: Revisited: Are we ruining our own resale value?



04CTSVFLA
02-14-07, 12:35 PM
I know this has been talked about several times. But what are your opinions on the resale value of our cars? I mean 04 mustang (rustang) cobras are going steady at 30k with 20k in miles all day, and there is a new body style out! Our cars just seemed to have tanked unbelievably fast to a value where its almost hard to let go of a V for under 30k :thepan: ...So I ask, whats the deal, are we ruining our own resale value possibly bc of : constantly ragging on the rear ends and all the problems instead....or has it been a domino effect...one private party sold his extremely low and the market followed in suit...I know these seem like lame reasons, but come on...how can a cadillac with an ls6 engine (you would think targeted a HUGE market of car enthusiasts in recent times), nav, and lots of other bells and whistles with 25k-40k miles on it in perfect condition with a 100k 6 yr warranty (the best thing IMO) not maintain its value

heavypedal
02-14-07, 01:07 PM
Good point.... thinking we are all fighting/fought/preparing to fight about this issue.

Thinking the point may come back to GM made, quality issues, breaking Cadillac's image, and that this is the first true iteration of breaking into this market (I think). Hopefully the 2008s and beyond do better.

I was shocked to see a $53K car selling for $33K....but then again, I saw the value it buying this car used. Lets just say YOU CANNOT BEAT THE BANG FOR BUCK ;)

Let the debate continue....

T

odla
02-14-07, 01:23 PM
do you think that people just not knowing about these cars could be effecting
resale. only real car guys seem to know about these cars.

04CTSVFLA
02-14-07, 01:23 PM
true pedal.....it is just still kind of wierd

04CTSVFLA
02-14-07, 01:24 PM
olga very good point....

joshdctsv
02-14-07, 01:32 PM
I think this is the first wave of consumer forums impacting vehicles. I attended an automotive convention a few months ago and forums/blogs were a very hot topic for the OEMs. Particularly, how to control the messaging and respond appropriately to minimize backlash.

Interestingly, Cadi intentionally targeted a niche demographic (upper middle class Male, 25-50, sport/speed enthusiasts, tech/gadget fans) that is most likely to use these still new (relative to their world) Internet tools. I don't think they considered it, or they would have had a strategy for interacting with us. As a result, I would suggest there is 100x more info (good and bad) about our cars than 90+% of the vehicles on the road today. Human nature, of course, is to focus on the bad and I think the market now reflects that.

From what I've seen, most vehicle models have at least one viable forum now (less than 2 years ago, I would say it was maybe 20%, at best) and general consumers are just now figuring it out. They, too, will soon be filled with numerous complaints and over time I would expect it to even out.

One other contributor, I think, is that the already small targeted niche (esp for manual trans) for this car is probably much more likely to buy New than Used.

ZEUSROTTY
02-14-07, 01:35 PM
They are still a fairly sought after car... when i roll through or next to a guy that knows what this car can do, I still get the gawking and the comments. Then the others ask what it is... I tell em its my Grandpas car... They just smile...

v-ape
02-14-07, 01:43 PM
No one knows about the "V". There is no demand.

To be honest, I didnt until a month before I bought one. M, AMG, and to some extent S's are well known. V is new and not many people know about the V-series. Almost every single person I talk to laughs when I say I take a Cadillac to the track. The phrase doesnt make sense to most and visions of Coupe DeVilles go in to their heads.

Also, check out YouTube. With all due respect to Dado for his drift events and rgd at the track (others I've missed too). Most vids are of V's getting beat by not so awesome cars, or extrememly strong guys talking about it in Silvester Stalone kind of way (hilarious btw, Dean and the cops look for me too).

Someone needs to post a bunch of "kill" vids, the problem is, the V crowd isnt in to that. IMO

alcast082
02-14-07, 01:57 PM
There are more than enough people tracking this car, modifiying and yes even drag racing. The main thing is ,
AM I GOING TO HAVE A CAMERA IN THE CAR:bigroll:
WHO IS GOING TO HOLD IT IF IM ALONE??? :confused:
IF I HOLD IT HOW DO I SHIFT OR NOT CRASH:eek:

I don't think kill videos are the answer.
If you want to atract sport enthusiasts you should show them what the car can do in the magazines. WHY would GM let magazines test a car with rsa and no fg2 against the likes of an rs4 or pretty soon a 335i.
Please, GOOD tires make a big difference in 0-60, slalom, skidpad and braking distances.

