Test drive review....02 Regal GS. AND, my worst dealership experience ever.

[I~LUV~Caddys8792]

For those who don't know, I was trying to narrow down my choices for my next car, between the '97-04 Regal GS, 98-02 Accord EX-V6, 00-03 Maxima and the 96-98 Tahoe two door/ Silverado. Anyways, I test drove a '02 GS today, liked the car, *hated* the dealership.


First, the car.

Exterior Design: 8/10:



Regals are a handsome, if somewhat bland sedan. I really like the two tone paint scheme, and body color grille. But they look too much like the Century. Greater model differentiation would have been a huge help to the Reg's sales.



Interior Design: 7.5/10.

The interior again, is somewhat bland, but unoffensive. Nothing that'll push people away because it's too "far out", but nothing that'll draw people in because it's just amazing. Pretty typical mid '90s GM design here.

It was very airy and open, I liked that. Loads of headroom and great visibility, pretty good amount of legroom in the front, mediocre legroom in the back. The guages are nothing exciting to look at, but easy to read. A quick glance is all that's needed to get the vitals. Otherwise, controls for the radio and HVAC are easy to reach and simple to use, but that's probably because I'm used to the way GM does things. Overall, build quality was decent, not as good as any of the Caddies I've driven, but better than my Roadmaster. There was abundant storage space too, at the bottom of the console; in front of the shifter and below the HVAC controls, loads of space in there, along with a cavernous space inside the floor console between the seats. Two cupholders in the center console up front, and two in the rear armrest. Very good.


Seating: 9.5/10.


This is what I like in a seat. Cushy, comfy, conforming. Much like the older Caddy seats, you sink into them, not just sit on top of them, they conform to your body pretty well and hold you in pretty snugly. They were six way power and heated too, and although it was about 49* when I test drove it, I could feel it get hot on the higher setting, but not so much on the lower setting. I'm sure if I drove it when it was about twenty degrees cooler I could have felt it on L. The leather was of a very nice quality also, similar in feel and durability to Cadillac's Nuance leather, and far superior than the leather in my Roadmaster.


Engine: 9/10.

What hasn't been said about the 3800's reliability. It's unbeatable. No need to go into further depth there. The power is where I wanna delve into. It wasn't as fast as I'd expected. I was expecting it to be as fast as an L67 on the freeway. I was wrong. From a 60mph roll, I punched it twice, and it was quite a bit faster than my 4.9L, but that's to be expected. It felt like 9/10s of that '93 STS from a 60 mph roll. The main difference is with the L37, the power comes out of nowhere and comes at you hard and fast. It's startling actually. With the L67, the power is more linear, and the prime torque band is much wider. It never has the flat out acclerative rush that the L37 does, but it's got a much wider powerband and pulls much better at lower RPMs. That being said, I wish I brought my digital camera with me to videotape, but I forgot it in my car. Also, the engine was very quiet at speed, almost zero supercharger whine was heard at any speed, at any RPM.


Tranny: 9.5/10.
Great as always. I love GM's 4 speed trannys!

Steering: 8.5/10.
The steering was direct, but I wish it had the feel that the '93 STS's did, that steering was to die for. Anyways, the steering was tighter and more direct than my deVilles, but for some odd reason, it felt kinda fake and rubbery.


Suspension: 8.5/10.
Good suspension setup, luxury car smooth, but still gave good feedback as to what was happenin' below. It's nothing too sporty or harsh, like a Maxima or Grand Prix, where bumps are readily apparent, but not vague and floaty like that ETC I drove. I felt comfortable and confident driving this car aggressively.


Radio: 9/10.
Easy to use, came with an in dash CD player, great sounding, clear, Monsoon speakers.


Electronic Goodies: 8/10.
Had all of the stuff I have in my Cadillac, plus heated seats and a boost guage (loved that!). Although I kinda wish the trip computer had more information, it's just got the essentials, such as range, AVG MPG and boost PSI. Otherwise, this had a sunroof (really want one of those), automatic dimming inside and drivers side mirror, dual vanity mirrors, dual zone automatic climate control, etc etc. Like I said earlier, all of the luxury car features without the luxury car price.

