: Leaking? Engine mount? Advice...



anim8orCTSV
09-06-06, 06:29 PM
Hello all,

I went to the shop that I trust to change my oil and asked them if I could lift my car and clean my rear diff (as advised on this forum).

When they lifted my car and I looked at the rear diff there was fresh fluid on it and they told me to leave it dirty so the dealer can see it. It looks like the seal on the left side (going to the left wheel) is bad.

I am going to make an appointment today to take it in for service. While I had it up there another guy points out that there is a leak in the front and tells me that I may have a "leaking" engine mount (see images). The oil filter was just changed 700 miles ago so the fluid on it is new.

What does this mean exactly? Is it the engine mount?

On a side note, it seems that a lot of you guys get loaners when you get warranty work done. Is there any particular way I should approach this to see if they will hook me up with one, or a rental, or does this vary from dealer to dealer?

Any info would be great.

Thanks,
Paul
"Anim8orCTSV"

UPDATE: I already talked to the dealer about a loaner and they said they could probaly hook me up.

DILLIGAF
09-06-06, 06:41 PM
Motor mounts are fluid filled,don't know why,gm probably bought to much goop and needed a place to put it.You need new mount.You get a loaner when your car is in for warranty work,its part of the warranty.

heavymetals
09-06-06, 06:45 PM
Looks like it to me.

Something squirted liquid.

1QUICKV
09-06-06, 07:45 PM
my mount is bad too, and so is my rear leaking... are you sure you didit change the oil on my car? if i was to take a picture of my mount leak, it looks the same. Same mount too... the motor must want to twist that way. i still have'it took it to the dealer yet because i'm waiting for something else to go bad like the rear =) let me know what they do with the mount... i.e will they change both mounts? and the rear leak will they change the rear?

anim8orCTSV
09-07-06, 02:04 AM
I'm going in Monday. As soon as I hear anything I'll post it here.

-Paul

Anim8orCTSV

ewill3rd
09-07-06, 07:26 AM
Some fluid expulsion out of the vent is normal, the vent is on the top of the left side of the differential.
If it's coming from up top just clean it off.
If it's coming from the axle seal area leave it and get it fixed.

The mounts are fluid filled, it makes them work better.
When the liquid is gone, they really suck.
That fluid path is obviously from the left mount.
Get the mount replaced.
It's cracked on top.

atdeneve
09-08-06, 08:49 AM
I was under my car looking at the diff and I saw the same exact fluid pattern splattered on the bottom of the oil pan / oil filter and some on the exhaust. Thought it might have been the steering pump or something. The possibilty of it being the engine mount totally slipped by me. Thanks for the diagnosis. :highfive:

anim8orCTSV
09-08-06, 12:28 PM
Isn't this board great!

-Paul

Anim8orCTSV

ewill3rd
09-08-06, 05:57 PM
Usually you'll notice the engine goes into what feels like 'throws of death' when you shut the key off if the fluid has leaked out.
They really cushion the powertrain vibration effectively when they are full, but empty... oh man... it's ugly.

grandsport5
09-08-06, 06:02 PM
Funny I should see this post today. My dealer called me about three hours ago and wants me to bring in my V next Wednesday so they can check the motor mounts!

It's also interesting to note that I've suddenly developed a rough idle in the last couple of weeks. The engine also seems to buck when shutting off the key. They all may be related to the mount being empty. I don't seem to have and odd fluids under the car where I park it though and I would expect that if it were leaking.

anim8orCTSV
09-08-06, 08:30 PM
My garage floor is completly clean. As you can see in the photos above I do have a leak, unless you get under there and look I don't think you will see it.

In the last couple of weeks since my last oil change (which is when this leak started) I have also noticed a rough idle. No crazyness when I turn her off but the slightly rough idle is there.

-Paul

Anim8orCTSV

anim8orCTSV
09-14-06, 08:43 PM
Well,

I just picked up my V.

They told me that they could not fix the engine mount because they could not be sure that the fluid was from the engine mount. There was no fluid coming out of the mount but they had no explination as to where the fluid came from.

They suggested that it may have splashed up from the road. But as the photograph shows there are multiple paths of fluid that have dried so this was not a one time splash up event (if you see it in person it is more obvious).