There are little issues like; lack of aesthetic aftermarket parts (body kit, spoiler, airdams bla bla bla), the whole 6 lug issue which entails very expensive rims with limited looks. The big issue as someone previously said is the CADILLAC IMAGE.
OH wait and here is another big thing, GM IS NOT DOING SO WELL.
This means they are proned to offer bigger discounts to attract buyers(cts-v for 39,999) Come on that is hurting resale tremendously.
WHY BUY A USED ONE:rant2: When you are getting 13000 of sticker:thepan:

OK I"ll stop ranting

rand49er
02-14-07, 02:06 PM
Hell, yeah, we're hurting ourselves by meanmouthing our cars. In some cases (the dif), the car deserves it.

But, this car overall is absolutely fantastic. I pity the guys who elect to or are forced to sell into this used V market. Thank goodness I'm not selling. A major factor is the car is unknown to most people out there.

Further, I gotta believe that the used V market is going to suddenly firm up. Especially with gasoline prices behaving themselves.

Great comments and perspectives by others here btw.

austin
02-14-07, 03:33 PM
Good point.... Actually, we "all" are in charge of the resale value. Most of us just don't realize it!! 1st off, we "all" need to hold off on accepting low prices when selling our "V's" used. If used "V's" keep selling for, say, $28,000 (or what ever), because kelly blue book says so, then that will be the way it goes. If we all, as a "V" owners community, say hey, no way, the lowest used price we will accept for, say a 2004, is $33,000 (or what ever), and then we "all" stick to it, then the value will stay there.... So sell them cheap, give them away, and i guarantee you the resale value will steadily go away with it!! :)

heavymetals
02-14-07, 04:13 PM
Where did you whiners (about resale value) ever get the idea that a car is an "investment"? :thepan:

The V is a hot rod, and someday (probably and I hope I live long enough) may become considered a collectible.

Until then, if you trade in or sell, your at the mercy of the market.

sefa01
02-14-07, 04:25 PM
This was the first car that I paid MSRP for (my C6 Z06 is now the second) and I fully expected it to depreciate more than BMW, Mercedes et al.

I think the reliability is really a small factor--although mine has been in for warranty repairs for more than 80 days since I bought it in April of 2004. This car is for a niche audience. It's a four-door sedan that isn't nearly as sexy as Mustangs, Corvettes and other youth-oriented cars. And because it has a six-speed transmission, at least 75% of the population wouldn't be interested.

In short, this is a real enthusiasts' car and, even among this group, it appeals to a small segment. That's why GM has produced so few.

I didn't buy it as an investment and can't get upset about my car being worth less than 50% of what I paid for it 34 months ago. I still get a big smile every time I drive it. Which is still quite a bit, even though I have the C6 Z06.

odla
02-14-07, 05:30 PM
Im actually kind of glad that no one knows about these cars to tell you the truth, because it makes it that much better. I always get comps where ever i go. At work i get comps and i work where they sell $60,000 stangs that can compete with a c6 zo6. I live in miami, and i have only seen 1 other true v. Oh and about those vids of v getting beat, 1st we are stock cars in the vids , the cars we race in the vids are not, They put a minimum as much money into there car when they could have bought a v and been better off. Ours is still a sleeper. Also its nice to know that we bought a car that competes with $80,000 plus cars, for a fraction of their cars cost. sorry this was long. Im just happy to have my v!

JJKJ
02-14-07, 05:48 PM
Not to be harsh, but anyone saying that we as sellers are establishing market value by selling cheap is wrong. Simple supply and demand market, if the price is too low, there'll be too many buyers and drive the price up. If there's not a demand, then buyers can be more selective in their process and get a better deal.

