: A Quality Vehicle???



Ralph
01-26-04, 03:10 AM
I am curious as to what your priorities are in a vehicle that is hopefully "high quality." What are your concerns for "down the road quality?" ie. Your major areas of concern. What is the worst repair you ever had to perform on any of your past or present vehicles.

My top concerns would be :

1. A dash that does not rattle. :D
2. Reliable electronics
3. Safety rating.
4. air shocks that don't leak

My worst and most expensive repair would be when I had my 1991 Mercury Grand Marquis, and the pcv valve froze up, cost me 4 oil seals and $1,200 dollars!! $200 parts, the rest labor! :mad:

Ralph
01-26-04, 03:40 PM
Oh ya, I also don't think it's far fetched that Cadillac has equal or better than quality compared to German or Japanese vehicles because GM employs many German and Japanese engineers, etc. There may be aspects of a vehicle where Cadillac builds better, and other areas, worse. IMO. It seems like such an integrated market now, what's the difference!?

Elvis
01-26-04, 04:50 PM
Aside from collision damage repairs, the worst repair I can remember was replacing the CV joints in my '90 Acura Legend. Total cost was only about $500, but I had to take the car in three times. Once for the right side, once for the left, and then it turned out they messed up the boot or something on the right side and I had to go back to get that fixed at no charge.

I've always had relatively new cars. I put 93,000 miles on that Acura. It was a great car. Never any major concerns.

I think that the key to down the road quality is prevention. The dealerships need to establish a service relationship with the customer. The maintenance schedule should be clear-cut and reminders should be sent out. It's easy after a couple of visits for a dealer to estimate mileage on a customer's car and notify them accordingly.

A plush waiting room would be nice, as well. Someplace where you could go and get some work done while you're waiting on your car. Put in a half-dozen telephones, high-speed internet connections, plasma TV, overstuffed leather couches, free coffee and danish, etc. You need to make the service experience pleasurable.

Ralph
01-27-04, 02:56 AM
Aside from collision damage repairs, the worst repair I can remember was replacing the CV joints in my '90 Acura Legend. Total cost was only about $500, but I had to take the car in three times. Once for the right side, once for the left, and then it turned out they messed up the boot or something on the right side and I had to go back to get that fixed at no charge.

I've always had relatively new cars. I put 93,000 miles on that Acura. It was a great car. Never any major concerns.

I think that the key to down the road quality is prevention. The dealerships need to establish a service relationship with the customer. The maintenance schedule should be clear-cut and reminders should be sent out. It's easy after a couple of visits for a dealer to estimate mileage on a customer's car and notify them accordingly.

A plush waiting room would be nice, as well. Someplace where you could go and get some work done while you're waiting on your car. Put in a half-dozen telephones, high-speed internet connections, plasma TV, overstuffed leather couches, free coffee and danish, etc. You need to make the service experience pleasurable.

What!! A Japanese car that actually broke down!!?? Where, when!!?? LOL!

Those Ledgends were nice cars. I see them at dealerships for around $10,000.
The weak spot of any FWD vehicle seems to be the cv boots. If they break, crack or leak then it's joint time! Which is probably something you don't really have to worry about in a warmer climate IMO. I am assuming they ruptured, the fluid leaked out, and you started to hear a humming sound? They say it's good to look at them every time you get an oil change. Look for fluid or shiny areas running down the inside of your front tires. This is why I cannot figure out why my Caddy has grease nipples in the rear! :cookoo: In the front, yes, but the back wheels are just along for the ride. Oh well, whatever...

I actually am paranoid enough where I like to be right there in the service bay watching what they are fixing. I imagine in the U.S. there are liability issues if one gets injured or a car falls off the hoist and on your foot. :eek:

Caddy Man
01-27-04, 01:47 PM
as much as i love cadillacs...i can see many quailty issues in these cars. for examle the back deck where my subwoofer is located vibrates like crazy and it dosnt seem to go away. when i play certain songs by door locks vibrate slightly. my dad drive a 1998 Mercedes S320 and that car is as solid as any car can be. 6 years later and taht car has not one squeak or rattle ANYWHERE. im a fan of cadillacs but we alll need to face the truth, the build quailty is not as impressive as japanese or german cars.

