The Sixteen Has Been Canned
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Cadillac News, Concepts, Future Models, Rumors and more Discussion, The Sixteen Has Been Canned in Current Cadillac Vehicle Discussion; It's a large PDF and probably not worth opening... Basically it just states that Lutz cannot go forward with the ...
  1. #1
    Lord Cadillac is offline Cadillac Maniac
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    The Sixteen Has Been Canned

    It's a large PDF and probably not worth opening...

    Basically it just states that Lutz cannot go forward with the idea because of the new gas laws possibly coming into affect.. He mentions that even if they softened up a bit and did a 750 horsepower v12 (instead of the 1000 horsepower v16), it would still be too much of a gas guzzler..

    What I really don't understand is why they can't use a 7.0 liter (505 hp / 470 lb.-ft. of torque) LS7 v8 to power the car. If an Escalade is 5500lbs and does 0-60 in 6.5 seconds with a 403 horsepower 6.2L Vortec V8 with 417 lb-ft - than what's the problem? Does the Sixteen weigh more than 5500lbs? And even if it did, a hundred more horsepower would be more than enough...

    I really don't get why they're not building this car...
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    CadillacSTS42005's Avatar
    CadillacSTS42005 is offline Banned
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    Re: The Sixteen Has Been Canned

    i was supposed to see the car in real life too
    damn it work had to get in the way...

    oh and in answer to you ? weve be over this
    Lutz is a pri*k thats why

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    Lord Cadillac is offline Cadillac Maniac
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    Re: The Sixteen Has Been Canned

    They're not building the Sixteen because they're not capable. It has nothing to do with the gas issue. This car would sell in such limited numbers that it wouldn't impact much anyway... What a shame...
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    asrapid is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: The Sixteen Has Been Canned

    According to rumors there won't be any ls7 in near future. Also cadillac don't really need V12/and especially v16) to produce 600 + Hp.
    It would be nice if they put v12 in some luxury car in future, but i think for now V8 DOHC engines are priority.

  6. #5
    PAULSTSMAN1's Avatar
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    Cool Re: The Sixteen Has Been Canned

    The problem is GM it's still too big, too many car lines, and the "in the box" Corporate thinking quotient. The Sixteen while a styling exercise could very easily be blended into a redesigned STS, by adding increased length to the front of the car (perhaps some frame modification would be necessary for more than 12 inches). Revise the interior to offer more rear seat room and removing the middle seat for true 4 passenger Luxury Cache, as per Ford Thunderbirds of the 1960's.

    Engines are not really a problem as DI V6 could be rebalanced, to eliminate some of the Noise, Vibration, and Harshness (NVH), Diesel Options exist, if not good ones, then outsource, and the new NorthStar IV Ultra should be ready within a year or so. Work on the NorthStar V V XII is complete enough to offer it a limited edition, Ultra Premium option for selected Cadillac Models this should choke some of the CAF╔ requirements. All new GM engine designs I am sure have been designed to include Variable Valve Timing (VVT), and Computer selectable cylinder cutoff. If they haven't then the technology is behind HONDA. Transmission technology could make the 6 speed dual clutches utilize more of the engine power to increase economy, also.

    GM needs to think outside the Box, or it's days as a producer for anything more expensive than $40,000 is history. When a monolith like GM has to limit the price, they have to increase production, and with GM's labor cost....that means MORE RED INK. It may be time to retire some of the older thinkers, and get some of those underpaid, frustrated talent lurking around Toyota, Nissan, and Honda.

    I am attaching a Abode Photo chop (from sent MonacoSS) on another website just to show that if members of the public can do this why can't GM?
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    Lord Cadillac is offline Cadillac Maniac
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    Re: The Sixteen Has Been Canned

    I like that Sixteenish-looking STS.. But it looks a little tight inside.. Maybe just a slight lengthening of the cabin.. Let me see if I have any luck with that...
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    Cool Re: The Sixteen Has Been Canned

    Personally I like the lengthened cabin, but as Bob Lutz mentioned on an Autoline Detroit Program recently; "lengthening or widening the Cabin is Major Expense." If the interior was removed and the rear cage to the trunk was redesigned rear seat room could be increased without the expensive exterior redo. Also by designating the car as a 4 passenger personal luxury vehicle, the rear seat wouldn't get that crowded.

    I would like to see the roof flatten a bit, I am concerned about rear headroom. Let's keep the dialog going, maybe GM's checking in.

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    Lord Cadillac is offline Cadillac Maniac
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    Re: The Sixteen Has Been Canned

    I agree with lengthening the rear of the cabin and squaring it off a bit more than the pictures we posted above.. The major expense of the lengthening AND widening of the cabin should be covered in the 'expensive' cost to consumer.. Isn't that a no-brainer?
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    Cool Re: The Sixteen Has Been Canned

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Cadillac View Post
    I agree with lengthening the rear of the cabin and squaring it off a bit more than the pictures we posted above.. The major expense of the lengthening AND widening of the cabin should be covered in the 'expensive' cost to consumer.. Isn't that a no-brainer?
    Another factor we might consider is how expensive is expensive?. Each product has an amount of reasonable cost and this factors in to the Retail Price. However when marketing anything, if the costs becomes exorbitant, it makes the retail cost too great for the Market to Bare, then you have a "White Elephant." I believe this may explain why the XLR isn't selling better, it should have been priced at $60,000 in a normally aspirated model.

    More about the XLR, while it is a great car, it has an unknown pedigree. The SL500 has 50+ years of production, and the earlier models are selling for multiple times what current ones do (especially the 300 SL Gullwing).

    I will defer to Bob Lutz, based upon his experience to discuss production costs, he's certain well paid enough to know.

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    Re: The Sixteen Has Been Canned

    ^^
    makes sense...


    also.. if cadillac were to go forward with the Cadillac Sixteen.. but change it to a V12.. wouldnt that defeat the purpose of the name?? then it would have to be called the Cadillac Twelve... which doesn't sound as good..

    guess it was a good idea to can it....

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    Re: The Sixteen Has Been Canned

    GM and Lutz need to grow some nutz!

  13. #12
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    Re: The Sixteen Has Been Canned

    I think Cadillac does need to come out with a car thats along the lines of a sixteen and a RR Phantom. Cadillac should make a 4 door luxury sedan, sixteen front end, long, plenty of rear passenger space, suicide doors and options that the Phantom and Maybach offer. Should be priced at $110,000+. I know that GM won't sell as many of these as they would Escalade's, but these shall be available to those that can afford them, and those that can afford these cars should be able to feed the V10. Diesel would be nice IMO!

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