Ebay isn't the best example but take this into consideration: a nice low-mileage V is posted for sale on Ebay, bidders are free to bid until they get to what they think the car is worth. Some say Ebay is a bad example because there are only bargain-hunters that buy cars there. My answer to that is take a look at how many $50k (coupe) and 60k (convertible) GT500's have sold on Ebay (at that rate well beyond MSRP). Buyers always set market value, not sellers. If our cars created the same type of demand as a GT500, then they'd be selling for good prices anywhere including Ebay. As a side note, I've sat in and looked around a GT500 and I don't understand the hype. It's just a Mustang--a nice looking and powerful Mustang but still an over-priced Mustang.

The main problem with reselling our cars is demographics. The V is marketed towards those with good income. Most of us are able to buy new. If not, we'd just rather wait a year or two more to save enough money to buy new. It takes a very large depreciation from new cost and a car in near new condition to entice us away from buying new. As I have been considering a C6 Corvette lately, I've been on their forum regularly. Current C6 sellers are experiencing the same depressed market that the V is for the same reason. Everyone wants new and the only way they'll consider used is if the price is considerably less than new.

John

Koooop
02-14-07, 06:59 PM
What problem with resale?

I paid $40,000 for my '05 V 26 months ago

It's worth $30,000 today after I drove it 25,000 miles

WHAT PROBLEM? What other 4 door luxury hot rod could I have bought and had it depreciate a significant amount less than $10,000 over 26 months? (insert crickets chirping here).

It's a car, a depreciating asset.

The last production year of nearly any car is always given away, $13,000 off sticker? Heck, you could buy these a year ago new for $11,000 off sticker, dealers are only giving an extra $2,000 to clear the lot! I fully expected my V to be worth about $24,000 right now, it's worth about $30,000!

1990 ZR1 Corvettes were 40k over sticker at $100,000 (and GM dealers sold plenty at $100k), today you can get a 1990 with 25,000 or so miles for $30,000 or better. If you are looking for an investment, consider Real Estate or the stock market, it'll work out better than a new car.

Luna.
02-14-07, 07:06 PM
OH wait and here is another big thing, GM IS NOT DOING SO WELL.
This means they are proned to offer bigger discounts to attract buyers(cts-v for 39,999) Come on that is hurting resale tremendously.
WHY BUY A USED ONE:rant2: When you are getting 13000 of sticker:thepan:

OK I"ll stop ranting

While I do not believe that GM's current struggles have anything at all to do with the resale value of CTS-Vs, I will say he hit the nail right on the head regarding the primary reason CTS-Vs resale value has fallen off so much...

NEW Vs HAVE BEEN DISCOUNTED TOO MUCH. That's the primary driver right there. Look no further.

As stated above, why buy used when you can have new??


Buyers always set market value, not sellers.


Oh, I'm not so sure I agree with this sentiment. Fair market value is established when a willing buyer and willing seller consumate a transaction in the open market. The buyer surely doesn't hold all the cards in this equation. Apologies, but that's just not correct.

austin
02-14-07, 07:54 PM
>Where did you whiners (about resale value) ever get the idea that a car is an "investment"?

The majic genie says the answer to your question is right Here: http://www.barrett-jackson.com/ :)

joshdctsv
02-14-07, 09:34 PM
What problem with resale?

I paid $40,000 for my '05 V 26 months ago

...

To be fair, you bought (slightly, granted) used. I would venture that most of us disappointed in depreciation are those who bought new and took the huge off-the-lot hit PLUS the ongoing quick depreciation compared to others in the market. In fact, your story is very telling. At the time you bought, many were still paying $48k for an identical New. The first 1500 miles, then, cost us $8k! I think this adds value to the "this niche generally buys new" argument.

Another thing we should all remember is the $1500 gas guzzler tax. That one's not coming back in resale :)

rand49er
02-14-07, 09:41 PM
I don't think anyone here thinks of the car as an investment ... not even close. The point of this thread is that a bunch of us, after buying new a couple of years ago for a few dollars under MSRP, have taken a beating (if we choose to view the car's worth at present).

A really good point made above is the discount the dealers have offered to move the car off their lots ... probably more than anything, that's what's killing the value. Why buy used, when for a couple of bucks more, you can have new?

JJKJ
02-14-07, 09:43 PM
Oh, I'm not so sure I agree with this sentiment. Fair market value is established when a willing buyer and willing seller consumate a transaction in the open market. The buyer surely doesn't hold all the cards in this equation. Apologies, but that's just not correct.