Ralph
01-27-04, 06:15 PM
as much as i love cadillacs...i can see many quailty issues in these cars. for examle the back deck where my subwoofer is located vibrates like crazy and it dosnt seem to go away. when i play certain songs by door locks vibrate slightly. my dad drive a 1998 Mercedes S320 and that car is as solid as any car can be. 6 years later and taht car has not one squeak or rattle ANYWHERE. im a fan of cadillacs but we alll need to face the truth, the build quailty is not as impressive as japanese or german cars.

Is that a factory mounted sub-woofer? If it isn't then you can't blame GM? How about fabricating arubber mounting gasket or something to take the vibration away for the sub? It's probably a simple fix. Put enough bass through anyspeaker and things will vibrate.

Caddy Man
01-27-04, 10:10 PM
Is that a factory mounted sub-woofer? If it isn't then you can't blame GM? How about fabricating arubber mounting gasket or something to take the vibration away for the sub? It's probably a simple fix. Put enough bass through anyspeaker and things will vibrate.
yah its the factory mounted 8 inch sub. i kno its a simple fix...but what im sayin is i SHOULDNT have to get it fixed...it should be vibrating anyways. i had them put dynamat in the back...they told me the whole problem is the entire back deck itself is moving. dont get me wrong i love my dts, but u can tell the plastics and things arent on par with some of the better cars out there.

Ralph
01-27-04, 10:26 PM
yah its the factory mounted 8 inch sub. i kno its a simple fix...but what im sayin is i SHOULDNT have to get it fixed...it should be vibrating anyways. i had them put dynamat in the back...they told me the whole problem is the entire back deck itself is moving. dont get me wrong i love my dts, but u can tell the plastics and things arent on par with some of the better cars out there.

What's Dynamat? Could it be a screw loose? In general, I think there is too much plastic on all new cars because they do it to save money. If the entire back deck is moving, I would go to the Caddy dealer and complain! I suppose you warrenty is over? I would go anyway and talk to them.

Don't kid yourself, Benz and Beamers have their fair share of trouble, even when new! There are many recalls that go unnoticed. My dad has had such good luck with all his cars, and all he buys are GM.

Caddy Man
01-28-04, 12:00 PM
What's Dynamat? Could it be a screw loose? In general, I think there is too much plastic on all new cars because they do it to save money. If the entire back deck is moving, I would go to the Caddy dealer and complain! I suppose you warrenty is over? I would go anyway and talk to them.

Don't kid yourself, Benz and Beamers have their fair share of trouble, even when new! There are many recalls that go unnoticed. My dad has had such good luck with all his cars, and all he buys are GM.
dynamat is this shit audio shops use to lessen vibration and metal flexing. but i think what i will do is go ahead and try to put a layer of thin foam btwn teh back deck and the metal fram underneath so even if it does move, it wont rattle. my warranty is over april 1st of this year, but everytime i take it to the dealer they say they fixed it but it aint fixed. once they prelaces the bose amp, then the subwoofer. and yah ure right not all benzes or bmw are great. i remebr i drove a 2002 e class (the year before they changed it to the new dsign) and that car was seriosuly a piece of crap. the doors were so thin on it,..the wood looked totally fake..overall it just looked like a cheap tin can car. i was just sayin how the 98 s classes are some of the most solid cars ive ever driven. :D

Ralph
01-29-04, 02:03 AM
dynamat is this crap audio shops use to lessen vibration and metal flexing. but i think what i will do is go ahead and try to put a layer of thin foam btwn teh back deck and the metal fram underneath so even if it does move, it wont rattle. my warranty is over april 1st of this year, but everytime i take it to the dealer they say they fixed it but it aint fixed. once they prelaces the bose amp, then the subwoofer. and yah ure right not all benzes or bmw are great. i remebr i drove a 2002 e class (the year before they changed it to the new dsign) and that car was seriosuly a piece of crap. the doors were so thin on it,..the wood looked totally fake..overall it just looked like a cheap tin can car. i was just sayin how the 98 s classes are some of the most solid cars ive ever driven. :D

I really think you should tell GM about the attitude of your dealer regarding something that should be fixed! There is no excuse for their lack of action IMO! I mean, if more dealerships are lazy like this, then eventually people will stop buying Cadillacs and get a Benz or ? I would actually go and talk to the manager and ask them again to fix the vibration, if he refuses, threaten him with a letter to GM with his name on it!! That should straighten him out. This kind of thing upsets me.

I hear what you are saying about the 1998 or so Benz. Apparently they were better quality than the current crop of Benz offerings. Are you aware of the current JD Power quality ratings mentioned on this Forum? Caddy is #2, Benz is 12 I believe. Supposedly Benz invested millions getting Chrysler up to quality specs, so they had to get the money from somewhere, guess where. Mercedes.

