features that should be standard in 2014 and its class. I think this has resulted from its pricing strategy.
    When I read this article: http://www.caranddriver.com/comparis...omparison-test
    I thought ďCan the V3 be competitive w/out costing at least 90-95K?
    Thoughts?

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  3. #2
    GM-4-LIFE's Avatar
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    Re: Are V2 owners and enthusiast being realistic about V3 pricing?

    I don't care what the MSRP of the Cadillacs are that I want. What's the lease payment? As long as the lease payment is affordable enough, who cares what the MSRP of the car comes out to? The question should be: "Are new Cadillac MSRPs overpriced?" I would say yes! Does it matter if you are purchasing? YES! Does it matter if you are leasing? Not really.

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    youknooow is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    GM-4-LIFE,

    Elaborate, an example of an overpriced Caddy and leave vs purchase payment?

    ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by youknooow
    GM-4-LIFE, Elaborate, an example of an overpriced Caddy and leave vs purchase payment?
    lease

  5. #4
    cdog533's Avatar
    cdog533 is offline Cadillac Owners Enthusiast
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    Re: Are V2 owners and enthusiast being realistic about V3 pricing?

    They cost what they cost. Cars are expensive --- however, CTS-V's have always been less costly than the cars they compete with... I'm thinking that will continue.

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    GM-4-LIFE's Avatar
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    Re: Are V2 owners and enthusiast being realistic about V3 pricing?

    You can lease the new 2014 CTS V-Sport PREMIUM at an MSRP of: $70K way less than purchasing in terms of monthly payment and down payment.

    Just sayin, in terms of pricing, it's not just Cadillac that is overpriced. GM's pricing on everything has been insane lately. Have you looked at all the GM models lately? Their pricing is ridiculous!

    GM is shooting themselves in the foot with their overpriced cars, but what they will do is offer competitive leasing and 0% APR when they see the cars sitting on the lot while Mercedes, BMW, Audi and Lexus vehicles move at a brisk pace. Wait for the incentives. They are coming! They always do! GM always has a habit of doing that.

    After owning 31 new GM vehicles since 2000, I would say I have a lot of experience leasing GM vehicles and I have seen this all firsthand. I go through 3 new GM vehicles a year on average. Sometimes MORE!
    venomns likes this.

  7. #6
    youknooow is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Quote Originally Posted by cdog533
    They cost what they cost. Cars are expensive --- however, CTS-V's have always been less costly than the cars they compete with... I'm thinking that will continue.
    do you think 90-95K would be too much for a V3?

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    GM-4-LIFE's Avatar
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    Re: Are V2 owners and enthusiast being realistic about V3 pricing?

    That would be insane! Who would go for a V3 over an E63 or an M5? I hope GM isn't that stupid, but lately they have been doing stupid things with their high pricing.

  9. #8
    youknooow is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Quote Originally Posted by GM-4-LIFE
    You can lease the new 2014 CTS V-Sport PREMIUM at an MSRP of: $70K way less than purchasing in terms of monthly payment and down payment. Just sayin, in terms of pricing, it's not just Cadillac that is overpriced. GM's pricing on everything has been insane lately. Have you looked at all the GM models lately? Their pricing is ridiculous! GM is shooting themselves in the foot with their overpriced cars, but what they will do is offer competitive leasing and 0% APR when they see the cars sitting on the lot while Mercedes, BMW, Audi and Lexus vehicles move at a brisk pace. Wait for the incentives. They are coming! They always do! GM always has a habit of doing that. After owning 31 new GM vehicles since 2000, I would say I have a lot of experience leasing GM vehicles and I have seen this all firsthand. I go through 3 new GM vehicles a year on average. Sometimes MORE!

    How much less would it be to lease a V Sport vs buy it?

    Yes GM's cars are costly, but I'm asking you or whoever to give examples of why they feel they are over priced.

  10. #9
    GM-4-LIFE's Avatar
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    Re: Are V2 owners and enthusiast being realistic about V3 pricing?

    Quote Originally Posted by youknooow View Post
    How much less would it be to lease a V Sport vs buy it?

    Yes GM's cars are costly, but I'm asking you or whoever to give examples of why they feel they are over priced.
    To lease a CTS V-Sport is at least $700 per month with about $3K down. To get a $700 payment on the same car when purchasing it, you would have to put down at least $20K or more and it all depends on the interest rate you qualify for. Leasing makes it a lot easier to obtain the same car. Now leasing a CTS V-Sport PREMIUM is going to be in the mid $800 range with a monthly payment of over $1K per month if purchasing depending on how much money you want to put down and the interest rate.

    I think the next gen CTS-V (3rd gen) will start at $75K and top out at $85K with all options. The V2 starts at $65K and tops out at $75K with all options roughly.

  11. #10
    RaVeNous is offline Cadillac Owners Enthusiast
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    Re: Are V2 owners and enthusiast being realistic about V3 pricing?

    It has been argued at length.

    I fall on the side of the argument, that they are overpriced, and have to offer more for less. Most buyers will ALWAYS choose a BMW, Audi, or Mercedes over a Cadillac, when in the same price range and available features. Cadillac, regardless of their tech, will never have the prestige of a Bovarian competitor. For me, this is also part of the charm of buying American cars, particularly as in the case with the V2, is was priced competitively, be it still fairly expensive, but outperformed all of the competition for $10,000-$15,000 less. In 20089-2009, the interior, the tech package, etc was all on par with its competition at a lower price. This was the charm of the V2, that the V3 will never match. The 2014 CTS-V, is a 2008 platform, and tech package. Of course there have been major improvements with all the bells since then. It does however still compete in performance and driving experience (and the tech package really isnít bad in my opinion but whatever) with cars that cost 2x as much.