Also, the path is clearly from the mount down. The rest of the area is completly clean above the point that the fluid hit the oil pan.

Now, on to the rear diff. They told me that they had to replace the vent valve with a newly designed vent valve and told me it was fixed.

I took it right back and asked to Service Manager to take a ride with me.

I shifted to 4th then eased off the gas (not engaging the clutch, leaving it in gear). I then hit the accelerator and the V would CLUNK. I never shifted it out of gear it just CLUNKED when I accelerated.

Of course the problem is worse now and the tech was telling me (not in exact words) that I did not know how to shift. And since this car has so much power it is going to do that.

I let him speak his piece and then said, "I have 6800 miles on this car and I never noticed it before, AND I do not drive it hard."

So the Service manager likes my suggestion to take out a new 07 for a test drive to see if I can duplicate the problem. Two problems arise...
1) the Battery is dead in the NEW car that is on the lot
2) the gas tank is empty - and we all know how accurate the fuel guages in Cadillacs are.

(Side Note: The DTS loaner I was given -with 1700 miles on it- had half a tank when I picked it up. I stopped for lunch and when I restarted it it had lost an 1/8th of a tank. Nice).

So as it stands they had my car for three days and did not fix anything. (another side note: they did not fix the XM problem since they had no clue what I was talking about -the issue with the XM bands dissappearing-. And since they could not reproduce the "R" light staying on they said nothing was wrong).

The good news is the Service Manager clearly felt the problem I was having with the CLUNKING and tomorrow I am supposed to go back and drive a new V to try to reproduce the problem.

Thanks for letting me vent.

-Paul
anim8orCTSV

heavymetals
09-14-06, 09:22 PM
The clunk could be caused by the motor mount.(DOH!)

1QUICKV
09-14-06, 10:16 PM
You Better Find A New Dealer After Free Test Drive Of The O7 V Or You Better Start Asking Some More Questions. I May Or May Not Bring My Car Into The Dealer Tomorrow Because oF The Rain. But When I Do Get Her In And They Tell Me A Once Upon Story I Will Demand A Fix. IT HAS TO BE THE MOTOR MOUNT ! NO IF AND OR MAYBE'S

lunarx
09-14-06, 10:42 PM
Dealer did not want to fix my motor mount either.
They say all is normal. :confused:

I need to drive some other cars to campare.
Let us know what you conclude also.

ewill3rd
09-15-06, 07:08 AM
Anim8,

You have to raise the engine up slightly and support it so you can feel the rounded part on top of the mount.
As you run your fingers over the top part of the mount you will find the place where the mount has cracked open allowing the fluid to run out.
Anyone who's ever even worked on a Deville should know what it looks like when the mount fluid drains out, but like I said before, if they are not familiar with the failure they might not even think it's possible.
Tell them a GM World Class technician looked at the pictures of your leak and told you that the motor mounts were bad.
If you are near the DC area, come see us and I'll fix almost every problem you outlined.

The nose bushing in the differential might be worn out, they might not know to look there either. We have seen a few of them. It's serviceable but you have to remove the diff to replace it.
I doubt the engine mount is causing the clunk. They are still pretty tight, they just lose their ability to dampen vibration.

You probably have a bad reverse switch in the transmission, I have replaced one for a similar concern in Homer's car and he has not been back with that problem. GM got mad at me and made me fill out a form because the transmission had recently been replaced and they couldn't believe that their precious part was bad.
The XM tuner might not be plugged in all the way, I have had a few.
There could be another problem but it's much less likely since it only affects certain models. The radio could be losing communication with the digital receiver (xm tuner). I'd have to take out the back shelf to check it out.
Like I said, I have seen a small number of them that left the factory with the connectors not plugged in all the way causing all sorts of wierd problems.

Good luck.

anim8orCTSV
09-15-06, 03:26 PM
I just returned from the dealer and they were real cool.

I took the print out of the XM notice from Cadillac and they are going to follow the instructions about it.

I also printed out your post EWILL3RD and he agreed and understood every point you made. They are going to contact engineering and set up a return appointment for me Monday.

