: STS/SLS v. ETC/Eldorado v. Mark VIII



I~LUV~Caddys8792
11-06-06, 10:04 PM
OK so after driving that '99 ETC today, I know I want either a Northstar Cadillac or a Mark VIII next. I'd prefer to get the SLS or Eldorado because the LD8 has more usable power in the lower end of the power range, the L37 (atleast the 1999 version) is too high strung for me, not enough low end power. But I've been told that the '93-'97 versions feel faster, and that would probably mean more low end power. Is the '93-'97 L37 a more robust motor?

While I initially like the LD8 Northstar more, I like the looks of the STS more than the looks of the SLS, the hood ornament doesn't really do it for me. Plus, I've heard that the STS/ETC handles a bit better than the SLS/ Eldorado. Is that true? I thought the ride that the '99 ETC offered was fine, I wouldn't want a smoother riding car, so the SLS/ Eldorado's softer ride really has no benefits for me, but that isn't a big strike against it or anything, it's really quite trivial.

As much as I'd like to stick with Cadillac, I have to wonder if the VIII has any major advantages over the Eldorados. If I remember correctly from looking at that '95 Mark VIII a while back, it doesn't have the high beltline that the Eldorado has, which will give it a more airy feeling, which I really like. Also, I think that the VIII has the smoother ride, which is really not something I'm looking for in a performance coupe. But the VIII doesn't have that high quality feeling that the Eldorado does.. it uses cheaper materials and such, and I don't recall the seats being anything spectacular..

All input is appreciated!

SpeedyArizona
11-06-06, 10:32 PM
Well the price difference is quite substantial between a Mark VIII vs an Eldorado or Seville. A '98 Mark VIII will set you back $6000-$7000 while a '98 or '99 Eldorado will be closer to $11,000-$13,000. Nearly double the price which might be a deal breaker.

I don't know if the older Eldorado's have more low-end torque but does it really matter? I mean the engine is powerful enough. I like my Eldorado and it gets plenty of compliments, in my opinion they are MUCH better looking than the Mark VIII's. The interior are a higher quality with better materials used throughout.

If it were up to me I'd pick the Eldorado.

CadillacSTS42005
11-06-06, 10:33 PM
ok out of everyone i can give about the best opinion i think because i have all three at my disposal
the LD8 is in my moms 96 Deville off the line shell chrip them and lay tire better than my ETC, when im going about 70-80 i can drop the hammar and i swear to god the whole front end lifts up cars thrown back and your off but the speedo doesnt show it....

The 93 Northstar in my dads 93 ETC which i learned on (Reason i got my 97 ETC) had alot more road feel to the point that it was down right like my WS6 Trans AM (though having 2 blown struts in the front probably didnt help), I swear to god that car had more power stock to stock than my 97 ETC even though mine has 5 more hp. I assume that to be due to added weight of mine with the stability and other added things along with my stereo and other things

My 97 ETC stock i agree i had that nail it no go issue at 60-70, my exhaust stoped that perminantly it was like it was bogged down and my stock exhaust was the cork on it, i drop the hammar now on the car and she gets up and GOES (also keep in mind a clean tb deff helps that too the one on the 99 you drove prob was never clean). It handels firmer than my moms floaty Deville (omg i HATE how floaty that car is you can cut the wheel left and right and theres sooo much body roll)

Also my dad had a 91 Mark i believe (not 100% on the year)
Not too bad a car but it has major downfalls
1 pray to god you dont have any airbag issues
2 good luck in the snow
pluses
1 stang motor many mods
2 aftermarket so you can always tweak what you dont like

CadillacGurl
11-06-06, 10:36 PM
Personally I like Eldo's I wouldn't be able to tell you about the Marks. Jay would, his father has a Mark back in the day and also a blue Eldo. He would be able to tell you the input on both very throughly. Eldos to me have more power, they are a fun little cars hehe.