Sure it is. Sellers can try to influence the market by either increasing or decreasing supply, but it is ultimately the buyer who sets the price. Demand sets the price for everything with the exception of artificially supported, subsidized products, monopolies or oligopolies. For the purposes of this discussion though, the V fits into none of these catagories.

Again, a quick reference back to the GT500 vs the V (I like to use this example because the current demand and pricing for the GT500 defies all logic to me). Both Ford and GM decide to make a limited-production high-performance vehicle; one the GT500 and one the V. Both advertise and let the car mags hype the performance. Both set an MSRP. The V now sells around $11k off of MSRP; the GT500 sells for between $5k and $10k over MSRP. The difference? The V is a few years old and the GT500 brand new. So if we go with the idea that the seller (mfr) sets the selling price, both of these vehicles would be selling for MSRP. Instead due to what buyers are willing to pay (even on two limited-production items) one sells for much more than the other. Remember a seller can never sell an item without a buyer with money; on the other hand, in our consumable-rich environment there's always an alternative for the buyer to purchase.

John

joshdctsv
02-14-07, 10:09 PM
Ah, yes, lest we forget... the GM Family Discount!! That was absolutely a significant factor. GM (and the rest) basically reset market in a desperate attempt to save them self from their financial crisis. They did so two-fold:
1) Moving buyers forward in their next-purchase cycle. Consumers were buying vehicles earlier than they would have normally. Used vehicle supply increased.
2) Forced used values downward in tandem since demand for used decreased with such small delta between used-new price during the program. Used prices certainly didn't rebound when they ended the program, though.

The_Groundhog
02-14-07, 10:24 PM
I agree the resale price seems to be low. Although I just benefited from that. :) I picked up my 2005 with 26K miles for $34,500. I agree that the cars are really not known. I was all set to pick up a used M3 when I ran across this in a used car lot. I was glad I found it because I love it, and I still have an American car. :rock:

ctsvett
02-15-07, 01:59 AM
My opinions..

1. The GM employee discount occured during the 05 product cycle which lowered the bar and devalued EVERY car in the market. Also 0%.

2. Gas prices going up and more people are buying hybrid crap. ie Less demand.

3. Some dealers were initially marking these cars up. Cady tried to pull that crap on me and it initially drove me away. How many others did that happen to (this was in 2004). Then they had to put lots of incentives on the cars to move them for the above reasons.

4. These cars are a niche car. Not everyone was considering cadillac a performance car before the V came out. Its only available in manual which further limits its market. Most people who can afford a 50k car, dont want manual- simply put.

5. Value will steady over time as reliability stabilizes and is better understood. Long term, the value of this car will be good if it is well taken care of in my opinion. Especially if you consider the shift toward more fuel efficient cars.

Heavy is right, a car is not an investment.

Personally, I am going to keep my V because I like it and I have fun driving it.

Reed

Koooop
02-15-07, 04:06 PM
I agree the resale price seems to be low. Although I just benefited from that. :) I picked up my 2005 with 26K miles for $34,500. I agree that the cars are really not known. I was all set to pick up a used M3 when I ran across this in a used car lot. I was glad I found it because I love it, and I still have an American car. :rock:


I thought my '05 with 27,000 miles was worth $30,000!

Bless you my child!

svassh
02-15-07, 04:17 PM
Again, a quick reference back to the GT500 vs the V (I like to use this example because the current demand and pricing for the GT500 defies all logic to me). Both Ford and GM decide to make a limited-production high-performance vehicle; one the GT500 and one the V. Both advertise and let the car mags hype the performance. Both set an MSRP. The V now sells around $11k off of MSRP; the GT500 sells for between $5k and $10k over MSRP. The difference? The V is a few years old and the GT500 brand new. So if we go with the idea that the seller (mfr) sets the selling price, both of these vehicles would be selling for MSRP. Instead due to what buyers are willing to pay (even on two limited-production items) one sells for much more than the other. John

Not a good comparison IMO. The Mustang has a rich and storied history behind it, especially the Shelby models. Lots of nostalgia aorund the Mustang etc. The V has no such history but this first run 04-07 set a good foundation. Cadillac has no credibility in the HP car market and tried to get some quick wins with the CTS-V (note the Vette engine, again that nostalgia and history thing). The STS-V and XLR-V have not faired nearly as well. Next step for Caddy if they are serious will be to turn dealer perception that this car and its ownership demographics are the future of Cadillac.