The Manager said that her can clearly tell that the car is not shifting well and that there is no need for me to take a new V out for a test.

So I asked him, "When you guys give me my car back it will shift like it did when I bought it?"

And he answered with a confident, "Yes."

Just in case, when I pick up the car after all the repairs are done I am going to take out a new V and make sure that it is just as smooth.

Thanks again EWILL3RD for your post. It really helped alot. If I was in the DC area I would bring it to you but I am in Southern California so I think the miles on the loaner would be a little high :histeric:

-Paul
anim8orCTSV

grandsport5
09-15-06, 03:58 PM
I just got my V back from the dealer and sure enough, the motor mount has ruptured. They have ordered the mount and will call me when it comes in to replace it as the part seems to be unavailable.

ewill3rd
09-15-06, 08:29 PM
Glad to hear the info I posted was helpful.

Make sure the dealer understands I was just trying to help you, not throw them under the bus.

I consider the V to be more of a specialty car, not a lot of shops do much work on them compared to the volume of work they do on regular CTS. The V's are a little different in many ways and if you are not used to what breaks it's easy to be skeptical about what people claim is wrong with them.
We do a lot of the higher end Cadi performance car business at my store.
Part of that is my fault, the rest is James' fault.

I'd venture a guess that I do the bulk of the XLR work in the DC area. I know we get lots more of them in for service than we sell. I try to give personal attention to the performance car crowd when I have time. I used to be a Vette guy when I worked up in Vallejo CA, for 6 years.
I got tired of working for Chevy though.

But I digress.... LOL.

Most dealers are used to dealing with Deville and Seville and this new Sigma series of cars and the performance lines kind of have them out of their elements. Coming from Chevy and working on Vettes and Tahoes I usually do pretty good as I am right at home on the XLR, the V series cars and the Escalades.

Let us know how it all turns out.

lunarx
09-15-06, 08:31 PM
I just returned from the dealer and they were real cool.

I also printed out your post EWILL3RD and he agreed and understood every point you made. They are going to contact engineering and set up a return appointment for me Monday.

Thanks again EWILL3RD for your post. It really helped alot. If I was in the DC area I would bring it to you but I am in Southern California so I think the miles on the loaner would be a little high :histeric:

-Paul
anim8orCTSV
anim8orCTSV - What dealer did you go to?

Since you have broken your dealer in now, maybe I will have better luck with your dealer than the dealer where I bought my car.
BTW - I am also in SoCal, so I can get to your dealer.
You can email me (cadillacowners@eluna.info) if you want since you probably can't PM yet.

Thank God for World Class Technicians like ewill3rd. :worship:

anim8orCTSV
09-16-06, 12:28 PM
Make sure the dealer understands I was just trying to help you, not throw them under the bus.

Let us know how it all turns out.

EWILL3RD, The post did not come accross as you saying they were morons for not knowing what you did. When I handed it to him I made it clear that this was what you thought about my situation (from the point of view as someone who works on V's a lot and is familiar with these problems).

At no point did he push back at me about any of my problems, not at all. If he took offense I would have expected him to TRY to get out of any one of the issues.

-Paul
anim8orCTSV

anim8orCTSV
09-16-06, 12:38 PM
anim8orCTSV - What dealer did you go to?

I went to the Rally autogroup in Palmdale. Not sure where you are in So Cal but they have taken great care of me so far (although I did not buy the car from them).

Both the Service Department and the Body Shop have been great.

While I was as the Service Department the body shop Manager walked buy so I stopped him and asked him how I can get a few scratches out of the top of my trunk lid. He said, "Bring it by the body shop and I'll take care of it for you."

I wasn't asking him to fix it, I just wanted advice on how to. He then offers to do it for free. Pretty cool.


Thank God for World Class Technicians like ewill3rd. :worship:

No kidding.

-Paul
anim8orCTSV

anim8orCTSV
09-19-06, 04:15 PM
Ok. Here we go.

I went to the dealer today to check on the status of my 06 V with less than 7k miles on it.

First thing is, they are ordering me a new Radio for the XM issue.

Second, they are replacing the engine mount just in case.