Overall: 86/100.

I'd rock one of these anyday. All of the things I like about Cadillacs, plus a hell of a drivetrain inside a deceptively bland looking body. Awesome!

Highs:
-Drivetrain
-Power
-Luxury features
-Great seats

Lows:
-Somewhat bland interior/exterior design.
-Cheap interior materials

Verdict: 97% sure I'll be buying one of these next.




Part II: The dealer. Valley Buick Pontiac GMC in Hastings MN.


So I get to the dealer, drive around the lot to find the GS, park my car up front in a sport, walk around a bit then finally two of the younger salesguys greet me. I tell them I'm there, (just looking now mind you) to look at the '02 GS they have listed on the internet, one of them didn't know they had it, and the other told me where it was and to go look at it. After I walked off a bit, one of the salesguys followed me and introduced himself, then followed me to the car, then offered to let me drive it, by myself. He took my licence (which seems odd to me, usually they just make a copy of it and hand it back to you.

So I take the car out and come back and look at the car for a few minutes, while my sales associate is nowhere to be found. Then I get the idea that maybe he went inside for some reason, and I go in there and he's wandering the showroom with my licence in hand. When I met up with him again, I thanked him for letting me drive it, then told him something like I was just browsing at the time and not willing to buy now. Then he sits me down at his desk (again, I thought it was very odd and pushy) and starts taking down information about me, the deVille and has me fill out an application for GMAC credit!?!? (Hello! I told you I'm just browsing!) While I'm filling out the application, he takes my car keys and he and his manager appraise my car (ok???) Afterwords, he comes back with an appraisal of $1000, which is what I was expecting, but he won't give me back my keys!! It's like I'm imprisoned at a B/P/GMC dealer!? So now I'm getting uncomfortable, and frankly, pretty damn mad. I've never been treated like this at ANY dealership I've ever been to, and I've been to 15-20, doing the same thing, just browsing.

So he goes off somewhere, and I call my dad, telling him that they're trying to sell me the damn GS I just came in to check out. Dad gets angry, tells me to grab my keys and leave ASAP. As soon as the salesguy came back, I asked for my keys back, (he reluctantly gave 'em back a few minutes later), then remind him that I'm just browsing and not ready to buy for a few months. He says that's ok and makes small talk. He kept holding me around so I could talk to the finance guy about what my payments would look like. So FINALLY (after about 45 minutes of hanging around there) I get to talk to the finance guy. I tell him how I'm just browsing around and not ready to buy for a few months. He then said there's really no point to running my numbers because the car won't be there when I'm ready to buy. Then he left for a second (probably to have a talk with the salesguy) and came back and politely told me that it's not in my best interest to look at cars until I'm actually ready to buy. I agreed and left VERY quickly. I walked out of the showroom fairly fast, ripped open the door to my car, jumped in faster than I've ever done before, threw the car into Reverse (actually, in my rush I threw it into Neutral!) and peeled out in reverse! lol! I left thru the back entrance (to avoid the sales department) and probably did 10-15 over the speed limit my entire way home! lol! Well, atleast the drive home was exciting!


Does that experience with the sales department seem a little odd to anyone else? I mean I've been to 15-20 dealers just browsing at cars, and every other time, they'll let me drive it, then give me a business card and tell me to keep in touch.

Basically I learned to stay the hell away from the Valley Group of dealers, and not to look at cars until I'm ready to buy! After this whole debacle, I'm even second guessing buying from a dealer when the time comes!

[Spyder]

That sounds about like ANY dealer I've ever been to, with very few exceptions.

[Jesda]

LOL, what a tard.

As far as the GS, I wish the suspension was better able to prevent dive and squat. A car that quick should have stronger braking and sharper handling, otherwise I wouldnt mind having one at all.