Koooop
02-15-07, 04:23 PM
Comparing resale of a 2 door vs. a 4 door doesn't work.

Comparing the resale of an econobox vs. a luxo car doesn't work.

I'm still waiting to hear which high performance 4 door I could have bought, driven for over 2 years and had the value go down just $10,000 (heck if Groundhog paid a fair price we could say my car only went down $5,500 in 26 months!)

Which seedan? Huh? Huh?

JJKJ
02-15-07, 04:50 PM
Not a good comparison IMO. The Mustang has a rich and storied history behind it, especially the Shelby models. Lots of nostalgia aorund the Mustang etc. The V has no such history but this first run 04-07 set a good foundation. Cadillac has no credibility in the HP car market and tried to get some quick wins with the CTS-V (note the Vette engine, again that nostalgia and history thing). The STS-V and XLR-V have not faired nearly as well. Next step for Caddy if they are serious will be to turn dealer perception that this car and its ownership demographics are the future of Cadillac.

I guess I failed at making the overall big point. I wasn't comparing the two cars, history or credibility. What I was pointing out is that one car currently has a large demand and buyers are paying premiums for that car. One car does not have a large demand and sellers have to discount significantly to sell. My big-picture point here is that if sellers set market prices then both would sell for MSRP (hence the definition of MSRP). However, since it is my view that buyers set market price, I used these two examples that show demand (buyers) set market price, not sellers. For the comparison I'm trying to make, I could've used any two products that have low vs high demand. I just happened to use two products that we all are familar with and enjoy discussing.

When mfrs are in the process of creating a new product, they define many variables, one of which is demographics. Once the demographic and market are defined, the mfr then does extensive research to determine what price the market will bear for that product. They then produce the product to meet that market price. Mfr's don't say "well we'll create this new product and set an arbitrary price". It all has to do with that the market (demand/buyers) will sustain.

John

svassh
02-15-07, 06:15 PM
I guess I failed at making the overall big point. I wasn't comparing the two cars, history or credibility. What I was pointing out is that one car currently has a large demand and buyers are paying premiums for that car. One car does not have a large demand and sellers have to discount significantly to sell. My big-picture point here is that if sellers set market prices then both would sell for MSRP (hence the definition of MSRP). However, since it is my view that buyers set market price, I used these two examples that show demand (buyers) set market price, not sellers. For the comparison I'm trying to make, I could've used any two products that have low vs high demand. I just happened to use two products that we all are familar with and enjoy discussing.

When mfrs are in the process of creating a new product, they define many variables, one of which is demographics. Once the demographic and market are defined, the mfr then does extensive research to determine what price the market will bear for that product. They then produce the product to meet that market price. Mfr's don't say "well we'll create this new product and set an arbitrary price". It all has to do with that the market (demand/buyers) will sustain.

John

Agreed and well stated

Wanna-V
02-15-07, 06:54 PM
The only reason the 2003 & 2004 Cobra's are holding their value is because the Dealers, not the Manufacturer, have priced out many of the Cobra buyers on the new Shelbys by their mark-ups to 55-65k. Ford came out with the MSRP and it is the Dealers that said, we are going to take advantage and gouge the buyer/enthusiast. In this case, the MSRP that Ford set, market studies or not, is arbitrary. The only option a buyer has is to step back and buy the SuperCharged 03 and 04's. 2 Years ago, you could get a Cobra cheaper than a stick of Juicy Fruit because of all the issues from the 99, 00, and 01 production years. I own a 2003 Cobra and was slated to get the Shelby, but when my dealer called to tell me that they would be asking 65k on a 40k MSRP I couldn't even think about getting a Mustang - Shelby or not. I love my Cobra, but at 65k you are in a totally different car. That's why I am now looking at the V. Luxury, Sport, Power and Class - all under 55k.