I had to drive my parents to another city last year and I made my dad take a look at the new 2003 Mercedes Benz cars. He is a man who will always drive an American car until the day he dies! Well, a beautiful light blue S-class caught my eye (not the one with the larger wheelbase), price in Cdn. dollars=99,000!! The dealer came out with the key for that particular model we were looking at, and he had to admit it was a real nice car "for a millionairre!" I thought that was funny because that S-class was only $30,000 more than the DTS he had just bought a few months earlier! It was certainly a nice car, but the S looks so much like an E-class. The E-class up here costs exactly as much as a new DTS, $70,000! But seriously, IMO, I couldn't justify spending that extra 30,000 dollars if the current quality rating is better for GM.

Caddy Man
01-29-04, 10:11 PM
i agree benz has gone down a lot in quailty...ive driven some of the newer ones and honestly im not feeling them at all. iw ill take my car back to the dealer. they think im some young kid that listened to loud music and thats why it vibrates...but thats not the case. the vibration happens when the volmume is low to mid level. I have never heard of any elses DTS doin this. I have no idea what is wrong with it. but i will take it back for sure to teh dealer well before my warranty is up.

Elvis
01-29-04, 11:22 PM
What!! A Japanese car that actually broke down!!?? Where, when!!?? LOL!

Those Ledgends were nice cars. I see them at dealerships for around $10,000.
The weak spot of any FWD vehicle seems to be the cv boots. If they break, crack or leak then it's joint time! Which is probably something you don't really have to worry about in a warmer climate IMO. I am assuming they ruptured, the fluid leaked out, and you started to hear a humming sound? They say it's good to look at them every time you get an oil change. Look for fluid or shiny areas running down the inside of your front tires. This is why I cannot figure out why my Caddy has grease nipples in the rear! :cookoo: In the front, yes, but the back wheels are just along for the ride. Oh well, whatever...

I actually am paranoid enough where I like to be right there in the service bay watching what they are fixing. I imagine in the U.S. there are liability issues if one gets injured or a car falls off the hoist and on your foot. :eek:

No, it was the familiar "clack clack clack" noise when I was making turns and accelerating. First one joint went, then about 5,000 miles later the other one went.

Ralph
01-30-04, 02:06 AM
i agree benz has gone down a lot in quailty...ive driven some of the newer ones and honestly im not feeling them at all. iw ill take my car back to the dealer. they think im some young kid that listened to loud music and thats why it vibrates...but thats not the case. the vibration happens when the volmume is low to mid level. I have never heard of any elses DTS doin this. I have no idea what is wrong with it. but i will take it back for sure to teh dealer well before my warranty is up.

LOL, I take it you are in your 20's then. Does Motor City have another dealership you can go to?

Ralph
01-30-04, 02:13 AM
No, it was the familiar "clack clack clack" noise when I was making turns and accelerating. First one joint went, then about 5,000 miles later the other one went.

Sounds like what happened to me back in '90! It made some noise, some slipping, but only on one side it seemed. Anyway, other than cracking and leaks, what happened was the little drive shaft that the boots are mounted on slipped out of the transmission when some bearings or ? wore out. To make it worse, I was 400 kms from home on the highway when I noticed a burning smell. Turned out to be tranny fluid that ran the entire length of the underside of the Pontiac and was frying on the exhaust pipe. (because of high speed) Maybe Stone Age is right about heat effecting them more, because it was hot that summer!

Caddy Man
01-30-04, 04:10 AM
LOL, I take it you are in your 20's then. Does Motor City have another dealership you can go to?
ive been to 2 dealerships already. im gonna go try don massey in plymouth though. i mean the service is fine at the dealerships like ive been to two differnt ones before and they always get right on it and are nice as hell. but when its dealin with this, it just never seems to get fixed. im starting to get really frustarted you kno? once they even replaced the bose amp and once they also replaced the subwoofer itself. but i kno those arent the problems. the thing is it happens on certian songs at certain volumes so its hard to spot.

Ralph
01-30-04, 04:25 AM
ive been to 2 dealerships already. im gonna go try don massey in plymouth though. i mean the service is fine at the dealerships like ive been to two differnt ones before and they always get right on it and are nice as hell. but when its dealin with this, it just never seems to get fixed. im starting to get really frustarted you kno? once they even replaced the bose amp and once they also replaced the subwoofer itself. but i kno those arent the problems. the thing is it happens on certian songs at certain volumes so its hard to spot.

