: DEBATE RSA's vs F1's



ctsvflorida
08-29-06, 05:24 PM
I was getting new tires thru the goodyear warranty thing and in writing about run flats or non run flats, RSA's or F1's...etc. I opted to go for the non run flat GSD3's which are great. In some responses to the RSA's, people loved them and hated them! They're quieter and don't get caught in grooves as bad as the F1 runflats, seemed better in ride overall and people claimed they were a little softer in ride! WELL...here is what I have gathered in some research, by accident, by reading some road tests...on OUR CARS! For the people driving the car normally, like an STS driver, they're fine! But if you like some performance, just a little, then can the idea of RSA's and deal with the F1's bad ride and steers with grooves...etc! Even deal with the short tread life because here are some facts!

Test done with RSA's are:
1. stopping from 60-0 mph 123 feet
2. 0-60 mph 5.0 sec.
3. 1/4 mile 13.4 sec
4. Handling slalom test 64.3 mph average

Same tests with F1's:
1. stopping from 60-0 mph 114 feet!
2. 0-60 4.8 sec. is the worst I have found and read 4.6 sec. and 4.7 sec.
3. 1/4 mile 13.1 sec. and the F1's still spin of course, just not as bad
4. Handling slalom test 66.8 mph average

Long story short...performance wise, they don't compare too well!
So, all those sub par performance specs you people have seen on the V's (hinting towards the SRT'8 people) is merely because of the marble based tires which are like strapping pennies to all 4 paws of your dog, bringing him/her to an ice rink and saying..come on boy catch me if you can! Peace

Florian
08-29-06, 05:27 PM
they both suck...


F

ctsvflorida
08-29-06, 05:34 PM
they both suck...


F

:yeah: But, for the people who will not get rid of the run flat...I say boo to the RSA's!

Florian, you do put some miles on your V, ay?! Keep drivin buddy!

Rich H
08-29-06, 10:18 PM
For those of us who have driven F1s in the snow, the choice isn't so obvious. RSAs are acceptable. F1s are plain dangerous. So if you do all of your driving in Florida and want all out performance, by all means use the F1s. If you live up north and want to drive year round and don't want to change tires every season, the RSAs are not a bad all-season choice.

Also, be very careful about comparing test results on tires. If the results are from different sources then I would not compare the absolute numbers since drivers, road conditions, and test protocol vary significantly. I know first hand that F1s perform fantastic in dry, warm conditions because of their soft tread (I have burned through two sets already), but when the temperature drops and the snow flies the F1s suck.

Florian
08-30-06, 12:24 AM
For those of us who have driven F1s in the snow, the choice isn't so obvious. RSAs are acceptable. F1s are plain dangerous. So if you do all of your driving in Florida and want all out performance, by all means use the F1s. If you live up north and want to drive year round and don't want to change tires every season, the RSAs are not a bad all-season choice.

Also, be very careful about comparing test results on tires. If the results are from different sources then I would not compare the absolute numbers since drivers, road conditions, and test protocol vary significantly. I know first hand that F1s perform fantastic in dry, warm conditions because of their soft tread (I have burned through two sets already), but when the temperature drops and the snow flies the F1s suck.

I drove the F1s my first winter, the whole winter. You really had to stay ahead of the car to make it work...finally went to Avons the next winter....


F

GAGS-V
08-30-06, 12:52 AM
I don't think I drive mine like an STS driver. I prefer the RSA-EMT's for some of the very reasons you mentioned. The ride is a bit softer, the road noise a little less, stays out of the grooves a little better, and the wear so far seems to be much better. I really don't care what my 1/4 mile or even 0-60 time is, it is plenty fast for the street the way it is, and to me, these tires make the car just that much more fun for being a daily driver. The plus side is, all of the above and no jack needed as would be required with your gsd3's!

ctsvflorida
08-30-06, 09:21 AM
I don't think I drive mine like an STS driver. I prefer the RSA-EMT's for some of the very reasons you mentioned. The ride is a bit softer, the road noise a little less, stays out of the grooves a little better, and the wear so far seems to be much better. I really don't care what my 1/4 mile or even 0-60 time is, it is plenty fast for the street the way it is, and to me, these tires make the car just that much more fun for being a daily driver. The plus side is, all of the above and no jack needed as would be required with your gsd3's!

Cans of fix-a-flat in the trunk avoid all the jack and spare stuff! Fix-a-flat works fine and when you make it to the tire place as shortly as you will need to with the run flats, it will not ruin your tire, as the tire people will tell you to sell you a new tire!

NIK
08-30-06, 11:30 AM
For those of us who have driven F1s in the snow, the choice isn't so obvious. RSAs are acceptable. F1s are plain dangerous. So if you do all of your driving in Florida and want all out performance, by all means use the F1s. If you live up north and want to drive year round and don't want to change tires every season, the RSAs are not a bad all-season choice.

Also, be very careful about comparing test results on tires. If the results are from different sources then I would not compare the absolute numbers since drivers, road conditions, and test protocol vary significantly. I know first hand that F1s perform fantastic in dry, warm conditions because of their soft tread (I have burned through two sets already), but when the temperature drops and the snow flies the F1s suck.

AMEN, BROTHER!

CIWS
08-30-06, 01:39 PM
Cans of fix-a-flat in the trunk avoid all the jack and spare stuff! Fix-a-flat works fine and when you make it to the tire place as shortly as you will need to with the run flats, it will not ruin your tire, as the tire people will tell you to sell you a new tire!