Also, this is not a mainstream vehicle. There is a very focused group of car enthusiasts that know about this car - the run of the mill car guy isn't talking about Caddy V's. my thoughts...Robin

rand49er
02-15-07, 07:29 PM
Wanna-V, get yourself a V and put a maggie on it (like I'm planning to do), and you'll be even more happy than if you'd gone the Cobra route. :highfive:

JimmyH
02-15-07, 09:19 PM
If you are worried about resale value, you must not like your car very much. If you do, drive it into the ground; then you wont have to worry what it is worth.

My 160000 mile standard-tranny Nissan is worth practically nothing, except to me.

zozmanCTS-V
02-15-07, 09:46 PM
If you are worried about resale value, you must not like your car very much. If you do, drive it into the ground; then you wont have to worry what it is worth.

My 160000 mile standard-tranny Nissan is worth practically nothing, except to me.

You are correct. Let's see if I can add some more gas to the fire. The guys who are concerned so much about the resale value of their cars are those who paid too much for them to begin with. "Gee, I don't want to lose too much since I already over-paid window price for it!" Anybody who paid window price for their V is naturally going to be miffed. Specialty cars like that cater to the select few and will never be re-sale marvels. For example, when the bottom falls out of the C6Z06 craze and those idiots who paid $20K over sticker really see the ecomonic reality of it when the C7Z arrives, I'll be laughing. Buy low sell high applies to stocks. Buy high, sell high applies to Barret-Jackson. Buy low, don't sell relies on good common sense. Right now, the 2001 Z06 can be had dirt cheap. 2002 Z06 the best year value. The 2004-2005 CTS-V also a consumer's best buy. These are performance cars for the select. Keep them. Enjoy them. But forget the resale. :thumbsup:

V-Love
02-15-07, 09:55 PM
We are the first group of high performance Cadillac nuts. Hopefully, we are the start of a long heritage of high performance enthusiasts like Mustang has. Then, mabey someday, the 04-07's will be worth something. There has to be 10 thousand V's out there(04-07). Thats a lot. I agree the depreciation sucks but the car is worth it to me. It is so fun to drive.
I also hope GM high performance nuts are reading this forum every other day like me(O.K. everyday). If all goes well and the next version CTS-V is even more off the wall, we are all gonna want one. I figure a lot of us may sell to upgrade and flood the market. Will the resale drop even more???
By the way you GM lurkers....keep it under 58K.

DougTampaCTSV
02-16-07, 03:28 PM
I have an '06 that was purchased brand new in July. It just turned 2,000mi, has never even been wet. From the dealer I added the spoiler and a stock CTS console armrest box. This car is in better conditon than delivered with the oil change at 1,000 mi and I has the clearcoat worked on with 'silk' claercoat papaer to take out some of the orangepeeel - absolutely gorgeous.
Earlier this week I go into the same dealer for a test drive promotion that was giving away tickets to the Outback Pro-am this weekend. I chose to test a '07 STSV (outstanding car!) The dealer follow-up by offering me $37 for my V - absolutely top dollar??? My car listed at $51+ with the sunroof. I paid approx $48k. That's 23% depreciation from my purchase price and 29% from list in 5 months with a car that is not even broken-in. They want $23,000. plus my car for a left over '06 STSV. The original list to list diff was $21,000!
I will continue to proudly drive my V. Car people know what it is; a low production sedan rocket that cost a fair amount of money. the fact that it is worth about as much as many standar sedans will not come up.

Koooop
02-16-07, 03:35 PM
The resale will drop to where it should be when the new V hits the road.

Just like it dropped on the M5, Z06 etc., when those new models hit the road.

If you want to see real depreciation go look at the Maserati Quattroporte resale value. AAAHHHHHHHGGGG!

