GM just doesnt get it......
Cadillac
 

Cadillac Forums | Help Us Help You | Advertise | Cadillac Parts | Cadillac News | Cadillac Classifieds / (Old System)

Cadillac Technical Archive | Cadillac Dealers | Cadillac Reviews | Cadillac Dealer Reviews | Cadillac Vendors

CadillacForums.com is the premier Cadillac Forum on the internet. Registered Users do not see the above ads.
+ Reply to Thread
Results 1 to 15 of 15
Cadillac News, Concepts, Future Models, Rumors and more Discussion, GM just doesnt get it...... in Current Cadillac Vehicle Discussion; http://www.reuters.com/article/rbssC...58543120080109 This is what their customers are clamoring for? With all of the quality problems and DTS resizing and decontenting, ...
  1. #1
    sterner is offline Cadillac Owners Member
    Automobile(s): DTS
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    13

    GM just doesnt get it......

    http://www.reuters.com/article/rbssC...58543120080109


    This is what their customers are clamoring for? With all of the quality problems and DTS resizing and decontenting, they are spending time and resources on this stuff? Simply maddening.

  2. Remove Advertisements
    CadillacForums.com
    Advertisements
     

  3. #2
    Lord Cadillac is offline Cadillac Maniac
    Automobile(s): Cadillac Escalade
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Royal Palm Beach, Florida
    Age
    42
    Posts
    13,605

    Re: GM just doesnt get it......

    This is just one way that Cadillac is trying to win the hearts and minds of buyers. I'm sure they're working on lots of different initiatives..
    Please help us keep CadillacOwners.com online. Become a Site Supporter today. You'll get more than a "thank you" in return.



    In loving memory of Angelo Anthony Quagliaralillo... Rest in peace..

  4. #3
    Jesda's Avatar
    Jesda is offline Super Moderator
    Automobile(s): An endless stream of Sevilles.
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    St Louis MO
    Age
    32
    Posts
    22,192

    Re: GM just doesnt get it......

    Green is in.

  5. #4
    PAULSTSMAN1's Avatar
    PAULSTSMAN1 is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
    Automobile(s): 1998 CADILLAC STS
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    BELMONT HGTS,CA
    Posts
    179

    Re: GM just doesnt get it......

    Green is fine, but it's all hype! There's plenty of petroleum; it's just further down, and costs more to locate and refine (our refineries are old, and outdated like some of our bridges).

    Instead of wondering who's going to be President, we need to know who wants responsible fiscal policy for the infrastructure of our economy. Creation of living wage Jobs (meaningful, purposeful, and necessary), then the auto manufacturers problems will go away. Instead of wasting time and creating useless legislation like CAFÉ (each year any fuel savings from this legislation will be exhausted as 7 million new drivers enter the market in old cars).

    GM is in a quagmire, any way they go is down the wrong street. I was around (very young and hot) in 1974 when the first "gas crisis" caused GM, Ford, and Chrysler to abandon High-Powered desired vehicles. They started building ill conceived small junk cars, with junk motors....and killed the business, or at least gave it away to the Japanese.

    History is cyclical: "He who doesn't learn from History, repeats it's mistakes!"

  6. #5
    Lord Cadillac is offline Cadillac Maniac
    Automobile(s): Cadillac Escalade
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Royal Palm Beach, Florida
    Age
    42
    Posts
    13,605

    Re: GM just doesnt get it......

    That's not a bad point, Paul.. We did lose a ton of business after selling all those crappy little cars.. Hopefully we've learned from those mistakes and create a better solution this time around..
    Please help us keep CadillacOwners.com online. Become a Site Supporter today. You'll get more than a "thank you" in return.



    In loving memory of Angelo Anthony Quagliaralillo... Rest in peace..

  7. #6
    megeebee's Avatar
    megeebee is offline Cadillac Owners Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    634

    Re: GM just doesnt get it......

    Quote Originally Posted by sterner View Post
    http://www.reuters.com/article/rbssC...58543120080109

    This is what their customers are clamoring for? With all of the quality problems and DTS resizing and decontenting, they are spending time and resources on this stuff? Simply maddening.
    No. It's what the competitions customers are clamoring for. Cadillac has not entry in the small FWD/AWD crossover market. Cadillac wants and needs those customers.

    I don't understand why you're so upset. GM is showing a petro-free vehicle and that's bad?

    What quality problems? Cadillac has consistently been in the top 5 brands in the JD Power survey. It's the Germans (Mercedes, Audi, BMW) that fare far worse.

    "decontenting" the DTS? Where did you come up with that?