I hear ya Dude! I know all too well the frustration you describe. Two weeks after I took delivery of my car almost a year ago, the radio dies! The mileage of this car is listed below! You see, it was a circut in the mother board of the electronics that was NEVER good from the factory. When my dad owned the car, he just never played the tape, EVER! Only the radio, occasonally. He didn't think anything of it because he had the radio replaced under warrenty when it was new and thought it was fixed, NOT! I knew something was up when the clock never kept good time. Bottom line, cost me $355 dollars and 2 trips and time off work to get it fixed properly, which should have been fixed the first time, but wasn't. (they charged me twice!) My dad was upset enough that he sent a letter to Detroit about this as it never should have happened.

C'mon, your dad MUST have had to get something repaired on that Benz, fess up!! I am starting to get a little insecure here, Dang it!! :cookoo: :crying:

Moral of the story, drive a vehicle, get to know if there are any flaws, test every button, every option while it is under warrenty because after that, be nice and gentle with it. :yup:

Caddy Man
01-31-04, 02:52 PM
haha yah i mean the car has been in for servicing, nothin major though. actualyl now that i think about...right by the right side view mirror a small rust spot started and the paint had a little bubble in it!!!! the car has been garaged since new. and get a wash frequently. i kno he was pretty pissed about that. it was a tiny spot...but we have NEVER had a car rust on it. anyways yah so he got that little section repainted. i was meaning more quailty of the fit and finish of the interior. i dont hear one rattle or anything anywhere. nothin loose at all. but i totally agree with what u said about testign everythign with the car under warranty. thats defintly the way to go. yah i mean i had a freind listen to it and he laughed cuz to him it was just a little rattle (he has a 15 inch subwoofer in his car, so it rattles a lot anyways) but i love my bose system. at loud volumes the sound cancels out the rattle and u cant hear it but its very noticable at low volumes...when i have a car i examine every sqeeak and rattle. lol...but yah i'll be taking a trip to the dealer in a week or two see what they can do. i hope that by putting dynamat on the deck i didnt void the warranty...dynamat is a thin moldable thing that redudeces flexing of the metal.

Ralph
02-01-04, 04:19 AM
haha yah i mean the car has been in for servicing, nothin major though. actualyl now that i think about...right by the right side view mirror a small rust spot started and the paint had a little bubble in it!!!! the car has been garaged since new. and get a wash frequently. i kno he was pretty pissed about that. it was a tiny spot...but we have NEVER had a car rust on it. anyways yah so he got that little section repainted. i was meaning more quailty of the fit and finish of the interior. i dont hear one rattle or anything anywhere. nothin loose at all. but i totally agree with what u said about testign everythign with the car under warranty. thats defintly the way to go. yah i mean i had a freind listen to it and he laughed cuz to him it was just a little rattle (he has a 15 inch subwoofer in his car, so it rattles a lot anyways) but i love my bose system. at loud volumes the sound cancels out the rattle and u cant hear it but its very noticable at low volumes...when i have a car i examine every sqeeak and rattle. lol...but yah i'll be taking a trip to the dealer in a week or two see what they can do. i hope that by putting dynamat on the deck i didnt void the warranty...dynamat is a thin moldable thing that redudeces flexing of the metal.


How do you feel BMW compares to Mercedes Benz, or Lexus for that matter? I take it you dad will always buy a Benz, just like mine will only have Cadillacs. Brand loyality, it's something you can't take away from someone, just like a political opinion. :nono:

Caddy Man
02-01-04, 01:18 PM
How do you feel BMW compares to Mercedes Benz, or Lexus for that matter? I take it you dad will always buy a Benz, just like mine will only have Cadillacs. Brand loyality, it's something you can't take away from someone, just like a political opinion. :nono:
honestly i cant really judge bmw since ive never really had a chance to drive one, if i get aq change to ever own one, i probably would consider buying one. your right out of the top cars, my dad will always pick a benz over anything else (he still thinks my DTS is one of the best looking cars on the road) . no matter what cars i own in the future, I always intend to have one cadillac in my garage at all times lol. lexus i think is at the top of thier game...the fit and finish is just beautiful, not to mention the ride quailty and the mark levinson sound system they have. but for some reason at the same time i would never consider buying a lexus, to me there jsut seems to be better offerings out there as far as design goes (i'd take an XLR before a lexus SC 430 ANYDAY). i guess history goes a long way for me...benz, bmw, cadillac have such a long lineage of innovation and beautiful cars, so much history and tradition behind the name. i dont kno abut you, but that does play a role for me. the one thing i dont like about lexus, (but it could be a good thing depending on how tyou look at it) is the soft ride, sometimes the ride is a little too soft and u feel detached from the road. plus i love the high reving sounds that the benz, bmw, and cadillac engines have. ure thoughts?