[I~LUV~Caddys8792]

Originally Posted by Jesda

LOL, what a tard.

Yeah, what bugged me the most was the fact he didn't even ask if I was ready to go sit down and get serious, he just forced me into it, and it's not like I could have left, as he took my licence, than my keys and insurance info.

Originally Posted by Jesda

As far as the GS, I wish the suspension was better able to prevent dive and squat. A car that quick should have stronger braking and sharper handling, otherwise I wouldnt mind having one at all.

True, that suspension was a bit "Buicky" for all that power, it should have been firmer like that '93 STS, but then again, that would probably be too close to the GTP. Either way, it can be stiffened up with aftermarket parts.

[Jonas McFeely]

Sounds like any major dealer ive ever heard of or been to.The smaller lots wont do that to you.

[RightTurn]

That key thing happened to me in a Nissan dealer once. I showed my butt so bad on the showroom floor that they REALLY regretted pulling that "take the keys" trick, lol. I'm not exaggerating when I say I was SCREAMING "GIVE ME MY EFFING KEYS NOW!!"

Still pisses me off just remembering. :grrrrrr:

[gdwriter]

Originally Posted by RightTurn

That key thing happened to me in a Nissan dealer once. I showed my butt so bad on the showroom floor that they REALLY regretted pulling that "take the keys" trick, lol. I'm not exaggerating when I say I was SCREAMING "GIVE ME MY EFFING KEYS NOW!!"

So, does this mean you mooned the place, RT?

But you're right. I've found that making a scene in a car dealership—which I once had to do, yelling "your salesman is a liar!" at the top of my voice—will do the trick. And I'm loud. Very loud.

[gdwriter]

Whoops. Double post.

[RightTurn]

Originally Posted by gdwriter

So, does this mean you mooned the place, RT?

No, but I did lose my ladylike demeanor. Didn't buy a damn Nissan either.

[gary88]

When I test drove that G35 the salesman did basically everything you just explained. Except he was nice and polite in general, and asked for my keys, so it wasn't too bad. Talked about financing and everything. He was only 20 so he wasn't really an ass. The only thing on a car salesman's mind is "Gotta make the sale, gotta make the sale, commission commission commission commi$$ion."

Though if I did choose to buy it right there they would have taken my car for $14k

[c5 rv]

Yep, that's very common at most dealerships. You need to take control of the transaction. As far as I'm concerned, the sales person and dealership are there to provide me a service: provide me with a vehicle I want at the price I want to pay. (Yeah, I know, they have another view of their job - sell me a car for the maximum amount I will accept.) Some suggestions:

- Expect them to want your name, address, phone number, and a copy of your license. Do not leave for a test drive until they have returned your license.

- If you are interested in having the dealer appraise your trade in, ask if they can do it while you are on a test drive - 20 minutes, because you are tight on time. If they can't meet your time constraint, keep your keys in your pocket or ask for them back as soon as you return from the test drive.

- If you don't want them to appraise your car, say so and keep your keys in your pocket.

- If the sales person wants to go along on the test drive, let them. It's no big deal. Some dealerships like to do this to try to build a relationship and find out what you like. They do this less and less for security reasons. Someone stealing a car on a test drive is a lot less bad press and problems than a sales person being carjacked.

- Be friendly to the salesperson. Be open to their suggestions of other vehicles, but remember, the decision is yours. A good relationship with a honest sales person is worthwhile. Recently my Caddy salesperson called me when they had a nice STS demo they wanted to sell.

- If they want to take a routine finance app, say no thank you, you are a credit union member and prefer to use that financing. I've heard that a number of dealers running a credit check can cost you a few points on your credit score. When you are ready to buy, go ahead and put in a credit app along with applying at your credit union. Sometimes they find cheaper financing - but be very careful to understand the loan / lease they offer.

There are a lot of dealers. Find a few that will work with you the way you want to and give them your business. Ignore the others.

[mharker]

Ha... that brings back memories. When I was 20 I worked at a VW dealer for about six months.