    The DTS doesn't sell anymore. Just because it once did is not a reason to continue to throw money at a car of its type. The STS doesn't sell well either. Why on earth would Cadillac NOT blend the two. The new CTS is so close to the STS in size and performance, and less expensive to buy. The CTS will sell in excess of 60,000 this year if current sell rates hold, or even drop a bit. The STS might find 16,000 buyers. Why NOT produce a RWD car that is noticably larger than the CTS but embodies much of the boulevard luxury of the DTS? Why spend all that money to produce a new, large, FWD platform for Cadillac AND continue the STS? Niether you, me, or most people have even SEEN the car that will replace the STS and DTS. Who knows? You may love it!

  8. #7
    sterner is offline Cadillac Owners Member
    Automobile(s): DTS
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    13

    Re: GM just doesnt get it......

    Quality problems - For starters search for escalade and wind noise on this very forum. Does anyone at GM drive these cars before or during intial production?

    Decontenting - search for hood light, cheap leather, and unusable glove box. Also prevelant on this very forum.

    Your correct, the DTS doesnt sell anymore, primarily vecause GM is making the DTS what the DeVille buying demographic does not want, a cheaper, smaller, lower quality car.

  9. #8
    77CDV's Avatar
    77CDV is offline Cadillac Owners Master
    Automobile(s): 77 CDV, 06 DTS III, 69 FWB
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Newbury Park, CA
    Age
    42
    Posts
    9,095

    Re: GM just doesnt get it......

    I'll take exception to that, Sterner. I've owned and driven Cadillacs exclusively since I could drive. I own a current model DTS, and I couldn't be more pleased with it. It's big, comfortable, quiet, smooth, rides beautifully, and has all the power I could ever use. There are niggling little things that I would like back, like the automatic parking brake release, and a full power trunk lid, RWD, and a 6+ speed tranny wouldn't go amiss, but overall, the car is a joy to own and drive. It's a great improvement over the 03 DHS I traded for it.

    Craig

  10. #9
    sterner is offline Cadillac Owners Member
    Automobile(s): DTS
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    13

    Re: GM just doesnt get it......

    Craig,

    You can take exception, but the DTS sales numbers are what they are.

  11. #10
    AMGoff's Avatar
    AMGoff is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
    Automobile(s): '03 Seville STS, '89 Eldorado, '89 Grand Wagoneer
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    South Jersey
    Age
    41
    Posts
    2,153

    Re: GM just doesnt get it......

    Umm... I'd really like to know what the two of you are basing your assertions on?

    Honestly, with all due respect, it's pretty obvious neither of you has done any research on the matter and dare I say, may have merely pulled such claims out of your respective rear-ends.

    You're absolutely right - the numbers are what they are... unfortunately, the numbers completely contradict what you've said.

    The bottom line is that the DTS/Deville has always been the sales leader for Cadillac - year in and year out. It has only been for 2007 that sales of the big sedan have actually slipped to #2 behind the CTS, and only by a margin of 5560 units. The reason for this? The stellar as well as largely unexpected end of the year sales for the new for '08 CTS. How can I say this for certainty? Because we all know the new CTS went on sale in late August, and with a little bit of research, it's easy to see that the DTS had been outselling the CTS all the way through September of '07, it was only in the last three months of '07 that sales of the CTS surpassed the DTS... furthermore, had the new CTS not been released when it was and without such universal fanfare, the DTS would have once again been the sales leader for Cadillac - as it has been for so very many years.

    So... would you care to somehow attempt to explain your seemingly authoritative statements or shall we call this one decided?

  12. #11
    megeebee's Avatar
    megeebee is offline Cadillac Owners Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    634

    Re: GM just doesnt get it......

    The DTS outsold the CTS by a small margin because of its relatively high fleet sales. A larger portion of DTS's go to rental companies than any other Cadillac.

    Sales of the DTS in 2006 were 58,224. In 2007 they were 51,469. The DTS rides on a platform, the GM "G" body, that dates back to the 1995 Olds Aurora.

    The DTS is an old car and has to be replaced sometime. So does the STS, which is in its 4th, unsuccessful year on the market. Why not combine them and allow the most successful car, the CTS, do its thing?

    The same argument can be used for the BRX (Provoq). vis-s-vis the SRX Despite it's manifold qualities, does not sell very well (22,000 last year). Why not build a vehicle like the very successful ones the competition is turning out? (Lexus sells in excess of 100,000 RX's a year). Retiring the SRX will leave more production capacity at the plant for the variants of the CTS to come, the coupe and the wagon.

    (Sales figures source: Automotive News Data Center. January 2008)

  13. #12
    PAULSTSMAN1's Avatar
    PAULSTSMAN1 is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
    Automobile(s): 1998 CADILLAC STS
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    BELMONT HGTS,CA
    Posts
    179

    Re: GM just doesnt get it......