Ralph
02-03-04, 01:39 AM
honestly i cant really judge bmw since ive never really had a chance to drive one, if i get aq change to ever own one, i probably would consider buying one. your right out of the top cars, my dad will always pick a benz over anything else (he still thinks my DTS is one of the best looking cars on the road) . no matter what cars i own in the future, I always intend to have one cadillac in my garage at all times lol. lexus i think is at the top of thier game...the fit and finish is just beautiful, not to mention the ride quailty and the mark levinson sound system they have. but for some reason at the same time i would never consider buying a lexus, to me there jsut seems to be better offerings out there as far as design goes (i'd take an XLR before a lexus SC 430 ANYDAY). i guess history goes a long way for me...benz, bmw, cadillac have such a long lineage of innovation and beautiful cars, so much history and tradition behind the name. i dont kno abut you, but that does play a role for me. the one thing i dont like about lexus, (but it could be a good thing depending on how tyou look at it) is the soft ride, sometimes the ride is a little too soft and u feel detached from the road. plus i love the high reving sounds that the benz, bmw, and cadillac engines have. ure thoughts?

If I had to choose I would take a new Acura over a Lexus, they have a new sound system put in them that apparently was designed for use in a recording studio! I don't know if will ever buy a Japanese or other foreign car. True, living in Canada, it must sound strange to hear me refer to Cadillac as a domestic, but that's just how I view it because I grew up in the 1970's, and all you saw, or could really get were American cars. I basically grew up in my Dad's Gulf service station, and I think the only foreign cars I saw in that small town were MG Midgets, Morris Minis. I honestly don't ever recall a Toyota, Honda or a Benz. Oh, my dad's friend ( a lawyer) had a Volvo and a heck of a time getting parts for it! I remember the MG parts had to be ordered from England, took about a month to come, and there were a couple unhappy MG owners at that time. History goes a long way for me as well. I like the idea that Cadillac has been around for 102 years, and I suppose Ford loyalists would feel something similar. Cadillac seems fancy enough for me right now, and it's not like I could afford the (probably) more expensive parts for a Benz or BMW. I phoned our local Caddy dealership today, and the current labour rate for servicing is $72.50 per hour!!! Geez, I may as well drive a Ferrari! ;)

Caddy Man
02-03-04, 12:20 PM
i never really looked at acura before, but i really really like them. the new tl is just great. comes with like an 7 inch nav screen standard, it plays dvd audio discs, get this: the cars airconditioning system knows which way the sun is comin in through the windows and adjusts the air conditiong based on that! the car is also blutooth capable, so u can wirelessly hook up ure fone or whatever to the car. and the price is half of what u would pay for an s class or any of the top cars. i think acura is putin out some great cars.

Ralph
02-04-04, 02:28 AM
i never really looked at acura before, but i really really like them. the new tl is just great. comes with like an 7 inch nav screen standard, it plays dvd audio discs, get this: the cars airconditioning system knows which way the sun is comin in through the windows and adjusts the air conditiong based on that! the car is also blutooth capable, so u can wirelessly hook up ure fone or whatever to the car. and the price is half of what u would pay for an s class or any of the top cars. i think acura is putin out some great cars.

If I'm not mistaken, I think my Caddy has that sun sensor as well, prob. yours too. I know there are two sensors on the dash, one for the twillight sentinel to turn on the lights when it gets darker out, and the other is for the climate. The climate sensor looks like a little, dark dome on the pass, side of the dash next to the speaker. I've heard about the so-called Bluetooth, is this something unique to Acura? I think the design of the new TL is really amazing, but I might feel guilty if I buy one! At $41,000 Cdn. I won't be buying one soon anyway!

Caddy Man
02-04-04, 01:08 PM
bluetooth is not just to acura, although i think they are one of teh first crs to utilize it. not every cell phone is buletooth capable either, my freind had a fone from T-Mobile and it was bluetooth capable. i think soon they are goin to start puttin them in all cars. just this acura is the first one ive heard of with it.