Edit: yeah I spoke too late ^^^^

CadillacSTS42005
11-06-06, 10:38 PM
Personally I like Eldo's I wouldn't be able to tell you about the Marks. Jay would, his father has a Mark back in the day and also a blue Eldo. He would be able to tell you the input on both very throughly. Eldos to me have more power, they are a fun little cars hehe.

Edit: yeah I spoke too late ^^^^

little????
Last time i checked your daddys Yukon XL only had a foot or two on my ETC length wise hahaha

TomDeville
11-06-06, 10:38 PM
I am experiencing a similar thought
process; in that I am contemplating
those exact vehicles for my next
winter car.

I suspect that you have answered your
own question.

You're not Chadilincoln; You are The
Chadillac.

I would drive an ETC over any other
Coupe; nonetheless, a splendid Mark8
is easier to mod and cheaper to fix;
if desired ;or, required.


TomDeville:cool2:
:cool2:

slk230mb
11-06-06, 10:40 PM
Wasn't the only Northstar powered Cadillac in 1993 the Allante?

CadillacSTS42005
11-06-06, 10:41 PM
Nope
1993 the ETC STS and Allante all got the N*
believe me im 100% about the year and engine in that car
I was driving it when it threw a rod and being a N* it was cheaper to sell the car then fix it something my dad has never let me forget

CadillacGurl
11-06-06, 10:43 PM
little????
Last time i checked your daddys Yukon XL only had a foot or two on my ETC length wise hahaha

Haha yes this is true. 97 ETCs are big suckers. We did line up my father's Yukon Denali XL along his ETC are they were pretty close lenght wise. It shocked me haha. I do like his ETC to drive (espeically lay on the gas and hear the exhaust and the bass thump), its better than my Korean POS.

CadillacGurl
11-06-06, 10:49 PM
Nope
1993 the ETC STS and Allante all got the N*
believe me im 100% about the year and engine in that car
I was driving it when it threw a rod and being a N* it was cheaper to sell the car then fix it something my dad has never let me forget

That is also very true that the parts to replace on a caddy eldorado are very expensive + labor fee= ouch. I know from helping out Jay find parts and put them on, it can be quite a bitch. Ebay is a good source for cheap parts but working at a Chevy dealer you might be able to get some parts at a discount. You'd have to ask to make sure.

gary88
11-06-06, 11:25 PM
My Seville is 2 inches longer than my mom's Escalade :D

illumina
11-06-06, 11:36 PM
Pre '96 Mark VIII = serious mods.

dp102288
11-07-06, 08:55 AM
Yay for super long Cadillacs!!! My Eldo is longer than our minivan. :D

I love the Eldo, but the parts + labor thing kills me sometimes. I would imagine, but never had experience with, that the Mark would be cheaper to deal with because they would be lots more things that could be done.

Are there any around you that you could look at?

Blackout
11-07-06, 11:25 AM
Pre '96 Mark VIII = serious mods.What do ya mean? But choosing between the Mark VIII and a ETC or STS is kinda hard to choose. The early Northstars are plagued with head gasket issues, they're FWD, and there is next to no aftermarket. The Mark VIII's are RWD, strong motor with plenty of mod's, you can pick them up for next to nothing, but there are plenty of negative too. The 1st gen's halogen headlamps blow. If you were to get a 1st gen I would highly suggest a 95-96 LSC because those comes with HID's. If you really want a 1st gen and can't find a LSC then your looking at over a grand to get the LSC headlights to convert it over. Another issue with the first gen is the rear window. The molding that goes around it starts to bubble up and looking kinda nasty. Unfortunatly if you want to replace it you have to buy a whole new rear window because Ford doesn't offer the molding by itself. One last issue with the 1st gen's is the tranny pan. it wasn't deep enough so sometimes when go WOT or giving it gas while making a turn the car will hesitate because it's not getting any fluid. There is a fix for it though and its pretty cheap. They have an updated tranny pan to replace the original one (all it is is a tranny pan from the 2nd gen's) and its deeper so it fix's the problem. I have one for sale if anybody is interested btw as well as a tech manual for the 1995 Mark VIII. Hope this helps you out