    Megeebee:

    I always find your posts reasonable and to the point. Your point of allowing the CTS to rise to its level is an acceptible expection. However the CTS was released as a single car wonder. It appears from the pictures I have seen on the internet, that the CTS Coupe is the original one shown on the 60 MINUTES television show with Bob Lutz in cameo. Nothing was gained from withholding its introduction, there are buyers such as me that wanted a coupe and have refrained from a purchase or worse yet bought other cars.

    Also here’s some food for thought: Recently I had coffee with a former General Manager with Cadillac, he stated it takes approximately 2.5 sales of a (pre 2008 models) CTS to equal the profit earned from each DTS sale. Is is possible that perhaps you may have overestimated a little the amount of Fleet sales vs. retail sales. The DTS remains one of Cadillac best sellers and overall cash cows. This is one of the reasons it is so hard to kill off, before a suitable replacement has been designated.

  14. #13
    sterner is offline Cadillac Owners Member
    Automobile(s): DTS
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    13

    Re: GM just doesnt get it......

    Quote Originally Posted by AMGoff View Post
    Honestly, with all due respect, it's pretty obvious neither of you has done any research on the matter and dare I say, may have merely pulled such claims out of your respective rear-ends.

    The bottom line is that the DTS/Deville has always been the sales leader for Cadillac - year in and year out. It has only been for 2007 that sales of the big sedan have actually slipped to #2 behind the CTS, and only by a margin of 5560 units.

    So... would you care to somehow attempt to explain your seemingly authoritative statements or shall we call this one decided?
    Speaking of pulling claims out of someone's respective rear-end ..........

    No, the DTS has not always been the sales leader for Cadillac. According to Forbes (http://www.forbes.com/2006/12/15/bes...uxurycars.html) 2006 DTS sales below Escalade.

  15. #14
    AMGoff's Avatar
    AMGoff is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
    Automobile(s): '03 Seville STS, '89 Eldorado, '89 Grand Wagoneer
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    South Jersey
    Age
    41
    Posts
    2,153

    Re: GM just doesnt get it......

    Fair enough... I didn't even bother looking at truck numbers as GM lists them separately from cars. So yes, when all three different Escalades (Escalade, ESV, and EXT) are added together they do come out higher by about 3,000 units according to GM's own numbers. However, none of the models by themselves sold more than the DTS. Yes... the DTS also has a number of fleet sales... for 2006 and 2007 they accounted for about 1/4 of all DTS sales... so even with those sales deducted, the DTS was still the second best, retail selling, singular nameplate - behind the CTS - which by the way has a number of fleet sales itself, accounting for almost 10%.

    The fact remains, there are still a lot of people looking for a "traditional" Cadillac... and there's nothing wrong with catering to those people. So I'm not sure what GM doesn't get... a carmaker shouldn't have to cater its entire lineup to one segment of the market in order for it to be successful. Either way you cut it, the DTS is still one of Cadillac's best selling nameplates, despite some of the assertions that have been made here.

  16. #15
    PAULSTSMAN1's Avatar
    PAULSTSMAN1 is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
    Automobile(s): 1998 CADILLAC STS
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    BELMONT HGTS,CA
    Posts
    179

    Re: GM just doesnt get it......

    I am glad to report that yesterday I saw a TV program "Autoline Detroit" with John McElroy, it was recorded at the Detroit AutoShow. The opening scene was at the Cadillac Exhibit, featuring the recently revealed CTS Coupe (CTC). John and his Automotive Magazine guest, couldn't have said better things about the car.

    While I did see photos elsewhere, the scene where the Coupe was spinning on the display made it seem even more stunning! I loved the shape and the execution of the details, especially the center mounted bi-ported exhaust! The car brought back memories of the Eldorado, and I could imagine what it would look like in a convertible, this design is a real winner!

    The only thing I question is why on release didn't Cadillac offer both the Sedan and CTC? Clearly this was the car earlier cameoed in the segment of 60 MINUTES, done last year with Bob Lutz. Also I am questioning why it wasn't released with the diesel option available from the beginning, to jump start sales in Europe? Sometimes I wonder if no one at GM studies their archives? Previously by delaying the Northstar introduction into the Allante, this made what would have been a real halo vehicle for Cadillac an also ran.

    It is understood that finances slow development, but creating sales excitement, will bring in the dollars! This is where I hope GM will focus their thinking, creating traffic in the Dealerships.

Quick Reply Quick Reply

Register Now

Please enter the name by which you would like to log-in and be known on this site.
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.

Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Bookmarks

Cadillac Posting Rules

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Read about Lincoln | Buick | Kia Forte Forum
Need products for your Cadillac? Check out your options at the links below:

custom floor mats | Cadillac Chrome and Black Chrome Wheels | window tinting