Finally, and this is the kicker, the service manager says that GM says the clunking I am hearing is normal for the V.

I look at him an say, "are you serious?"

He says he understands what I am saying since he sees the problem. He recommends I take the general mananger, in service, for a ride to show him what I am talking about.

So the GM shows up and we go for a spin. I show him what I am talking about. He says that the report from GM is saying that is normal but he is going to get the Cadillac rep out here to check it out.

When we get back he tells us to take a new V out to see if it is as rough.

So we hop into an 06 Raven V and the Service Manager does his best to duplicate the problem. Even if he hammers on it, it does not sound or feel like mine. I ask him to let me try, and the moment I shit into 1st I say, "Look at that, I can't shift this smooth in my V. Not even close."

BTW, nothing even close to a clunk in this car.

He agrees that he noticed there was no way to shift smooth in my car unless you are driving it like a grandmother.

When we get back he tells the GM that there was absolutly no comparison between the two and that I definately have a problem.

The GM says that he will contact Cadiallac and have a rep come out and look at it.

So they gave me back my V (the bullshit part is I have had the V for months now and TODAY in the DTS I get a speeding ticket). Talk about timing.

-Paul
anim8orCTSV

p.s. Has anyone heard of and STS4? There was one at the dealer and no one knew what it was.
EDIT: Ah, it is a 4wd version. I just found out

MescalVto
09-19-06, 04:19 PM
Has anyone heard of and STS4? There was one at the dealer and no one knew what it was.

All wheel drive STS:bigroll:

lunarx
09-19-06, 10:34 PM
anim8torCTSV - Good Start :thumbsup:

Please keep us posted on how things go from here.
My car is in similar shape as yours w/ only 9.4K.
If there is a solve, we would all love to know what it is.:bouncy:

LowUFO
09-20-06, 10:25 AM
Dumb question, but are there any companies that make after-market urethane motor mounts? Energy Suspension? Prothane? Spectre? It seems like there might be a market for this? Am I wrong? Oh, and I am experiencing the exact same issues... Rought Idle, Violent Shaking when turning off the car, Etc.

Ian

lunarx
09-20-06, 11:46 AM
Dumb question, but are there any companies that make after-market urethane motor mounts? Energy Suspension? Prothane? Spectre? It seems like there might be a market for this? Am I wrong? Oh, and I am experiencing the exact same issues... Rought Idle, Violent Shaking when turning off the car, Etc.

Ian

Bump:

Heavy-duty-competition-mounts would be such a good thing.
Any exist?

anim8orCTSV
10-05-06, 12:32 PM
Latest update,

I dropped my V off on Monday and picked it up on Tuesday.

They relaced the XM radio and they replaced the Leaking Engine Mount.

The rough idle is gone.

I am still waiting for the Cadillac/GM rep to come in to hear my clunk problem. I am guessing it is either the Trans, Clutch or Rear Diff.

All I want is for my 06 with 7600 miles on it to shift like it did when it was new. Is that too much to ask.

I am told that the rep might be by in about 3 weeks. Could I be doing more damage to my V if I keep driving it? Should I press the issue?

What do you think?

-Paul
anim8orCTSV

ewill3rd
10-05-06, 02:38 PM
Did they check the bushing in the front of the rear differential?
I have seen a few of those fail causing a noise like you describe.

anim8orCTSV
10-14-06, 11:57 PM
So, I am driving back from getting dinner tonight and when the light turns green I hit the gas and in a couple seconds my V dies. I limp over to the shoulder and I try to turn it over a few times. No dice. When it does turn over it only keeps running for 5 to 10 seconds then it dies.

I call Onstar and ask them to do a diagnostic. It does not show any problems. Oh well.

At this point I have less than 8000 miles on my 06 V. I do not see how a $55k car should have any of the problems I am having.

1) Leaking Motor Mount
2) XM had to be replaced
3) Engine/Trans/Rear Diff issue.

I can understand the XM, they had to replace the Radio, but the other two points are a bit much considering how few miles I have on this car.

At least after they changed the Motor mount the rough idle went away.

Now I have been waiting, patiently, for three weeks for the "Cadillac" rep to come out to see how my V is shifting...