They used to insist we get the keys to the trade-in so the manager could "appraise" it and they would send me back downstairs time after time with counter offers... and saying "oops I forgot your keys". Truth was all we did on the trade-ins was check the black book. Nobody ever really appraised the cars!

My advice on that scam... when they ask for they keys tell them "keys are in the ignition. go help yourself!". In the unlikely event they actually check then YOU can say sorry gee I forgot to leave them in.

I've only ever bought two brand-new vehicles. Both times I faxed in a friendly letter with a reasonable offer, with a 24 hour deadline. Both times first dealer accepted and I never went into the dealership until it was time to pick up the car.

Act like a businessman and they will treat you with more respect.

[I~LUV~Caddys8792]

Well first of all, thanks for the advice, it'll really come in handy when I'm actually ready to buy!

Secondly, this "high pressure" sales approach I encountered today still seems odd to me. I've test driven cars at many, many dealers before, new car lots, used car lots, from many different families of dealers and never have encountered this before. Maybe this system is on it's way out in MN??

[Sandy]

As someone who sold cars for 29 years, here are my comments.

What the salesman did worng:
Taking your driver's license & sending you out w/out it. BIG BIG WRONG
Running a credit check on you, that early in the game.

Everything else he did was correct.

Further explanation.

You stated that you were "just looking" and were not ready to buy.
They at the dealership KNOW that there's a better than 90% chance
that when you are ready, that Buick will be looong gone. So, why then even send you out in it ?? That's like looking in a bakery for cookies that you'll be buying next month!

If you are not ready to get serious, look on Sunday, when they are closed. IF by chance you see something that make your hot with passion, then come back when they are open.

When you are "ready" to buy, you tell your salesperson that you are ready to buy, if they give you a bonafide good deal. It's the crap or got off the pot, exercise.

Never let them take a credit check on you. You'll ALWAYS do better at a bank, a savings & loan, BTW. Buy your car at the dealer and buy your money at the bank ! More better 4-U.

All day long people come in and do zactly what you did, for lack for understanding.

"I am not ready to buy - but I'd like to drive that Buick"

Salesman thinks, that car is going to auction in 7 days, & he's allready told me he's "Not rready to buy" ~ Why the H should I expose that car to danger when he's allready told me he's not ready, and the car's had its 22 days on the lot & is on 3rd base to the auction. So, don't say that.

Never give up YOUR keys at the first visit. Never let them keep your license, but if if if you are going out on a demo ride (ALONE OR NOT) it's the law that they photocopy your license.

Visit a bank, this week. Sit down with a rep of the bank. Talk turkey over your finances. SEE if you can comfortably afford that car. If so, and If you want it, return and make an offer (reasonable) and if accepted, give a credit card deposit (never $$ or check) and go fetch the loan.
Understand that there will be a Doc Fee on the sales order. More than $90.00 & you'll have to say no, and stand firm. There should be no ther charges other than sales tax & Doc.

Getting nasty, abusive will make you look "cheap" and is not a plan. When people got nasty / abusive with me, I walked from them. Later I came back & told them that they need to treat me as they do their Dentist or their accountant, or they can leave ! (and ) meant it. You cannot buy a car once every 5 years, and beat the guy that sells 5 every 2 days. Be nice, and in return - recognize siht and walk. The door is ALWAYS your best pal.
Good luck. PS/ Write on the order that it is pending your securing your loan at the institution of YOUR choice.

[I~LUV~Caddys8792]

Thanks Sandy, I was waiting for your input on this situation, I knew it would be good!

I was getting quite angry there, but instead of making a big scene and demanding my keys back I just waited it out until I got the numbers (which I never did) then left the showfloor quietly and calmly. All hell broke loose though when I got into the car. I was rippin' thru that parking lot like an F-5 thru Witchita! Haha! I can honestly say that when I'm ready to buy, which won't be for quite a while, I hope they do not have anything I like in stock there. I do not want to have any reason to return.