However there is the chance the "fix-a-flat" will ruin the Tire pressure sensor, so get a couple for spares :)

RedGalant2k1
08-30-06, 02:48 PM
Cans of fix-a-flat in the trunk avoid all the jack and spare stuff! Fix-a-flat works fine and when you make it to the tire place as shortly as you will need to with the run flats, it will not ruin your tire, as the tire people will tell you to sell you a new tire!

Fix-A-Flat is dangerous stuff. I would highly recommend against using it. Its toxic chemicals and how people are told to basically use the entire can in your tire, its bad.

I've seen to many wheels and tires destroyed because Fix-A-Flat was in there too long. Now if its a very short period of time fix a flat can possibly be cleaned out and the tire repaired, but thats not usually the case for the types of people that use fix-a-flat in their tires.

If its your only solution and you end up using it, than get it out ASAP.

RedGalant2k1
08-30-06, 02:52 PM
However there is the chance the "fix-a-flat" will ruin the Tire pressure sensor, so get a couple for spares :)

Not a 'chance' it destroys sensors too. I just had to replace two sensors in a Cadillac because of Fix-A-Flat. I wish I kept them, I could have taken pictures to show you guys what happens to them.

Avoid using Fix-a-flat as best you can.

Silver Dollar
08-30-06, 03:12 PM
Were you beaten with a can of Fix-a-Flat as a child?

RedGalant2k1
08-30-06, 03:19 PM
Were you beaten with a can of Fix-a-Flat as a child?

No. I've just seen what it does to wheels, tires, and tire pressure sensors first hand, many times.

CIWS
08-30-06, 03:37 PM
Not a 'chance' it destroys sensors too.

So a 95% chance ? Possibly 99% ?
Some folks have used it and claimed their TPS survived after they cleaned it and the tire out in a short period of time after use. So I hesitate to say it Will frack the TPS, although chances are it will. But then again even at 99% there is still a 1% chance it won't. :D

CIWS
08-30-06, 03:38 PM
Were you beaten with a can of Fix-a-Flat as a child?

It was probably the old Fix-A-Flat in the Jock Strap trick ;)

urbanski
08-30-06, 03:39 PM
Were you beaten with a can of Fix-a-Flat as a child?

best post of the day award

RedGalant2k1
08-30-06, 04:09 PM
So a 95% chance ? Possibly 99% ?
Some folks have used it and claimed their TPS survived after they cleaned it and the tire out in a short period of time after use. So I hesitate to say it Will frack the TPS, although chances are it will. But then again even at 99% there is still a 1% chance it won't. :D

100% if fix-a-flat is left too long. By too long I mean more than 48 hours.

ctsvflorida
08-30-06, 07:08 PM
100% if fix-a-flat is left too long. By too long I mean more than 48 hours.

I used it for under 24hrs. and the TPS is fine, so this makes sense! My statement was to only get to the tire shop, just as you would with a runflat!

CIWS
08-30-06, 07:33 PM
I used it for under 24hrs. and the TPS is fine, so this makes sense! My statement was to only get to the tire shop, just as you would with a runflat!

So does that make it a 50% chance in 24 hours ? http://www.ciws.net/ctsv/happyhappy.gif




;)

ctsvflorida
08-30-06, 07:40 PM
So does that make it a 50% chance in 24 hours ? http://www.ciws.net/ctsv/happyhappy.gif




;)

I have two spare sensors so I don't even care but it did survive the first can and flat! That's another thing! If you do go to non runflats, just figure on getting a flat with in 3k miles like I did! I went 12k on runflats with no flat ever and then...you know the rest! Unbelievable! I had to buy a new tire too because I am not going 150mph with a patch!

RedGalant2k1
08-30-06, 09:12 PM
I have two spare sensors so I don't even care but it did survive the first can and flat! That's another thing! If you do go to non runflats, just figure on getting a flat with in 3k miles like I did! I went 12k on runflats with no flat ever and then...you know the rest! Unbelievable! I had to buy a new tire too because I am not going 150mph with a patch!

A tire fixed by a patch on the interior of the tire is a fix for the life of the tire, minded its not ground to the steel cord or casing inside the tire (which is rare).

A patch is affixed to a tire using vulcanizing rubber compound then the patch is applied, and finally a coating of rubber sealant. Now I should mention after a tire has been fixed its not considered performance rated as a CTS-V tires would be anymore. But thats logical since when a tire is punctured the steel cord and casing has been damaged.

Again, however a patch is a permenent fix that will last the life of the tire when done properly.

ctsvflorida
08-30-06, 09:37 PM
A tire fixed by a patch on the interior of the tire is a fix for the life of the tire, minded its not ground to the steel cord or casing inside the tire (which is rare).

A patch is affixed to a tire using vulcanizing rubber compound then the patch is applied, and finally a coating of rubber sealant. Now I should mention after a tire has been fixed its not considered performance rated as a CTS-V tires would be anymore. But thats logical since when a tire is punctured the steel cord and casing has been damaged.

Again, however a patch is a permenent fix that will last the life of the tire when done properly.

As I said, I will not go 150mph+ on a patch! If you would like to buy the patched 275 18 GSD'3 with 2k miles on it, all highway, then I will sell it! It did hold air fine for the 2 days I had to wait for the tire!