I should not have to wait three weeks for somone to look at my car and say, "Yes there is a problem" when the Service manager gets in the car and agrees with me. Even he can't get a smooth shift out of it.

I had an appointment set up for Tuesday because another V came in with the same issue (any one here from the Palmdale area going to the Rally dealer?) and they want to "look" at it to see if it is the same problem. Now my V is sitting at the dealer and I am stuck until Monday.

I am seriously considering trying to Lemon this car. I am having issue after issue.

I have had it in the shop 5 or 6 times so far and I am getting fed up. I mean if I do get it Lemoned I will most likely get another V but I am getting really irritated with this sh**. Come on, the Enterprise people don't even ask me my name when I come in. They just say, "Hey Paul, we'll be with you in a minute."

The only thing that could have made this worse is if my 3 1/2 year old was in the car. If she was, I am pretty sure I would show up at the dealer on Monday and basically read them the riot act. At least now I can still go the "good cop" route (I'm saving the "bad cop" routine until I have no other choice).

Oh, by the way, now the blower for the A/C is surging. Even when I am just sitting at idle.

What's next.

-Paul
anim8orCTSV

lunarx
10-15-06, 03:02 AM
anim8orCTSV,

I feel your pain and sympathize with your problems.
I think you are experiencing the reasons that F-Bodies and GTO's are no longer.
Great HP/$ cars but unfortunately they are saddled with lots of irritating mechanical issues and poor dealer service networks.
It's kind the price one pays for "affordable" perofrmance.
Many have decided, it's not worth it.
Not to say more expensive cars (Audi to find one to pick on) don't also have their fair share of problems.

The issues with your car certianly sound fixable.
The frustration lies in getting the service you are entitled to from a crappy dealer network.
Now I love my V but I hate having to take any car to a dealer for repairs on basic things that should never have had a problem.

I guess I'm saying, hang in there and try to get it resolved even if you have to resort to a private mechanic and paying out of your pocket.
I think the "value" of the V is high enough that you will still be ahead of the game compared to other cars on the market.
At least that is my hope, as I am leaning towards the private specialty mechanic route and bypassing the whole unplesant dealership non-service experience.

Please keep us all posted on what the dealer ends up doing for you if you elect to stay with that course of action.

anim8orCTSV
10-17-06, 02:52 AM
Ok guys here is the latest news.

I went in today to find out what was up with my car. They tell me that they need to put gas in it since the low fuel light is on. The Service person says when she got in the car the light was on and it showed low fuel.

I pull out my PDA and show them the picture of my Gas Guage when the car broke down. There was 1/8th of a tank left. When she got to it it was below empty.

So my car is sitting there in front of me (they pulled it right up). I look at her and say, "I'm not taking it, the trans/rear-diff needs to be fixed. I have waited four weeks and I want my New car to run like New, now. I have an appointment tomorrow and there is reason for me to take it home now and bring it back. Obviously there is a problem with the gas guage too so that may as well be addressed also."

She tells me to wait, and five minutes later she comes back with this guys and says, "Can you show him the clunking issue?"

It turns out he is a Driveline specialist and the moment he hears what I am talking about he knows what it is.

They put my car up and he shows me by pushing up on the front of the rear diff. It just lifts right up.

They need to replace the Support Bushing. It is at the front of the diff where it connects to the body.

As I heard the conversation, GM knows they have a problem with this and they are working on a redesign.

I should get my V back tomorrow or the next day. I'll let all of you know what happens.

-Paul
anim8orCTSV

ewill3rd
10-17-06, 08:24 AM
The nose bushing in the differential might be worn out, they might not know to look there either. We have seen a few of them. It's serviceable but you have to remove the diff to replace it.


I haven't heard that " GM is working on a redesign".
I have seen a few fail which is why I mentioned it on page two ;)

anim8orCTSV
10-17-06, 11:49 AM
I haven't heard that " GM is working on a redesign".

No big surprise. They were probably just saying that.