    The V3 is not going to blow away the competition. Itís not even going to match the competition on 0-60, ľ mile times or handling. Itís possible, particularly judging by how the new CTS vsport and Chevy SS is performing that this CTS V#3++ or whatever the F they call it is a beast around the track, and is maybe right up there with the S8, M5, M6, AMG 4 matic etc; however, it will not put the competition in ďcheckĒ like the V2 did. It is because of the V2, that these other makers brought the bar up so high. Without AWD, there is zero chance it will pull off low 3 second 0-60 times on street tires. Sure, maybe with its hp increase, new tech, launch control weight savings, it will be a beast on drag radials, and perhaps even more amazing with some minor bolt ons. This is meaningless to me because Iím not going to drive to work on racing tires.
    I realize 0-60 times are not everything, and itís certainly possible, that will some great handling and tuning the V3, though short of its competition on quickness, might really shine up top in the ľ, in trap speed, in passing power etc, which could also make its Nurburgring times yet again set another record. I just donít think it blow them away like they did in 2008-2009.

    In addition, with its MSRP up there with the competition now, rather than below it as a bargain in price, performance, and options, itís not going to be as appealing unless it really just blows people away in some manner. I donít think GM is planning on the V3 being a big selling game changer. I think the Vsport is aimed to be a bigger seller, and the V3 more exclusive. There is nothing wrong with that, but that just means it has to be that much more of a halo car. They are going to have to really make a significant change over the Vsport in its looks and body panels, in its power and performance to even come close to grapping any buyers away from the AMG, M, and S/RS Bavarian performance class cars.

    As much as I like the C7, and I really do; as much as its interior has rocketed up in quality and its handling charmed reviewers, it has not become a game changer in its class. Maybe the Z07 will, and I for sure will be fast as hell, itís not going to be blowing past the GTR in performance, and sadly probably wonít be far ahead of the crazy fast awd super sedans that are available now.

    You people are dreaming if you think the V3++@#$#$ is going to start under 80k and loaded be under 90k.

  12. #11
    6104696 is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: Are V2 owners and enthusiast being realistic about V3 pricing?

    Leasing is not always cheaper and is not always wise. Depends on how long you intend to keep the car, how much you drive, and how important it is for you to have a "new" car. Leasing is, essentially, where you are paying the depreciation and a small profit for the lessor. You buy a car, then sell it, you are eating the depreciation and, if a trade-in, a profit for the dealer. You lease a car, drive it more than the lease amount, and you pay a penalty. You buy it, you drive it more than the "standard" 12-15K per year, your resale is lower. you are paying one way or the other.

    You buy it, you can pay cash or you can carry a payment plan. Your choice. You buy it, keep it for 10 years......that last 7 years will be a hell of a lot cheaper than leasing a new one every 3 years.

    It's simple math, not rocket science. If leasing were a no brainer, then nobody would buy. If financing were a no-brainer, nobody would pay cash.

    now, back to the V3; I don't care what the lease or monthly payments are; if it competitively priced I might buy one, if it is not, I probably won't. I will look at the overall cost of ownership over a 6-10 year period. They would be foolish to price it like an E63 or an M5. The resale history is not there, and the relative "value" is not there either. GM can charge $100K for a Z06 or ZR1 because the closest real competition is costing way more (Audi, Porsche, ferrari, viper (not much more$$ for viper). Not so for the V3. Not yet.

    But hey.....GM can do what they want and we, the market, will do what we will.

  13. #12
    neuronbob's Avatar
    neuronbob is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: Are V2 owners and enthusiast being realistic about V3 pricing?

    I can't predict 1-2 years in the future, when the V3 is going to be finally released, whether I'm going to buy one, or on the price if there is no price to know yet.

  14. #13
    dennych is offline Cadillac Owners Enthusiast
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    Re: Are V2 owners and enthusiast being realistic about V3 pricing?

    Quote Originally Posted by youknooow View Post
    It seems that there is a general consensus that Cadillac is not being realistic in their pricing strategy, essentially saying Cadillac’s are overpriced. I personally disagree; technology, quality, and innovation are not cheap.
    More specifically, when I “hear” V2 owners state that the V Sport is overpriced and subsequently the V3 will, I’m like are they serious? The V2 in all of its awesomeness lacks certain features that should be standard in 2014 and its class. I think this has resulted from its pricing strategy.
    When I read this article: http://www.caranddriver.com/comparis...omparison-test
    I thought “Can the V3 be competitive w/out costing at least 90-95K?
    Thoughts?
    That's because we already own Cadillacs and have overcome the brand stigma associated with American made cars. Bottom line, a huge chunk of car cost comes from branding. While having a good recent track record, they don't have the same prestige level.

  15. #14
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    vfaninva is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Very well said RaVeNous! I totally agree with your analysis.
    I would frankly be shocked if the V3 is stickered at less than 85k.
    Cadillac is trying to compete with the Europeans and consequently the price is going to reflect that. The V3 will be competitive but, will still cost less.

  16. #15
    CTSV UT is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: Are V2 owners and enthusiast being realistic about V3 pricing?

    If you start with the 6k adder from V2 to V3 on standard cars. The LT4 should be very similar cost to LSA. Both transmissions options should be at around $500 to $1k more. Who knows what else they will throw in. I think the starting price will be between $71k and $75k and max around $85K. Can hope for $70k. I pay cash so, I do care about the price. I can't wait for the announcement, should be next week or so if it will be in New York Auto show otherwise I fear it will be in Detroit next year which means they probably won't be testing in Nurburging this summer.

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