I~LUV~Caddys8792
11-07-06, 08:51 PM
So after reading your responces (thanks all, especially Jay)

I have a few more questions:

1- Are the early (93-95?) Northstars more suceptible to head gasket problems than the newer ones? I'd prefer a '93-95 Eldorado/SeVille because they're cheaper to buy, and DRASTICALLY cheaper to insure if I go with Progressive. And, while the dashboard/ instrument cluster on the '96+ models may be nicer to look at, the '93-95 models have the better seats, and the DIC is easier to use, but not as easy to look at...lol, and the interior design is still good, but not as good as the 96+ models.

As for the Mark VIII, does it have any real advantages over the Eldorado other than the aftermarket (not a huge deal for me) and ease of access under the hood? But, Lincoln's labor prices will be as high as Cadillacs, and I work for a GM dealer, so they're more familiar with the Northstar (even though ALL of the techs HATE that motor), and I could get discount prices on parts and labor.

Between the '93 ETC you describe Jay, and the '99 ETC I drove, the '93 takes the cake. More power, better handling, more road feel. Is the powerband any wider on the '93? Did your father have any HG issues with it? Personally, I like the exterior styling on the '93-94's more..cleaner lines, better wheels, less "bling blingy", etc, etc.

You describe the ride in your mom's '96 as floaty, it's probably pretty close to the ride in my '92 deVille..it's only floaty to you because you're used to the Eldorado. Does the '96 have the same sort of struts as your Eldorado? I can't remember right now.

And yes Speedy, a lack of low end torque is quite important to me. I hate having to wind out the motor to get anything out of it. Maybe I've been spoiled with the torque laden 4.9 and LT1 350, but it's what I'm used to.

There's really very little chance I'd ever go with a Mark VIII, but I haven't test driven on in over a year, so I remember very little, but from comparing pics and reviews, the Eldorado takes the cake!

CadillacSTS42005
11-07-06, 09:02 PM
nope never a hg issue ever
we put 125k on the car before the idiots at pennzoil didnt put more than 5 qrts in it. We drove the car for about 1K miles after the change i had the car and it threw a rod no oil light nothing.

93-94 are the worst years for hg, the diff intakei think helps with the 95.

i learned to drive on my dads 93 etc but i mainly drove my moms car cuz she was always home dad had to work. moms 96 deville and it was ALWAYS floaty to me

theres alot of differences in the suspension on 93-95s too
smaller brakes
no stabilitrak
no ciws (or whatever its called)

I~LUV~Caddys8792
11-07-06, 09:30 PM
Oh I'm not saying it's not floaty to you, you're used to the tigher feeling in the Eldorados, but I've driven the old style of Brougham, and the '90s Town Cars, and my deVille feels like an M5 compared to those, and I'm sure the '96 feels about the same as my '92. But my '92 has the standard passive struts and no RSS or ICCS like the '96, which has the road sensing struts, (but not the continuously variable ones like the '96 Concours and your ETC have). So maybe your mom's RSS struts have gone bad, causing the floating feeling, but I'd assume that those would make the ride tigher than my '92 with the simple passive struts. But I'm sure the '96's floating feeling is nothing compared with your '74 Eldorado's ride.

So out of all the OBDI Northstars, the '95 is best?

CadillacSTS42005
11-07-06, 09:50 PM
nah
the 74 is alot more solid than the 96 i say
the steering isnt as tight though..

I~LUV~Caddys8792
11-07-06, 11:06 PM
Hmmm interesting.. There is a '98 DeVille for sale at a dealer close to me, I shall look at it soon.

CadillacSTS42005
11-07-06, 11:16 PM
too big for my tastes...
then again i was lookin to buy a fleetwood so what can i say lol