-Paul
anim8orCTSV

ewill3rd
10-17-06, 12:35 PM
I have never understood why some dealers make up things like that.
It's like saying "yeah, we know it's crappy".
Why don't they just tell you it's broken and fix it?
If I actually knew of a redesign I would tell you I guess, but I'd have something to back me up.
Either way, good luck.

anim8orCTSV
10-18-06, 05:54 PM
Well, I picked up my V today and yes it is running perfectly.

It was the Support Bushing they replaced and the clunk and poor shifting is gone. Everything works perfectly.

Thanks for all the support guys.

-Paul
anim8orCTSV

1QUICKV
10-18-06, 07:21 PM
Did they check the bushing in the front of the rear differential?
I have seen a few of those fail causing a noise like you describe.

he did call it! but i replaced mine once myself and i added the pinion brace. its good.

ewill3rd
10-19-06, 08:37 AM
I am glad to hear they finally got it all fixed for you!
Hope it stays fixed for a long time to come!

Kadonny
10-19-06, 11:35 AM
Paul,

You are having some of the same issues I am having with my 9 month old 06 V.

The clunk thing is ridiculous. I cannot shift at all without some type of clunk, and a majority of the time I cannot even apply throttle after having my foot off the gas completely without a clunk. There is no doubt my car is not driving like it did when I first got it. Not to mention I have the whole oil consumption thing going on. One quart every 1000 miles or so....and this is the second engine in my car!

Let me know about the clunk, I am going to press my dealer also. I can lemon my car at any time now because it has been in the shop for 30 days total in my first 9 months of ownership and the PA law is 30 days in the first year.

It's just a shame, the car is so great but one cannot just hop in it for a drive with the family and have the experience enjoyable.

I really want to look at the STS-V and see how those cars are holding up.

Seriously, let me know how your clunk is handled.

anim8orCTSV
10-19-06, 12:41 PM
I am glad to hear they finally got it all fixed for you!
Hope it stays fixed for a long time to come!

ewill3rd, Thanks for the info. I was just about to bring this up to them when they had another V come in with the same problem. You nailed it.


Paul,
The clunk thing is ridiculous. I cannot shift at all without some type of clunk, and a majority of the time I cannot even apply throttle after having my foot off the gas completely without a clunk.

Kadonny,

It sounds like you are having the exact same problem I was.

I could not get a good shift out of her and even when I was not shifting it would still clunk.

Try this, get her up into third or fourth gear. Then, as if you are in traffic, let off the gas (without hitting the clutch - i.e. leave it in gear) then apply the gas (no need to gun it). Just act like you are following someone and you are not sure what they are going to do and let off the gas.

When I did that it would clunk when I reapplied the gas.

Also, sometimes when I pushed in the clutch it would clunk too.

If you can have them lift the car and get under there and push up on the front of the rear diff. If it moves up, then you have the same problem.

Good thing is, it only takes a day at the dealer to fix it.

-Paul
anim8orCTSV

Kadonny
10-19-06, 01:17 PM
Paul,

Same exact thing with the gas pedal. Clunk upon reengaging the gas, even if so very slightly and without touching the clutch.

What was the diagnosis on that? Support bushing of the rear diff or something?

Thanks bro.

anim8orCTSV
10-19-06, 01:22 PM
It was the Support Bushing.

They replaced it and now my V shifts like new.

-Paul
anim8orCTSV

anim8orCTSV
10-23-06, 02:46 AM
Just when I thought I was ok.

I got in my car Saturday and when it started my NAV screen says...

"Sevice Stability System"

ARGH!!!!

I call Onstar and ask them to do a diagnostic. They tell me that the error has to do with the Power Steering and that it needs to be checked within 7 days.

At least the car shifts smooth now.

-Paul

anim8orCTSV

ctsvett
10-23-06, 12:16 PM
your power steering sensor is out... common issue..

Reed

Silver Dollar
10-23-06, 12:42 PM
I hit the 8,000 mile mark this weekend. No clunking, grinding, drippiing or whining from the rear yet.

I'm sorry you fellas are having these problems and hope I don't end up joining the club of fustrated caddy owners anytime soon.

ewill3rd
10-23-06, 01:11 PM
It could probably be the Steering wheel position sensor.
I have seen a few cause that problem. It's intermittent and probably just a coincidence.
It's inside the car so it's doubtful what they did affected it.