DougTampaCTSV
02-16-07, 03:42 PM
I have an '06 that was purchased brand new in July. It just turned 2,000mi, has never even been wet. From the dealer I added the spoiler and a stock CTS console armrest box. This car is in better conditon than delivered with the oil change at 1,000 mi and I has the clearcoat worked on with 'silk' clearcoat paper to take out some of the orangepeel - absolutely gorgeous.
Earlier this week I go into the same dealer for a test drive promotion that was giving away tickets to the Outback Pro-am this weekend. I chose to test a '07 STSV (outstanding car!) The dealer follow-up by offering me $37 for my V - absolutely top dollar??? My car listed at $51+ with the sunroof. I paid approx $48k. That's 23% depreciation from my purchase price and 29% from list in 5 months with a car that is not even broken-in. They want $23,000. plus my car for a left over '06 STSV. The original list to list diff was $21,000!
I will continue to proudly drive my V. Car people know what it is; a low production sedan rocket that cost a fair amount of money. the fact that it is worth about as much as many standard sedans will not come up.

chrisalteregokelley@
02-16-07, 05:14 PM
I purchased my 2004 V w/ 17k miles from a CADI dealer who was also the original owner in Bedford IN last year for about $34k. Initially, I was in the market for a slightly used 4 door sport luxury sedan and looked at IS300, G35, and 330 for around $25-$30k. Over the course of several months I would see the CTS-V pop up for about $30. I started looking at them a little closer and discovered that the CTSV comes fully loaded with a V8. Then I looked at what comparable V8’s were going for and sure enough the 540i’s were going for $40K+. I saw a deal with the clean title CTSV for $34k fully loaded and jumped on it.

Just this morning someone saw me pull in to a parking lot and they said they loved the look of this car and asked what I did to it. I mentioned this is how it rolls off the line stock. I mentioned the V8 and 6MT and they didn’t believe me! Only a few people know what this car is and most CADI drivers (grandpa) don’t want a 6MT sports car and that’s were the low demand comes in. This is one of the first muscle cars that Cadi is bringing to the market and it’s a great car. Us young folks (I’m 28) just did know they were out there and that’s why I started with G35 and the IS300. Cadi needs to find a way to market to the younger crowd. It’s a fun car to drive and the compliments still roll in…

We all know that cars are not investments and they lose value once off the lot and over the first 2 years. Buy it because you love driving it or get a Toyota Fit – you can’t lose much if it’s only $15k out the door.

urbanski
02-16-07, 05:56 PM
its almost caturday

JimmyH
02-17-07, 10:38 AM
In my experience the only cars that have good resale value are Lexus, a few Toyotas (Camry Corolla) and a few Hondas (Accord Civic). Everything else depreciates very fast.

Anyone who would pay $40k for a used BMW is nuts.

onebadcad
02-17-07, 11:00 AM
If anyone bought a V, new or used, as an investment, they made a poor decision. There are many factors that figure into the equation, such as income, usage, functionality, other car options, term of ownership, etc..., but nothing I have ever read says the V will retain its value well when compared with other similar or dissimilar vehicles. The rear-end issue alone is reason enough to stay away if you are thinking short-term ownership. The known depreciation is another reason. Honda Civics do real well in the pre-owned market, but why would anyone buy one of those unless they were a commuter student or a pizza delivery guy. I do think threads on the forum bashing our cars are harmful for those who are selling, but such will always be prevalent on a public forum, and sellers will be hurt. In retrospect, nothing available at the time of my purchase and through today comes close to the V, so I am happy, very happy with my decision. Food for thought, if you are a V detractor and sell your car for less than you think it is worth, ask yourself how much you contributed to that.

rand49er
02-17-07, 11:03 AM
... or get a Toyota Fit ...Or a Honda Echo. :D

CVP33
02-17-07, 11:12 AM
You guys must have Stockholm syndrome. Quit blaiming yourself for the resale value and put the blaim squarely where it belongs.......GM.

1) Let's agree that VERY few know about the V. - GM needs more AD $'s.
2) GM overproduced the V and have excess inventory which led to discounts. - Easy fix here.
3) GM released a car with significant and known flaws. - OK, I'm not going there.
4) Some very high profile, highly visible owners had numerous issues with their vehicles and were not resolved properly. - GM has over-aggressive Area Service Managers with marching orders that seem counter-intuitive to serving customer/owner/enthusiasts.

In the internet age, we're all going to know what "warts" every new model has. There are no more quiet recalls or secret TSB's. If your product is flawed everything else will fall apart as well, including resale value.